[Jeroen]

Yesterday I drove over to help spanner mate Peter. He recently bought a 1996 Lancia Dedra. As you would expect from somebody who is a professional Classic Car valuator, this is quite a rare Lancia. There are less than 25 of these Lancia’s left in the Netherlands and only a few of those are estates, such as the one Peter bought.

I drove my W123 with some tools in the boot. About an hour, 35 minutes of driving. Very quiet of the Dutch motorways early on a Sunday morning.





First thing when I arrived is to have some coffee. Both Peter and I are absolute coffee junks. Peter had already taken the old brake pads out and loosened up everything else.

Over coffee we looked at some of the old parts and the new parts.

The right rear brake had been stuck and the brake pads were completely gone, down to the bare metal!!





Peter had bought new discs, new callipers (refurbished) and new pads. The refurbished callipers look really smart.



Notice how this is a similar system as we recently came across on my other spanner mate Toon, when working on this SmartForFour Brabus. These rear disc brakes don’t have drum/shoe for the parking brake. The handbrake lever operates a cable that is connected to the lever on the rear of the calliper. It rotates the piston outwards.



We put the Lancia on some axle stands and took both rear wheels off.



As you can see the rear right disc is badly rusted, but much worse are the deep scratches, where the steel backing plate of the pad was pressed into it.





The thickness of the disc was fine, but it was so badly scratch we replaced it

The disc removed. You can see the ABS signal ring.



The old discs came off very easily. Put the new ones on. The discs are held in place with two small bolts that also serve as rim guidance when you put the wheel back on.



Same job on the left rear.



It was a fairly straight forward job, replacing the old bits with the new bits. The only problem we had was putting the new callipers on the new disc/pad combination. Would not fit. It did not take us long to figure out, the piston of the calliper needed to be wound further inwards. Just like the ones on Toon's SmartForFour. L

Luckily Peter had one of these brake rewind sets. Very handy, very effective.



The problems started when we tried to bleed the system. We tried different techniques, with the pressurised bleed system, the vacuum system, by pushing the brake pedal.



Whereas the left rear brake was bled in a matter of seconds, we could not get any brake fluid coming out of the right rear one?

Remembering my experience with the Jaguar brakes, I removed the bleed screw completely. Only to find the exact same problem; the tiny hole that is supposed to let the air/fluid out was completely blocked. (And this was a brand new bleed screw on a completely overhauled calliper!)



So we thought that was the problem. We put a different bleed screw in, one that was open, but still nothing. In the end we took the hose off the calliper and tried to get some fluid out. Nothing. So the most likely explanation is that the brake hose is blocked. This is not uncommon on old brake hoses. But we did not have a spare one on us, so that is a job for another day.

So a partly succesful job. It was freezing cold, so we were glad we were done by about 15.30. Drove back in my W123. Car drives fine, but definitely still a bit of stutter, especially when accelerating.

Jeroen

[Jeroen]

Busy day today with cars and lots of little jobs. We are helping a friend of ours redecorating. Well, my wife is in charge of the redecoration, e.g. painting and wall papering. We never ever do that together. We did it once about 35 years ago and we almost ended up divorced. So my job is to get rid of all the old junk. And our friend and ex-boyfriend were a bit of a hoarders. So I borrowed a trailer from one of my neighbours and set to work.

HaulageJeroen@yourservice.



Two trips to the tip. I moved close to 600 kilograms of junk! (The car and trailer get weighed as you drive into the tip and when you drive out of the tip. You pay per kilogram!

Anyway, I always enjoy these sort of jobs. Just a bit of physical work, which I always like. I also like driving a trailer. Especially reversing it. Had not done it for many many years, but still managed quite well. Our friend lives in a dead end street and I had to reverse in, one S-curve and a 90o curve, all in reverse. Having an automatic is of course, very welcome during these sort of manoeuvres.

Once back home, I went to work on my Mercedes W123. I had picked up two parts earlier this week. The steering dampener and the thermo-unit for the air inlet.





Removing the old steering dampner is very easy. Its fixed in place by two bolts. You can access the bolts by just reaching underneath the car. You don’t even need to jack it up!



I replaced this dampener some 15-20 years ago. At that time the old one was completely wasted. No dampening at all. This one still felt pretty tight, but compared to the new one, it was very different, so I mounted the new one. I will keep the old one, just in case as a spare.



