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Old 7th October 2018, 11:12   #31
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Default re: The Missiles of India. EDIT: A-SAT update on page 6

Moderator Note: No more off-topic discussions please. This thread will remain open & continue. If you have any suggestions, please use the 'reporting' functionality.

Thanks for sharing, V.Narayan! There is no thread of yours that I don't learn something new from, be it on defence or even your ownership reports .
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Old 7th October 2018, 12:21   #32
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Default re: The Missiles of India. EDIT: A-SAT update on page 6

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However, I do worry sometimes that "car enthusiast" ISI agents might be watching Narayan's threads. But after I heard that RAW has recruited "Tiger", I sleep well.
ROFL Made my day

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Brahmos has been basically developed from Yakhont missile. Reason why India didn't get the 800 km variant is because of something called MTCR (Missile Technology Control Regime) that bans the export of missiles with a range greater than 300 km.
The actual name is Oniks, Yakhont is the name of the export version. The range of the Brahmos was an enigma from the beginning. As part of the associated folklore, it seems the range was deliberately curtailed to some measly 290 km as a run up to the process of India signing the MTCR which we did in 2016. There is no range restriction now and the actual range is 600+ and beyond. We may never know for sure guess this suits the tag of the fastest cruise missile in the world in a better way now.

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Do they have to return to a base of some sort where new missiles are loaded or can they be equipped right there on the battlefield itself?
Almost all of the artillery regiments / batteries have a dedicated replenishment component that move along which is what gives them a high degree of mobility to these systems. Since Pinaka has already been mentioned in this thread to take it as an example, the entire salvo of rockets in a Pinaka battery (6 launchers x 2 rocket pods x 6 rockets each) can be fired in just 44 seconds. The reload time of is an awesome 4 mins. There is an equivalent number of loader replenishment, replenishment vehicles which makes the tasks easy.

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Historical Photo below of SLV-3 - first successful launch 1980. It took us 25 years to get to this point. This launch was the birth of our modern missile programme. 14 years later Prithvi-I was in service. Jai Hind
Posting some other images as well. Hats-off and salute to the visionary individuals who made it possible for our space / missile program to be in the current state as it is today. Jai Hind

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Source: https://www.thebetterindia.com/74283...i-abdul-kalam/

*** Request Mods to merge my posts.
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Old 7th October 2018, 12:50   #33
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Default re: The Missiles of India. EDIT: A-SAT update on page 6

There is an American defence related website called NationalInterest.org that I follow. Here is their review of Brahmos:

- BrahMos cruise missile is stealthy, fast and extremely difficult to shoot down by aircraft or surface to air missiles.
- BrahMos performs an evasive “S-maneuver” shortly before impact, making it difficult to shoot down at close range by Gattling-type guns (CIWS)
- Enemy ship (even if assisted by AWACS) has only a thirty second time window to respond because of Brahmos' low observability and speed
- New Brahmos Block III missiles are designed to steep dive at seventy-degree angles to hit targets on the rear slopes of mountains. This is useful in the heavily militarized Himalayan border with China.
- Scramjet-powered hypersonic BrahMos II missile capable of Mach 7 speeds is under development

Source:
https://nationalinterest.org/blog/th...a-thanks-20013


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Since Pinaka has already been mentioned in this thread to take it as an example, the entire salvo of rockets in a Pinaka battery (6 launchers x 2 rocket pods x 6 rockets each) can be fired in just 44 seconds.
Yeah, that's why rocket artillery like Pinaka is suitable for clearing out enemy troop or military vehicles concentration. But it is not suitable for pinning down the enemy - for that you need traditional gun artillery support (Eg: Bofors)

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Originally Posted by V.Narayan View Post
While not strictly a guided missile the Pinaka rocket deserves a mention here as one of the successful weapons developed by DRDO. .
There was some news about development of "guided pinaka" rocket (aka missile).
https://www.hindustantimes.com/india...WUosufFMN.html
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Old 7th October 2018, 13:05   #34
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Default re: The Missiles of India. EDIT: A-SAT update on page 6

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Unlikely it will ever be inducted by Russians because they have this - supersonic cruise missile with 800 km range.
Yes, but it is significantly more expensive.

