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Old 22nd March 2019, 22:10   #31
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Default Re: Army's T-72 tank spotted on public roads in Chennai

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Originally Posted by V.Narayan View Post
If you are not from a military background then that could be a fair conclusion to draw. Allow me the add a fresh perspective. The highlighted phrase is an assumption. An active army like the Indian Army stays ready for a hundred eventualities that might occur. An opponent usually does not announce his chosen method or intention beforehand and if you are not ready then you are 10 years too late.
I never said it's a defunct or not-required option; just pointed out that the relevance/usage that has gone done as compared to times in the past; which you also (in a manner) detailed out in one of your earlier replies.

Let me rephrase it in a simpler manner; it's always a game of chess; all options will have to be and will be exercised; for realistic and all potential scenarios. Which is what you also said in a much detailed manner, so I trust we are talking the same point, but just with different perspectives.

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Originally Posted by torquecurve View Post
Though Narayan Sir has already answered you, and may I say, it is in the nicest way here are some hard facts.
Lol - for putting out the first line stating the presence of 'hard facts', you didn't give any. But @V.narayan and (to an extent) @himanshugoswami did, so you can leverage that.

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Better locks - the smartest of locks can be broken by a dedicated thief. Most of these systems are 'passive' security. The CCTV footage of a burglary that has already happened does nothing to 'prevent' the burglary in the first place. A human guard - more often than not is also able to reason and predict based on suspicious movements. Teams of such 'chowkidars' can be a good deterrent to burglaries in most large housing societies. Of course, they shouldn't sleep - but that is up to you to not let him. Keep him motivated enough to work and be alert.
I'm not even getting into this - I replied with that example to an earlier discussion point with him and thankfully he got it and responded in accordance.

Which you didn't, so let's leave it at that and I'm ending this OT discussion from my side.

Last edited by ninjatalli : 22nd March 2019 at 22:22.
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Old 9th April 2019, 12:04   #32
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Default Re: Army's T-72 tank spotted on public roads in Chennai

I have a Question. Does the ERA not have sensors and stuff to give it the smarts? In that case, it should react only if the sensors spot something approaching at a crazy velocity.

Last edited by navin : 9th April 2019 at 14:59. Reason: SMS slang used.
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Old 9th April 2019, 16:04   #33
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Default Re: Army's T-72 tank spotted on public roads in Chennai

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Originally Posted by MaheshY1 View Post
I have a Question. Does the ERA not have sensors and stuff to give it the smarts? In that case, it should react only if the sensors spot something approaching at a crazy velocity.
Nope It doesn't have any sensors, These are just metal plates which are sandwiched with explosives, which reduces the effectiveness of the approaching missiles by exploding. It however raises a huge potential threat to bystanders. But that's just ERA, our tanks have got much more sophisticated stuff than that!!

And it's really refreshing to see this thread. Back in 2013, while i was working there, the T-72's were like the Mig-21s, old but does the job precisely. With the T-90's replacing them, was a grand welcome. Arjun sadly had lot of issues. However the new Arjun Mk-2 seems to be doing things better than T-90s. I guess the Josh has certainly gone high
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Old 10th April 2019, 17:40   #34
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Default Re: Army's T-72 tank spotted on public roads in Chennai

I stay nearby the area. The road has two lanes here which are made up of different materials. One lane is laid with tar and the other lane is laid with concrete blocks. The tanks ride only on the concrete lane and not on the tar roads.
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Old 10th April 2019, 18:06   #35
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Default Re: Army's T-72 tank spotted on public roads in Chennai

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Originally Posted by saratjyo View Post
I stay nearby the area. The road has two lanes here which are made up of different materials. One lane is laid with tar and the other lane is laid with concrete blocks. The tanks ride only on the concrete lane and not on the tar roads.
That's great! Thanks for letting us know! I had provided a perspective on the same from 20 years ago earlier on this thread @ https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/comme...ml#post4562031 (Army's T-72 tank spotted on public roads in Chennai)

But I didn't know if they still maintained the concrete/tar parallel stretches in the area But given the general public's levels of indiscipline these days, I hope that drivers have the sense not to drive on the concrete stretches. Back then, no one would venture onto the tanks' rightful paths.
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Old 11th April 2019, 15:52   #36
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Default Re: Army's T-72 tank spotted on public roads in Chennai