Next I went to work on the little box of electronics. This car has an electronic (transistor) based ignition and no breaker points. It’s a Bosch system and as you would expect from a German system from the 70s, it is very reliable and hard wearing. But as you might know I was still having a little problem with the ignition. The car ever so slightly stutters a bit when accelerating. Not enough for my wife to notice, but I do. And i have been trying to fix it for some time.

After some tips from my Dutch W123 forum I decided to take the ignition box apart.



Opening it up is easy, just four little bolts. But I wanted to take the printed circuit board out as well. Which meant I had to unsolder a number of connections, both on the connector and on the PCB itself.







I cleaned the whole PCB board and I also resoldered every connection on the board. Sometimes on these boxes, the soldering becomes weak, some moisture might get trapped and the soldering connection, although visually looks fine, has to high a resistance. Resoldering everything is a good remedy. I have done it on the ECU of the Alfa Spider and it also a known cure for many problems on my very complex Jaguar. You just need to be a bit careful with your soldering gun of course.

Put everything back together again.



I also spend a long time cleaning the connectors. I had done that earlier, with the little box still in the engine compartment. But I could see some of the connectors were a bit corroded. The reason was probably the failed O-ring under the connector. So my box of many different sizes O-rings to the rescue!!



I put a little vaseline on all the seals, just as this will water proof them a bit better. Mounted the box back in the W123.





I also took the air inlet of the filter housing again and fitted the new thermo-element that controls the cold/warm inlet valve. I had put the element on the radiator inside to warm it up. When warm the valve is open. As it cooled down (only about 6oC in my garage) it closes again. Perfect!!



Started it and took it for a test drive. I noticed a difference immediately. The engine runs much more smoothly and idles better. The stuttering is a whole lot less. Also the steering has improved due to the new dampener fitted.

With then engine properly warmed up I, once more checked the idle RPM.





Idle has increased by about 50 RPM to just over 900 RPM. Very happy with the result. I am still waiting on a new distributor, rotor and main coil. Let’s see what difference that makes.

My Dutch W123 forum pals, also gave me a tip for a different aftermarket ignition box. Not very expensive and I might still give it a try. They reported some excellent results by fitting it instead of the standard Mercedes/Bosch unit.

Another little job on the Jeep. The remote/FOB was broken when I bought it. Broken in the sense that the key ring attachment had come off. I tried glueing it back twice, which worked for a few months. Yesterday it came off again. So I just cut it off completely. Opened it up, drilled a tiny 1mm hole, and screwed in this little eyelet.



At about 16.15 I got a call about my two bottles, oxygen and propane. They had arrived so I quickly drove over and picked them up.





Part of all the crap and old stuff I took to the tip, was also an old bed frame. I kept it. It is all metal and it has these tiny wheels on it. I want to make a little welding cart that will hold my bottles and hoses. This might just do!!



Jeroen

[Jeroen]

Bought a few small items whilst i was visiting the Model build exhibition last weekend (see https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/comme...therlands.html)

The tweezers with the wooden handles are specially for brazing, very handy. And two tiny tweezers with non magnetic points. Also some brass stock.



Today I decided to install the new coil, rotor and distributor cap.



Pretty straightforward job, just make sure you get all the wires onto the correct connections.

The distributor cap has the cylinder numbers stamped on it.





Swapping out the coil. I just noticed there is also a capacitor. Haven’t got that one yet. It was pretty hard to find. Managed to track it down to an Ebay seller in Germany who was kind enough to ship to the Netherlands.



The spark plugs lead are an incredibly tight fit of the distributor cap. You could easily tear them apart trying to remove them. I use this nifty tool to loosen them up a bit. This is a tool meant for removing hoses, but with some due care it will do this job too!



Everything back together again, about 30 minutes work:



Took it for a test drive and it has definitely improved a bit more. But unfortunately on the way back home, it was a bit slippery and I hit a small bush, as I was trying to avoid an car that was coming towards me in the middle of the dike. So I tried to keep to the far right, which was going well, until the front slid a little further down the dike.

Major bummer.



On Thursday I am taking it to the repair shop for an estimate. My local repair guy Johan had a quick look and he thinks its going to be around Euro 800 at least!

More to come

Jeroen

[Thad E Ginathom]

Originally Posted by Jeroen

... ... ... unfortunately on the way back home, it was a bit slippery and I hit a small bush, as I was trying to avoid an car that was coming towards me in the middle of the dike. So I tried to keep to the far right, which was going well, until the front slid a little further down the dike.

Major bummer.

Oh dear, so sad to hear this.

Good luck with the repair estimate and the repair itself. Will you make an insurance claim?