Would be at ease if I knew that the Russians are also using it.

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Old 7th October 2018, 15:26   #35
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Default re: The Missiles of India. EDIT: A-SAT update on page 6

A very informative thread indeed. These are the kinds of threads that keep this forum alive!

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Mods, request you to pls close and delete this thread. I don't think it is appropriate to discuss defence related stuff in a public forum.

http://www.indiandefencereview.com/n...ower-and-reach

An authoritative magazine started and run by former senior officers of the Indian Army. It discusses threadbare every defence related matter of the country.

Hardware is just one component of the tactics planned. It is like chess. Both the players know the strength of the different pieces but how they are deployed decides who wins.
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Old 7th October 2018, 22:51   #36
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Default re: The Missiles of India. EDIT: A-SAT update on page 6

Dear V.Narayan,

Many thanks for enlightening us here on Team BHP on this important subject that gets inadequate attention and poor reporting in the media most of the time.

You have rightly mentioned that the S400 Triumf Missile System that Russia has offered India, is the most advanced and potent system of its kind in the world.

I would like to know how is it that Russia, which has a much smaller economy and industrial footprint than the famed American Military Industrial Complex, able to develop such advanced versions of armaments, missiles & Fighter Aircrafts with sophisticated engines, aerodynamics and complex avionics. What are the lessons that India can draw from this as we are also faced with a larger neighbour in terms of China with much larger budgets and manufacturing and research capabilities.

Perhaps you could share your opinion on the above.

Thanks once again for your informative thread.

Anuj
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Old 7th October 2018, 23:42   #37
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Default re: The Missiles of India. EDIT: A-SAT update on page 6

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Originally Posted by AAD View Post
I would like to know how is it that Russia, which has a much smaller economy and industrial footprint than the famed American Military Industrial Complex, able to develop such advanced versions of armaments, missiles & Fighter Aircrafts with sophisticated engines, aerodynamics and complex avionics. What are the lessons that India can draw from this as we are also faced with a larger neighbour in terms of China with much larger budgets and manufacturing and research capabilities.
Russia is still a top dog when it comes to certain scientific fields like Nuclear, Defence and Space. We all know who was the first man to travel into space right? But yeah, they still can't make a proper passenger car for some reason

Among other things:

1) Almaz Antey, the maker of S-400 is 100% focused on air defence systems. They clocked $7 billion in revenues last year.
http://www.almaz-antey.ru/en/

2) Since Russia has a smaller economy, they mostly concentrated on developing asymmetric warfare capabilities. While US had an armada of aircraft carriers and ships, USSR maintained a large submarine fleet and developed supersonic anti-ship cruise missiles.

3) Another example is in the field of stealth aircraft and stealth bombers. Since it was impossible for USSR/Russia to match USA's spending power on stealth R&D, they went the other way to figure out how to nullify USA's stealth advantage - by developing SAM systems like S-300 and S-400.

Also, it is much cheaper to deploy SAM systems than maintain a fleet of 2000 fighter aircraft (size of US Air Force)

Last edited by SmartCat : 7th October 2018 at 23:49.
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Old 8th October 2018, 07:02   #38
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Default re: The Missiles of India. EDIT: A-SAT update on page 6

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Hardware is just one component of the tactics planned. It is like chess. Both the players know the strength of the different pieces but how they are deployed decides who wins.
Very well put.