T72s still form the mainstay of operations for a lot of Armies. Its a time tested platform which is and has been regularly updated. Plus that gun is supremely accurate.
Yes, the older tanks have been phased out from the Armoured Units and have been given to Infantry in static firing roles. And its a hoot to drive as the controls are more like a car rather than the shifters sticks of the older tanks.
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Old 11th April 2019, 16:34   #37
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Default Re: Army's T-72 tank spotted on public roads in Chennai

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Originally Posted by V.Narayan View Post
Air conditioning in a ship or a tank is a hazard in war. When hit by a shell/missile it is a great fire hazard as the ventilation ducts and the blown air carry the fire to all corners of the tank/ship in quick time and feed oxygen to the fire. When a warship goes to action stations it is not uncommon for the air conditioning to be switched off for that time. Modern western tanks have started introducing air-con for the electronics first and crew second. The fire risk remains.
Narayan-ji, are you sure about the T-72 and T-90 not having not having air-conditioners? I seem to recall reports that they are equipped with air-con but they are not able to take the heat on the sub-continent.

Tanks received air-conditioning not for crew comfort (though it was a consideration) or for sensor cooling (the sensors have an independent cooling system - usually thermoelectric) but to allow them to operate in an NBC (Nuclear-Biological-Chemical) environment. In case such weapons were used, the battlefield would be contaminated and wouldn't allow unprotected crew to operate. The tanks were therefore equipped with air-con units to take in outside air, filter it and then operate the internal crew compartments at a slightly higher pressure (overpressure). This prevented external contaminants affecting the crew. The reason for the overpressure is that even in case of a small leak, the air flow would be from inside the tank to the outside instead of the other way around.
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Old 11th April 2019, 19:02   #38
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Default Re: Army's T-72 tank spotted on public roads in Chennai

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Originally Posted by vivtho View Post
are you sure about the T-72 and T-90 not having not having air-conditioners? I seem to recall reports that they are equipped with air-con but they are not able to take the heat on the sub-continent.
Tanks received air-conditioning not for crew comfort (though it was a consideration) or for sensor cooling (the sensors have an independent cooling system - usually thermoelectric) but to allow them to operate in an NBC (Nuclear-Biological-Chemical) environment. In case such weapons were used, the battlefield would be contaminated and wouldn't allow unprotected crew to operate. The tanks were therefore equipped with air-con units to take in outside air, filter it and then operate the internal crew compartments at a slightly higher pressure (overpressure). This prevented external contaminants affecting the crew. The reason for the overpressure is that even in case of a small leak, the air flow would be from inside the tank to the outside instead of the other way around.
Caveat: I am no expert on tanks or other armoured vehicles. From what little I know the T-72 is not air-conditioned as originally designed. The Indian Army & Avadi may have made indigenous modifications which I do not know of. To the point you make the T-90 does have an air-conditioning system which, designed for Russian climate, is woefully inadequate for our climate. The main role of that air-conditioning is to keep the significant amount of electronics, especially the thermal sights & aiming system, cool. The Army may have made their own corrections. Russian air-con systems being short for Indian conditions is a universal challenge - in fighters, in ships, in tanks and in submarines too.

NBC protection, as you correctly point out runs on an over-pressure system and intake of filtered air. It needs a filtration & ventilation system but not necessarily an air-con system. If an air-con system exists the NBC can be dovetailed into it. My limited knowledge runs out at this point. :-)
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Old 12th April 2019, 00:36   #39
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Default Re: Army's T-72 tank spotted on public roads in Chennai

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Originally Posted by blackwasp View Post
Thanks to Arjun Bohtan for sending this video in.
My dad worked for the OFB his entire life, spent almost all of his career at HVF, & then retired from EFA ( Engine Factory Avadi ).
As such, I spent my teens within the HVF quarters at Avadi in the late eighties & early nineties.
There is a large testing range ( a walled area ) about a couple of Kms from HVF & EFA where the tanks are put through their paces & their instruments calibrated.
Beside the regular tarred road that leads from HVF & EFA ( to the range ) is a reinforced concrete "road" meant for the tanks to use, this concrete road is paved with large granite stones & is unbelievably "bumpy".
The tanks can get upto serious speeds on these roads & make an unbelievable racket, they can brake pretty insanely too.
The tank in the video appears to be on this concrete stretch, if it went onto the normal tarred roads, it will just chew them up.
A common pasttime of mine during the summer vacations was to "borrow" my dad's Vijay Super & wait beside this road for the tanks to drive down to the range & then ride beside them.