[Jeroen]

Originally Posted by Thad E Ginathom

Oh dear, so sad to hear this.

Good luck with the repair estimate and the repair itself. Will you make an insurance claim?

Yes, already notified the insurance company. I have an one risk of only 150 Euro and as all my cars are on classic car insurances there is no such thing as loss of no claim bonus. The premium is a fixed percentage of the value as determined by an independent classic car appraiser. (Such as my mate Peter).

Jeroen

[Jeroen]

It was quite a challenge finder the indicator. There are plenty of indicators about, but I wanted an original Bosch unit. These cars were delivered with either Bosch or Hella. There are quite a number of cheap imitations on the market. But they might not fit properly, have a different colour to start with or start to fade quickly.

So it took quite a while to trace an original Bosch. Found a vendor in Denmark. Including postage Euro 250 (INR22000). Insurance company approved so I ordered and paid. Only to be told about a day later they did not have it in stock. So cancelled my order.

Eventually found one in the Netherlands for only Euro 90 (INR 8000)

As you can see the indicator lens and unit was completely ruined. Luckily the headlight unit itself including the two clips into which the indicator lens fit was not damaged at all!





The light bulb was just dangling by its thread and was broken too.





These sort of parts are known as NOS (new old stock) in the classic car world. It is a genuine original part, never used, just old. But I was very happy with it, because with it fitted, I can now drive my W123 again.





I took the W123 to the repair shop last week as well. They had a look at it and it will go in for repairs end of Februari. Yes, the are booked solid for almost two months. Not to worried. With the blinker back in place I can drive it again.

I also received the new capacitor which I fitted yesterday. Very simple job, took less than five minutes. Today I have an appointment about an hours drive from here, so I will get a good idea to what extent the ignition problems have been solved so far.



I keep these old parts and label them. Although currently you can still get them, but you never know what is going to happen and they might come in handy.



Tomorrow Spanner Mater Peter will arrive early. We will be removing the steering box of the Spider. We did the same job over twenty years ago. We expect to be busy for the whole day. Major operation. I wrote an article about it in the Spiderama, the magazine of the Dutch Alfa Spider Register.

We looked a lot younger in those days!!



We will need to remove a lof of those near the engine and under the dashboard!

Jeroen

[Jeroen]

Yesterday Peter and I were discussing a couple of last things about removing the steering box of the Spider. When we tackle these big jobs, we usually discuss it multiple times on the phone and agree who will be taking what tools and so on.

Both of us had also been reading up on this job in the official Spider manual and Spider forums. We had done this very job some twenty years ago and I had written an article about it in the Spiderama, our Spider Register magazine. I managed to find the complete article and the photographs. Which was a big help too.

As we were discussing our approach I suddenly recalled that the very first time I tried to remove the Steering wheel of my Spider it was stuck badly. And I mean real stuck. I spend a whole afternoon trying to get it off. In the end I had to drive to a nearby Alfa Spider Specialist who had the right tools and got in like three minute flat.

I told Peter I would try to take the steering wheel off the day before we start on the Steering box. If we can’t get the steering wheel off, there is no way we can get the steering box out.

So yesterday afternoon, in a very cold garage (4oC) I got going on the steering wheel.

I removed the original steering wheel and replaced it with this very nice leather Personal Steering Wheel when I bought my Spider more than 25 years ago. That’s when I experienced all these problems. This steering wheel has fitted to numerous cars of us over the years. It must be at least 40 years old or so. You used to be able to buy different adapter so it would fit different cars. Not sure if you can still get those adaptors.



Getting the steering wheel rim off is easy enough, just six bolts. The wire you see dangling is normally attached to the horn switch in the middle of the steering wheel.



The big issue is getting the steering wheel mount or boss of the steering column. I tried a couple of different pullers, but none fitted properly.



When using these kind of pullers I always undo the mounting nut inside the boss first. I was pleasantly surprised I had not tightened it very much last time. Which would suggest I should be able to get the mount/boss off without to much trouble. But without a proper puller you don’t stand a chance. I called Peter and he confirmed he had a couple of other pullers and one specially for a Spider Steering wheel. He was going to bring them all.

Then I remembered my flywheel / Jeep pulley puller. So I got it out and with some extra bolts and many O-rings managed to get it in place. It was not perfectly aligned, but I gave it a very careful go, by applying a large wrench onto it. I always leave the nut on, just leave enough clearance. When it pops you don’t want bits jumping into your face!!





It came off without any problems, or any undue force. Very happy about that!!



