[sri_tesla]

Originally Posted by cool_dube

I own a 2016 e2o and have been following charging instructions as mentioned in the owner's manual to a "T" - result: almost 4 years into its life, my battery pack still gives me the promised range of 120 km on every single recharge.

Also, correct me if I am wrong, e20 does not have liquid cooling while Nexon has the liquid cooling which should improve the battery life and range over the years.

The main reason for Nissan Leaf to have range degradation is it is passively cooled.

[damodar]

An interesting article about the prospects of Nexon EV in Europe. With 4 more launches planned by 2022 they can target international markets with a range of offerings at different price points.
https://cleantechnica.com/2020/01/28...mpression=true

[DarthVeda]

the battery degradation talk by few members are mostly from their experience of mobile, where there is no BMS of any kind and it's made Lithium polymer based ones. Also, Nissan leaf first and second generation were notorious in battery maintenance, we should not be basing every car's battery performance on those factors. Even in Ather forum, people talk as if we have to replace the battery every 3 years, where Tarun said in the event itself that it will easily come for 5 to 7 years without any hiccups.

[ds.raikkonen]

Originally Posted by Sandeep500

Don't know why most of electric vehicles have weird alloys and front grills .

Front grill is either narrow or closed probably to reduce drag and also to give the vehicle a unique appearance, IMO.

I really hope TATA can sustain all the product development with good retail volume, and their dealers can translate all the efforts in grabbing customers over competitors, especially in the EV space.

[Raghuwire]

Fantastic pricing by TAMO. Instead of the XM I can buy the XZ at 15 Lakhs ex-showroom. With Lithium, the EV corporate taxi provider booking Tigor and Nexon EV, I guess Nexon will have a good head start. Also, with body shell being same as the ICE variant, the scaling up if required will be easy, unlike what Ather faces today. All in all, fantastic play by TAMO, by utilizing all it's group companies to provide a fantastic product.
That being said, I am inclined to go in for the subscription plan if it is launched in the next three months, else mostly will be buying it.

[SpideyBoy]

Originally Posted by wheelguy

Themselves I think, Tata Chemicals & Tata Power and all other group companies were brought together for the synergies.

This is really an added advantage for Tata Motors. Their in-house manufacturing of battery packs should be saving them costs by a great deal. A very welcome move to set up a li-ion battery plant in Gujarat. Utilizing their chroma retail outlet isn't a bad move either. This really shows they aren't just here to bring out an EV for namesake. It was also clearly mentioned they could've provided a bigger battery which gives longer range now but they didn't to keep the price aggressive. I'm excited about their upcoming EV launches. They seem to have done their homework alright.

[Vid6639]

Originally Posted by DarthVeda

the battery degradation talk by few members are mostly from their experience of mobile, where there is no BMS of any kind and it's made Lithium polymer based ones. Also, Nissan leaf first and second generation were notorious in battery maintenance, we should not be basing every car's battery performance on those factors. Even in Ather forum, people talk as if we have to replace the battery every 3 years, where Tarun said in the event itself that it will easily come for 5 to 7 years without any hiccups.

The EV cars use Li-ion batteries much like most mobile phones today. That said, the technology is improved and much more engineering gone into battery degradation prevention.

Which is why Tesla is ubiquitous in the industry for minimal battery degradation cause of the technology.

However brands like Tata and MG are relatively unknown and we don't really know the R&D and engineering behind battery degradation. It is definitely not there in current gen EV's form known manufacturers. If you notice my post I mentioned MG and Tata but not Hyundai with the Kona cause the Kona is a mainstream EV sold with the same powertrain in multiple vehicles as well as shared with Kia.

With Tata and MG, we don't have any data or if there's any mention of minimum degradation after 3,4,5,7,8 years. This should be mentioned in their warranty for confidence. This is a new thing for India and degradation for our summers where temperatures are in high 40 degrees are surely going to be seen. Same goes for winters in Northern India.

Either there should be long term data on battery degradation or there should be warranty terms to guarantee battery degradation over time. This is what is real peace of mind before buying EV.

8 years warranty on motor is not a big thing and neither is 8years warranty on battery without terms and conditions of battery degradation. If you buy a Nexon EV today and after 5 years you are left with 50% charge. If the manufacturer denies warranty claim as it still moves for 125kms on a single charge and their warranty change condition is if it's fully dead then there is no use at all.

Some reading on battery degradation:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/billrob.../#2ff3bf1621d9

https://www.geotab.com/blog/ev-battery-health/

https://batteryuniversity.com/learn/...ric_vehicle_ev

[dragracer567]

I should point out that given the Nexon EV's pricing, the cost of the Tigor EV seems extremely overpriced. Even the price that the E20 used to sell at seems overpriced at this point!

Also, when we are talking about cost saving in EVs, remember that you don't have to do expensive services like in the ICEs, EVs are simpler to maintain! Also, if you live in the city, you ever have to visit a petrol station since you'll charge the car overnight like your smartphone. It might seem inconvenient now but in about a decade we will laugh about the idiosyncrasies of ICEs


Link: Engineering explained lists some of the pros and cons of EVs (specifically Tesla model 3) in everyday life - stuff we don't normally think about or read in EV car reviews.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cXkRcuwoIm4

[nasa_hubble]

Originally Posted by Vid6639

If you notice my post I mentioned MG and Tata but not Hyundai with the Kona cause the Kona is a mainstream EV.