Some of the coolest experiences from this time include getting rides on these tanks when they were being tested, & witnessing the calibration of the laser range finder on one of these T-72s ( it is done at night for some reason ).
The testing range where these tanks are tested is impossible for most, if not all, contemporary 4x4s'.
In general, I found the mechanics & technicians who test these tanks pretty amiable, the army folks were usually gruff.

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Originally Posted by Durango Dude View Post
Won't it rip the tarmac and ruin the roads ! Must have been a sight to behold !
Yes, they will, & they do, usually seen at intersections where the tanks have to turn & end up on parts of the normal tarred roads.

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Originally Posted by locusjag View Post
When my mamaji lived in the CRPF quarters in Avadi ( he's a CPWD engineer ) when I was a little boy in the 1990s, my favorite pastime when staying with him was to watch these tanks roll by.
There is ( or, was ) a stretch beside the CRPF quarters with a tar road and a concrete road laid side by side.
MTC buses and private vehicles alike would ply a few feet away from the tanks rattling by alongside on the concrete.
Small world, my dad worked at EFA before retiring, I even interned there one summer.
However, I wouldn't use the term "rattling along", more like "rattled everything around" as they thundered past.
At speed, you can hear the tanks quite a long way away, they can get upto 70 Kmph when there's no traffic around.

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Originally Posted by RajeVenu View Post
Please remember that the explosive component and detonator mechanism are not fit on the tank 24X7, they are only populated when moving onto active operational areas.
What you see on the tank are just empty casings which will hold the E part of the ERA when required. So you can lay your fears to rest.
Very true, "live" ammunition is rarely ( if not, never ) carried on the tanks at Avadi.

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Originally Posted by saratjyo View Post
I stay nearby the area.
The road has two lanes here which are made up of different materials.
One lane is laid with tar and the other lane is laid with concrete blocks.
The tanks ride only on the concrete lane and not on the tar roads.
Quote:
Originally Posted by locusjag View Post
But I didn't know if they still maintained the concrete / tar parallel stretches in the area
But given the general public's levels of indiscipline these days, I hope that drivers have the sense not to drive on the concrete stretches.
Back then, no one would venture onto the tanks' rightful paths.
From the video, it appears that the concrete road meant for the tanks has been filled in, over the years, with sand & dust.
These concrete roads, which are paved with huge granite blocks ( think Belgian cobbled pavement, but with large granite blocks set in reinforced concrete ), are unbelievably bumpy, you couldn't drive on them on ordinary vehicles, even the MTC buses would avoid them.
I once remember an uncle of mine, who wanting to demonstrate the plushness of the suspension of his Toyota Cressida to my dad, driving on this concrete section - the anti-roll-bar mount broke during the drive !

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Originally Posted by vivtho View Post
Narayan-ji, are you sure about the T-72 and T-90 not having not having air-conditioners ?
I'm not sure about the T-90, but from my "rides" in the T-72 in the early nineties, I can say that they didn't have any HVAC system.
There were tiny fans though, the kind you used to see in old Ambassador taxis - but there was no protective mesh around the fans & the fins were made of soft rubber.

I tried finding this road now on Google-Maps, but couldn't do so, I guess the area has become more populated over the past 30 years.
~

Last edited by im_srini : 12th April 2019 at 00:54.
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Old 12th April 2019, 10:27   #40
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Default Re: Army's T-72 tank spotted on public roads in Chennai

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Originally Posted by PetrolRider View Post
I am curious, do these tanks come with any driving aid, such as front and rear parking sensors and cameras and bird eye view camera set up etc. I really wonder, how can someone drive this beast on a public road just with a peeping hole. That beast is doing some decent speed for its weight, though.
Speaking from experience - no sir no parking sensors or birds eye view camera as you call it - there are devices through which you can see however in various directions.

Visibility isn't all that bad to be honest - it can be driven on a road as long as you are driving more or less straight without swerving or turning too much (saying that since the driver cannot see in all directions like a car driver however there are others in the tank who usually keep an eye out). The driver sits low in the front portion below the turret.

V.Narayan - You are right sir, no air-condition unless its been added very recently. Just a fan from what i know.
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