I also removed some parts of the lower dashboard as I knew it had to come apart anyway.



This morning Peter arrived at about 09.35. Luckily the temperatures here in the Netherlands have gone up considerable. I put an air heater on in the garage by 07.30. We always start with coffee and made our way into the garage by about 10.00am

We decided the first thing would be to undo the two steering linkages attached to the pitman arm. We had already decided not to remove the pitman arm. For no other reason, that without proper tools it is totally impossible.

So I disconnected the battery and you will see further on why that is really necessary! Lifted the Spider up with two jacks and put onto two axle stands.



With Peter working from the top into the engine bay and me on the ground holding bits and tools in place we managed to pop both ball joints very easily.



Anything on a Spider is always a battle for space and how to get access to anything.



Between the two of us we had three of these pullers. Again, you might be able to get the ball joint separated in a different way, but these tools make this sort of job so much easier.





We also undid the three bolts holding the steering box in place to the chassis. Put the wheel back on and lowered the Spider again.

Undoing the two steering linkage was very much a two man job. You need at least four hands, preferably six. But we managed.

With this part done, Peter continued working on removing stuff from the engine bay to ensure we could extract the steering box. I started working inside the cabin, underneath the dashboard.

The first thing was to remove the driver chair. Shown in the original images from 20 years ago, I spend about 2 hours standing up side down in the foot well of my Spider undoing bolts, bits of trim, electrical connectors etc.

Me being very agile twenty years ago, I was only 43 at the time!




This time we decided better remove the chair. Only held in place with four tiny bolts. I had to use my impact screw driver to loosen them.





One of the best ideas we had all day, so much easier working under the dashboard with the chair removed. We could not understand why we had not done that last time? Live and learn, experience and all of that!

With the chair out of the way I proceeded to undo everything holding the steering column in place. The steering box has a large tube fitted to it, into which the actual steering column with worm turns. The tube fits into a larger tube, bolted underneath the dashboard. It also supports the various switches and also the complete key / lock mechanism. All of that needed disconnecting and disassembling.



Al the bits I took off, I put in the passenger foot well.



More and more stuff coming apart!!

[Jeroen]

Whilst I was working inside the cabin underneath the dashboard, Peter was working in the engine bay. He took out the complete air inlet filter and air mass metering assembly, the alternator, the oil gauge pipe, and the outside part of the exhaust manifold.





More and more stuff coming out from underneath the dashboard.



This is the firewall with the steering column going through it.



Had to take of some bushins, springs and special rings of the steering column



About done here: Beginning to look pretty empty underneath the dash!!.





Peter elbow deep in the engine bay.



With just about everything removed we found we still could not extract the steering box. We had to remove one of the engine mounts too!

The engine of a Spider has two engine mounts, left and right centre on the engine. The gearbox/clutch is bolted on and that is held by one more mount in the centre in the middle of the car. Peter and I remembered that our very first job working on our Spiders was replacing the engine mounts on both our Spiders. At the time we did it at then Peter’s home near Amsterdam, on his drive. Took us the whole afternoon to replace two sets of engine mounts. However, the left one is much more easily accessible than the one of the right hand side on these Spiders. So we rigged up a rope pulling the engine up and a jack underneath the sump.

Note the steering box is already removed here but you can see the engine mount clearly.




You can just lift the engine sufficiently on one side to remove the engine mount. With the engine mount also out of the way we could extract the complete steering box!! It did involve also rotating the complete assembly 180 degrees at one point, so the pitman is sticking upside down.

Here we are, job done!!



We were actually very surprised, because we were done by about 1400 hours. And we had two coffee and a lunch break. So all in all, a very successful job. Last time it took us considerably longer.

Everything laid out on the work bench. (also note the alternator) Peter and I made a list of all the parts I need to get to put everything back in place. Mostly some gaskets, bolts, nuts and some ball joints.



We cleaned up our tools and the garage. As the Spider won’t be used for the next two months I put some extra air pressure (about 2.7 bar) into the tyres.



With the battery completed disconnected I got out my special tricky charger alligator clamp set, so it will keep the battery healthy.



Put the Spider into its pyjama.



All the parts put away safely so I won’t step on them or so.



As so often with these kinds of jobs, a lot of different tools have to come out. It always surprises me how many different tools we use. Well, that is why keep buying them I guess.





With a complex job like this, it is important to take lots of pictures and keep all your bolts and nuts organised.



I called Marc, the guy who is going to the overhaul of the steering box. I agreed to drop the steering box off by his shop tomorrow. He also offered me to help with all the parts I need. So that will be convenient.