8 years warranty on motor is not a big thing and neither is 8years warranty on battery without terms and conditions of battery degradation. If you buy a Nexon EV today and after 5 years you are left with 50% charge.

The Nexon EV has 8 year warranty and on the other hand Kona comes with 3 year warranty which is not really confidence inspiring for an Hyundai EV at this stage.

The Million rupee price difference between them is also huge one for almost the same specs. It makes more sense to but the Nexon EV.

Battery degradation is something that is to be observed in the future but even a nexon battery swap after 5 years considering your estimation of 50% fall, if true (which i dont believe will happen) will come out much cheaper than the Kona.

This round goes to Tata.

[CarJunki]

Based on what real world numbers have been reported on range, Kona seems more mature and better product to me.
Also that Kona is available with same battery in other countries, i feel more secure about the package overall.

Both Tata and MG have to really prove real world range.

[ksameer1234]

Originally Posted by Vid6639

With Tata and MG, we don't have any data or if there's any mention of minimum degradation after 3,4,5,7,8 years. This should be mentioned in their warranty for confidence. This is a new thing for India and degradation for our summers where temperatures are in high 40 degrees are surely going to be seen. Same goes for winters in Northern India.

Either there should be long term data on battery degradation or there should be warranty terms to guarantee battery degradation over time. This is what is real peace of mind before buying EV.

8 years warranty on motor is not a big thing and neither is 8years warranty on battery without terms and conditions of battery degradation. If you buy a Nexon EV today and after 5 years you are left with 50% charge. If the manufacturer denies warranty claim as it still moves for 125kms on a single charge and their warranty change condition is if it's fully dead then there is no use at all.

Why speculate so much? The car has been launched, warranty is announced for 8 years and terms of warranty will be out with the first sale. Tata has been testing waters with EV concept for over a decade now. They had an Indica Vista EV with real worled range of over 200 km in 2010 (https://newatlas.com/tata-readies-in...-market/17156/). Battery degradation is a real phenomenon but I don't a reason to blindly speculate especially when the information is about to become public in a matter of few days.

[vennarbank]

i have two queries
1. The operating temperature in the spec sheet says -5 to 45C. This temperature mentioned is for outside climate or for temperature in the motor?
2. Is is technologically possible to swap discharged battery for a charged one. If that is the case someone innovative will begin to create outlets for same and ride the EV wave whenever it happens.

[sachinayak]

Originally Posted by CarJunki

Based on what real world numbers have been reported on range, Kona seems more mature and better product to me.
Also that Kona is available with same battery in other countries, i feel more secure about the package overall. Both Tata and MG have to really prove real world range.

Hyundai Kona Electric was launched worldwide only in 2018. So the long-term degradation of the battery for this is also an unknown.

The thing about EVs is that no car manufacturer can live on its past laurels. It is like how technology revolutions in the Photography and Consumer Electronics world let new players (OnePlus, GoPro and a whole lot of chinese companies) just brush away some existing dominant players (Kodak, Sony, Panasonic).

Hyundai certainly has a much head-start and is a much more established company, but with the Kona EV, it too is testing new-waters. Their product superiority is still unproven and thus debatable.

[mazda4life]

Originally Posted by Asish_VK

It's really great to see Tata and Mahindra is giving more importance to Safety and future tech (EV)

what is really puzzling is that, why hasn't Mahindra which invested in Reva made a foray into mainstream EV space?, by this time, with the knowledge that they would have from the Reva acquisition , XUV 300(EV) should have been launched and as per press reports, its targeted for Q1 of FY2022.

[ramnaresh_2000]

Originally Posted by sachinayak

Just a minor correction, the top-end is not 17L but 16L.

I meant on road price. Taxes + Insurance. I still don't think there are many people willing to put 17-18L on an un-tested Tata vehicle. If I recall correctly, even Team BHP official review of Harrier said to stay away from it for atleast 2 years until Tata irons out all initial niggles.

Originally Posted by 5kmiles

Paying 18lakhs for any car from non-indian manufacturer doesn't seem sensible to me in today's market. Take a look around and see what others offer for 18L. Top variants of Creta, City etc etc. Only the new comers Kia and MG have set the prices right - maybe taking losses - as a new player should. Tata cars are 4-5 lakhs cheaper than similar products and quality + service is improving. Harrier blows Creta out of the water in every single way. I believe xuv300 and nexon are superior to Venue in most areas and lag only in the interior plastics. Margins on venue and creta type products are insane.

Agree with your point totally, but sales are saying different things. People are willing to put money on Creta and Seltos, but not the same amount on Tata or Mahindra. Alturas G4 has more bells and whistles than Fortuner, yet it hardly sells even after 3L discounts. Harrier is way cheaper than Hector and yet not setting any charts on fire.