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Originally Posted by AAD View Post
I would like to know how is it that Russia, which has a much smaller economy and industrial footprint than the famed American Military Industrial Complex, able to develop such advanced versions of armaments, missiles & Fighter Aircrafts with sophisticated engines, aerodynamics and complex avionics. What are the lessons that India can draw from this as we are also faced with a larger neighbour in terms of China with much larger budgets and manufacturing and research capabilities.
Thank you for reading the article and for your question. Weapon technology and the industrial base to build the weapons takes 50 to 75 years to build. Russia was, as we know one of the two military super powers till 1990. It may have been a little behind the Americans in sheer technology but was at par or ahead of them in innovation and imaginative solutions. That competence they have retained and designing and selling military equipment is a core part of their economy. In WW2 the Russian military effort and size (other than Naval forces) was roughly equal to what the USA put forth. During the cold war Russia (or the USSR) was the world's 2nd or 3rd largest economy at all times. in 1985 USSR GDP was ~USD2.2 trillion vs USA's 4.3 trillion both figures in 1985 dollars. Today the economic might of Russia is a fraction of its former self but the industry and tech is still there. Hope this helps.
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Old 8th October 2018, 11:26   #39
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Default re: The Missiles of India. EDIT: A-SAT update on page 6

Thanks you very much V. Narayan for providing us such delicious military information. Why is US an enemy of Russia or for that matter North Korea? They do not share a common boundary to fight for. Neither do these 2 nations indulge in terrorism. They may not be democracies, but people can live happily under dictatorships too. I think US is unnecessarily meddling too much into other countries affairs. By putting sanctions or taking military action on them, it makes the lives of common public some bit difficult.
In my professional dealings with my European and American counterparts, i feel the Europeans are much more friendly and respectful. The American are very arrogant and disrespectful at times. They just mean business.
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Old 8th October 2018, 16:21   #40
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Default re: The Missiles of India. EDIT: A-SAT update on page 6

Great thread (defacto standard) by Narayan sir.

My questions may be rudimentary..

We see these kind of missiles & related technologies are sold to India by super powers. How will they counter it, in case of a real war with us?

What is the real logic behind a joint military exercise?
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Old 8th October 2018, 18:21   #41
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Default re: The Missiles of India. EDIT: A-SAT update on page 6

Superb thread sir. Although this is a missile thread, maybe if you could throw some light on Indian plans on acquiring SU-35s - basically China is ahead of us in doing business with Russia on SUs - they have 35s in service. Or we are looking directly at PAK-FA ?
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Old 8th October 2018, 19:51   #42
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Default re: The Missiles of India. EDIT: A-SAT update on page 6

Amazing thread sir!! No words for the amount of knowledge I gain from it. I know I am asking too much, but can you please also provide information on the IAF Air to Air and Air to Ground Missiles, and also info on Navy SAM's and SSM's?

Last edited by Gannu_1 : 8th October 2018 at 20:14. Reason: Smileys - 2 per post please. Thanks.
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Old 8th October 2018, 19:53   #43
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And now we hear of spies being arrested (Brahmos development).

Regards
Sutripta
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Old 8th October 2018, 21:34   #44
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Default re: The Missiles of India. EDIT: A-SAT update on page 6

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And now we hear of spies being arrested (Brahmos development).
Yes, it's a concerning news.

For those who haven't come across the news -

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Old 8th October 2018, 22:34   #45
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And now we hear of spies being arrested (Brahmos development).
BrahMos Engineer Arrested For Spying, "Chatted On Facebook With Pak IDs"
https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/nish...or-pak-1928780

Quote:
An engineer working at the BrahMos Aerospace Private Limited in Maharashtra's Nagpur was arrested on Monday on charges of spying for Pakistan's intelligence agency ISI and other countries, sources say.
Nishant Agrawal has worked in the technical research section of the missile centre for four years

"Very sensitive information was found on his personal computer. We found evidence of him chatting on Facebook with Pakistan-based IDs," said Aseem Arun, the chief of the anti-terror squad of Uttar Pradesh. Nishant Agrawal is accused of passing on classified and secret information to the Inter-Services Intelligence of Pakistan as well as other countries
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