I have also ordered a new electronic ignition for the Mercedes. Hopefully that will make a difference. More jobs to come!!

Jeroen

[Jeroen]

I drove over to Marc today to drop over the steering box. I had a long talk with him. Turns out we have a lot of common friends and acquaintances in the Alfa world.

I am very impressed solfer how Marc approaches all of this. I discussed the problems with the steering linkage with him. Does it make sense to replace the various ball joints. We agreed I would just put everything back in place and Marc will have a look before he does the final allignement. He has planned the overhaul of my steering box for January. That means Peter and I need to plan a date In February to put everything back into the Spider. Marc has also planned some time early March to Pacheco the steering linkage and do a proper allignement. I have also asked him to check this odd resonance I hear/feel. His first thought was maybe an alignemtnproblem between engine and transmission. That would make sense to me. As we had the left engine mount off, it will be interesting to see if that has made any difference to this small resonance issue.

I should be receiving the new electronic ignition for my W123 in the next two days. Fitting it will take a minute, if that!
I hope it is going to make a difference. I really don’t like replacing parts and see what happens. But there is only so much measuring and testing I can do on the ignition. And with all parts 40 year olds all parts have some wear of course.

Wait and see!
Jeroen

[Jeroen]

Today I received a fairly large package from my friend Willum. He is the one who organised and lead the brazing course earlier this year. In the past he has helped me with all kinds of odds and ends.

A few weeks ago I found a very nice brazing set on one of the Dutch market places. I checked with Willum, he liked it to. I bought it and send it over to him.

He has completely overhauled the complete set, added some new bits, added the hoses, reducers, various quick release connectors and a heat soldering handle too. And also a special attachment for the drill bit sharpener Willum made for me before. This allows me to sharpen/grind very small drill too.

I have already bought the propane and oxygen bottles.







The other day I also noticed one of the local supermarkets (Lidl) had a special deal on an electric welder. Cost only Euro 30 (INR 2600)/ To put that in some perspective. Euro 30 gets you two crates of beer. (each 24 330cc bottles). So that is seriously cheap. I don’t expect too much, but it will be fun to have as well and will come in handy for the occasional welding job.

First job is to make a proper support for all my brazing and welding equipment!!

Jeroen

[Jeroen]

My brand new electric welder arrived yesterday. Quite impressed all of this for Euro 30. It is a pretty basic electric/invertor welder. Plugs into the normal 220VAC/50Hz mains.



You can switch in on/off and adjust the current from 0-100A.

It also came with the torch, welders mask and a little hamer/brush. The mask is tiny, but sufficient for my kind of welding. The little hammer/brush is pretty useless and I will need to get something a bit better to hammer away on the newly welding joints to clean them up.

I started last night on building a little rig for my oxygen and propane bottles. So I had a first try out of this little welder. I use small electrodes, 1,6mm and at a relative low current, around 40A, I managed to make my first welds on quite thin metal square tubing.



In all, given that have not welded for years, not too bad. Mind you this kind of poor welding can be pretty well hidden by grinding everything down!!

I will try and complete this little rig after Christmas.

I should also receive the new electronic ignition I ordered for my Mercedes W123. Be interesting to see if it makes any difference at all.

End of the week I will be visiting my spanner mate Peter for yet another few jobs on his Lancia. We will attempt to replace the thermostat and thermostat housing. Which sounds simple enough, but nothing is ever simple on any Italian car, and especially not on a Lancia. In all honesty I have never seen such a complex thermostat housing before.

Jeroen

[Jeroen]

We had all kids, partners, grand children over for Christmas. Unfortunately, my eldest sister was down with Corona. Bummer!

Two of our kids and their parties have a KIA Niro hybrid. Very nice car and ideal for young families. When you have small kids you always need to take a phenomenal amount of stuff, wherever you go.

My son Luc had a problem with one of his lights. So we took the bulb out and sure enough it was blown.



I am always surprised at the vast number of different lightbulbs for cars. These days, some come with this part of the fitting attached.
You used to be able to buy car light bulbs at petrol station. And you still can, but they won’t have these. So we had to wait till Tuesday for a car part store to open.

Easy enough to stick a new one back in. We bought two as the other one is likely to go soon as well.



Yesterday my new electronic ignition for the Mercedes W123 arrived. I had high hopes this would cure the last of the stuttering of this car.

The old, original Bosch, in the W123



Old and new next to each other.



The new one installed. A two minuted job. Uses the same bolt and bolts hole and exactly the same connectors. Literally plug and play!



I immediately took it out for a test drive. Whilst I noticed that the car seems to accelerating better, especially at high RPM, the annoying little stutter has not been reduced at all.

I did notice the engine idling at about 100 RPM extra compared to earlier. But also there is a distinct 50 RPM drop every 3-4 seconds.

Back to the drawing board. I need to check if the distributor is ok. I did notice play last time when I put the new rotor on. But then I have never come across one that does not have some play.

If all else fails I will start on the carburettor. Not sure if that can cause it. My friendly W123 specialist Cor did not think so either. But what else is left?

Jeroen

[Jeroen]

Yesterday I took my W123, loaded up with various tools and drove over to spanner mate Peter.



Peter’s Lancia was having some problems. When driving it the cooling liquid temperature would not reach its normal operating range. It would also fluctuate around 70oC. These are classic signs of a thermostat gone wonky.

Peter had ordered a new one. On this Lancia the thermostat comes completely integrated into this fancy thermostat housing. It looks like it is some part of a jet engine!





Peter had bought it at the same online shop as I buy many of my car parts. And it cost only Euro 9 (INR 800). Which should have given us some indication as to the quality of this part. To put this Euro 9 in some Dutch context. Euro 9 gets you two coffees (medium) at a Starbucks! Three coffees in a regular cafe.

Peter had already taken a little plastic cover off and got all the necessary tools out:



Notice Peter’s very nice Jaguar XJ. A real classic!!



We decided to also take the battery out to give ourselves a bit better access.

Peter fiddling with some of the hose clamps. He had bought new ones, which is always a good idea with these sort of jobs. Sometimes hose clamps can be really stuck and you need to cut them.

Most of the hoses already disconnected. I have a special little tool to undo stuck hoses. But it was useless on this job, not enough room. So we used a different trick. Once you have undone the hose clamp just put large pliers on the hose near its end, gently squeeze and move it about a bit. You will hear the hose “break” free. Gently does it, works really well.



Everything removed. You can also see the temperature sensors hanging loose. It is fitted with a copper ring. We used my trusted method of heating it red hot and putting it in water, to restore it, so it could be used again. Engine block inside looks very clean.



Installing the new one was not particularly difficult.



We filled all the hoses with new, fresh, liquid prior to installation. This will ensure the system is filled and not to much bleeding has to be done. We also added some to the coolant reservoir.

Job well done we thought, took about 90 minutes in all. Not bad for two old bits. We had lunch and afterwards we were going to take the Lancia for a test drive.

When Peter started the engine, we got a red injector light on the dashboard. So we opened the bonnet again, started pulling at some connectors. In the end it turned out that temperature sensor on the thermostat housing. I had not pushed it firmly in place. It was just not providing good electrical connectivity. Problem sorted we started the test drive, eyes glued on the coolant temperature gauge.

We were very happy to see it rising and well passed the 70oC, so at least that was encouraging. Unfortunately, it kept rising to the point the coolant almost started to boil. So we stopped, opened the bonnet, checked the coolant, there was plenty in the reservoir. But we noticed the outlet line of the radiotor to the thermostat was still very cold. Every other lines/hose was very warm/hot.

So we let the engine cool down and then managed to drive home. We checked a few more things. But in the end our conclusion was that the most likely problem is the new thermostat is also wonky!! It appears as if it does not open at all!!

I had to leave and Peter was going to order a new one. He just phoned me today. He had taken the new thermostat assembly of the Lancia again. And he tested the old and the new one in some water which he heated. There is definitely something wrong with this brand new thermostat assembly. In Peter’s test set up it would not open either!!

That means this year alone between the two of us and three of our cars, we have had three brand spanking new parts that were dead on arrivals as it is known in the industry. The starter motor of Peter’s Spider, the alternator of my Jeep, and now this thermostat on the Lancia.

In all honesty, whereas both the starter motor and the alternator were real genuine OEM parts, the thermostat was, obviously, at Euro 9, not! Well, live and learn. to be continued.

Jeroen

[Jeroen]

Spanner mate Peter managed to find an original Lancia Thermostat!



So today I drove up to Peter again. We had a good look at all three thermostat assemblies.

The new one, technically the second new one!!



All three, the old one, the new one, and the new new one!



The all look pretty much the same. The old one and the new new one had a few small details that were different from the new one. But that was all, even the markings, numbers etc were all correct. So there must have been a very diligent Chinese copying the original one. Even so, there is more than just copy and paste to produce quality parts.

This thermostat is so called NOS, new old stock. Classic cars enthusiast love NOS. Because it keeps their cars original, and usually it fits and works well. There is a price to pay. This one was 10 times as expensive as the previous one. Expensive being a relative term here. If cheap does not work, it is a complete waste of money, no matter how little money involved.

So we installed the new new NOS Thermostat assembly back into the Lancia.



Took us about 40 minutes, including refilling the cooling system with coolant. As last time we filled the hoses going toward the thermostat housing with coolant. It saves on bleeding.

All ready and done!



We started the engine, checked for leaks. There where none, so we took the Lancia for a test drive. Everything worked fine and we could see the thermostat working away keeping the coolant at about 80oC. So job well done. We stopped in Medemblik for a quick lunch. Medemblik is a very nice little town, on the IJsselmeer, the former Zuiderzee (South zee). It has a long tradition with water, lots of ships, yachts and marina’s about. And it has a real steam train that runs between Medemblik and Hoorn, another nice little town on the IJsselmeer. https://www.visitmedemblik.nl/en/dis...ace-and-space/

After lunch, I drove the Lancia back, with Peter as passenger. Very nice little car. Runs perfectly, no noises, squeaks, or anything. Runs and brakes straight, nice balanced steering. With a 1800CC engine with VVT it will rev up nicely and pulls well. Not sure what it is but any Italian car always gives you a special feeling when driving it.

As we had some more time, we decided to check a few more things. The AC was not working. Although the garage from where Peter bought it, had told him, they had filled and pressure tested the system overnight. But with the AC switched on the clutch of the compressor would not engage.

Not the best of images, but this is the compressor from above. You can see the drive belt, the compressor itself, electrical connections and the high pressure line.



First thing we did was to check the fuses. Luckily Peter still has the original owners manual. We have been trying to find a proper workshop manual, but have only found an Italian one on Bay. But the owner manual had all fuses mentioned.

There is a fuse box which is accessible from underneath the dashboard. But there are a few more fuses mounted on the support for that fuse box. As luck would have it, our AC fuse was on that support which meant taking part of the lower half of the dash out.



Here are all the fuses, there are some more in the engine compartment too.



Fuse was fine. We then attached a separate wire from the battery plus towards the connector on the compressor. This is the most basic of AC compressor set ups. Almost identical to the one in my Jeep and my Spider. The compressor is fitted with an electromagnetic clutch. You apply 12V+ to the connector and it should engage. Which it did. We ran it for a short while, just to see if we getting any cold feeling on the high pressure side. But we did not. Maybe we did not run it for long enough. But if the system is low on refrigerant you don’t want to run the compressor too long. The next step would have been to check the proper functioning of the low and hi-pressure switch. We could see those two switches but getting access to them would have meant taking just about the whole front of the car. There is also a small possibility that the outside temperature was too low for the system to work. Most AC system simply don’t run below 4-6oC.

We will have another look at it later this year, in the spring or so. As I was typing this post, Peter texted me we checked the wrong fuse! It appears it might be one of the fuses inside the engine compartment. He will check again tomorrow.

We also opened up one of the covers on the engine, to see what it looked like. Just because we were curious to get to know this little engine and the car a bit better.



We have a (large) number of post across varies thread about modern electronic controlled engines/cars. Some people think they are unreliable. But it is good to realise this Lancia Derdre is from 1996! So it is really effectively a classic car, being 27 years old. And it is absolutely chock full of electronics. It has coils instead of your traditional coil and distributor, fuel injection, it has VVT, it has a fully automatic electronically controlled climate system. It has endless electronic warning lights. (as we found out last time). Doors and windows are all electronically operated. And it has more fuses and relais then my Mercedes W123 and Alfa Romeo Spider put together. This is, for all intents and purposes, a modern, fully electronically controlled car. And it still drives absolutely perfect!!

Peter paid about the same as my old friend Bernd did for his two Rover 200 Cabrio. Again, those are old car, and still run perfectly. All these cars were bought for about Euro 1250 (INR109000). That is the sort of money that will buy you an ordinary bicycle here in the Netherlands!

Anyway, we had a good time fiddling and driving this little car. More to come. At around 14.30 I pointed the W123 south once again and drove home. Very quite on the roads, due to lots of people having this week off work.



Just before going home, I decided to treat the W123 to a proper car wash. This is the first year I am driving it during the winter. Till now it had to be off the public roads during winter. But as it became 40 years old, last October I don’t have that restriction anymore and I don’t need to pay road tax either.



I have noticed a bit of a peculiar noise coming from the W123 alternator. I will have to investigate that. Also, tomorrow I am taking the Jeep to a guy I met via another friend. He might be able to help me out, with some spraying of parts of the Jeep.

Jeroen

[Jeroen]

Today I decided to investigate the noises coming from the alternator on my W123. I had already listened to the bearings of the alternator and concluded they were on their way out. But there was also a more squeeking noise, which is usually the drive or V-belt. (Or sometimes it is not as my Jeep proved!)

So this morning I sprayed some water on the inside of the V-belt whilst it was running. Noise all but disappeared. So I had a good look and it really looks like the pulley on the alternator is not properly aligned with the main pulley on the front of the engine that also drive the thermostatically controlled fan.

This is taken from above. On the right you see the (small) pulley on the alternator and to the left the main pulley on the engine on which the fan is mounted with a electromagnetic clutch. You can see they are out of whack!!



So I took the alternator out of the engine bay. Much easier on the W123 compared to the Jeep. Unclip the electrical connector. Looses two nuts and take out the respective bolts and Bob’s your proverbial uncle once again!



The W123 has one of the simplest yet most effective ways of helping you tension the V-belt on the alternator. The alternator hinges on the bottom bolt, and the top bolt has this little gear on it.



When mounted the gears slot in a teethed bracket.



Here you see them together. So to tighten the V-belt you just rotate this bolt and it moves the alternator away and tension the V-belt. When you feel you have the appropriate tension on the V-belt, you tighten the nut on the other end of this bolt and the nut on the lower bolt and that’s it. Very simple, hugely effective, very German!!



So I took the alternator apart. Getting the nut undone on the pulley with the V-belt removed, or in this case the alternator out of the car, can be a bit of pain. Difficult to hold the pulley. But with my pneumatic impact wrench, it came off, right away, no problems.

Notice the long line of bits that I have taken off. I take the various bits off and put them on the wrok bench, same orientation, one after the other. Than I taken a picture, so I can always re-install every nut, washer, shim, pulley correctly.



Taking the alternator apart was pretty straightforward. This is an original Bosch from the W123 era. So it was designed in such a way you can take it apart and service it too, and most importantly, put it all back together again.

This is the back of the alternator. You see the electrical connector, I have also taken off a capacitor. Also, the brush assembly has been taken out.



Here you see the old brushes and a set of new ones I just happened to have in stock!



The whole inner part, rotor, collector and bearings came out.I felt both bearings and as I had already suspected by listening to them with my stethoscope, both bearing were definitely on their way out. Both had axial and radial play and several hard spots when turning.



The collector was pretty much worn down too. Big grooves, especially on the right!



Finally, the rear bearing is held in place with a rubber ring inside the alternator house. It’s difficult to see, but trust me it is there. And it was worn.



I decided to take all the parts to my friendly local Alternator Overhaul specialist Ton. He had been very helpful when I had my Jeep alternator problems.

He confirmed what I already suspected. I would need new bearings, new collector and new bearing support ring. This was also the most likely cause of the pulley not aligning properly. I could also just order a new one. Parts would have been about 65% of a complete new unit, so I asked Ton to order me a new one. It will arrive tomorrow.



So back at my garage I bolted the old one back together. I will keep it for spare parts, you never know when they stop stocking these things. Labelled as usual.



Fairly straight forward and simple job so far. My W123 waiting for a new alternator.



I also picked up two new V-belts. One for the alternator and one for the power steering pump.



I am fortunate in the sense there are two well stocked car part stores 10 minute drive, 20 minute bike ride from where we live. What they don’t stock they usually have delivered the same day if you order before noon, or the next day.



I had been rummaging through my W123 parts. I decided to clear them all out and take stock of what I have, both in terms of new parts and old ones. I pry myself on knowing pretty much what I have in stock. But I found several things I did not know I had, and also a couple of things I dont know what they are!



Anyway, it was a very happy hour and a half fiddling with all my parts!!



I will do a shelve a week or so, to organise the parts of my other cars too.



Still need to find some more cool signs for my spare part cabinet!



I have also ordered some more parts for my W123 carburettor. I will take it apart in the next couple of weeks. I also ordered four new tires for my Jeep and arranged for the old ones to be removed from the rims, so they can be sandblasted and powder coating. Finally, met up with a nice guy who is setting up his own business, doing spot repair and spray painting. In a couple of weeks I will take the Jeep to him to have the fenders and the bonnet resprayed.

Jeroen