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Old 7th August 2019, 20:13   #1
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Default Mahindra confirms KUV100, XUV300 & Ford Aspire based EVs

According to a media report, Mahindra has confirmed that it is working on three new electric vehicles (EV) that are slated for launch by 2021.

Mahindra confirms KUV100, XUV300 & Ford Aspire based EVs-ekuv100.jpg

According to Pawan Goenka, MD, Mahindra, the electric version of the KUV100 will be launched by the end of this year. It will be followed by an all-electric XUV300, which is expected to be launched sometime in 2020. A Mahindra-badged, Ford Aspire-based EV is said to arrive sometime in 2021.

Reports suggest that Mahindra is also developing a standalone EV platform. EVs based on this platform are expected to be launched within the next 3-3.5 years.

Mahindra confirms KUV100, XUV300 & Ford Aspire based EVs-aspire-ev.jpg

After the E20 was discontinued, Mahindra's electric car portfolio only includes the e-Verito sedan. It is said that there are about 1,500-2,000 e-Veritos on Indian roads and 200 of these are reported to have clocked over 50,000 km.

Source: Autocar India

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Old 7th August 2019, 21:24   #2
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Default Re: Mahindra confirms KUV100, XUV300 & Ford Aspire based EVs

Hope the range is better than the current e-Verito range of 110-140.
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Old 7th August 2019, 23:39   #3
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Default Re: Mahindra confirms KUV100, XUV300 & Ford Aspire based EVs

I think it is a very bad idea to re-badge an ICE vehicle to electric. I do not want to go into reasons why an electric vehicle is an extremely difficult sell in India (from Range Anxiety to Electricity infrastructure) but even if all these are ignored, i feel that it is extremely difficult to find a target market for these re-badged vehicles. Here is why

1. The architecture of an electric vehicle is totally different. From floor mounted battery pack to low mounted electric motors, it needs to be totally different to realistically get all the benefits. Current re-badged vehicles usually will have the motor in the hood and battery below the passenger seat and eat into the trunk space making the vehicle impractical.

2. Vehicles have to be extremely efficient (aerodynamically and otherwise). Good selling electric vehicles have LED power saving lamps all around, efficient motor for powering all accessories (AC, power windows), a very aerodynamic design, some vehicles even going to the extent of fully capping alloy wheels to reduce drag. It will be a tough fight for these ICE vehicle to be re engineered to meet all these exclusive needs of an electric.

3. The brand name and exclusivity. It is difficult to associate these vehicle nameplates to an electric vehicle! If the ICE vehicle does not sell well, how can an electric vehicle build off of that vehicle sell? Tough chance.

In short, you would be spending a lot of money modifying the car to make it electric without a lot of benefits. The best bet would be to go all in on a new platform exclusively for an electric vehicle rather than doing a half job on an existing vehicle. Even creating a new brand for electric wing of the company wont be a bad idea. I think part of the reason why Tesla can hit those numbers is because of the brand exclusivity.

Last edited by Eddy : 8th August 2019 at 00:00. Reason: spacing for better readability
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Old 8th August 2019, 10:19   #4
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Default Re: Mahindra confirms KUV100, XUV300 & Ford Aspire based EVs

Quote:
Originally Posted by twin_turbo View Post
I think it is a very bad idea to re-badge an ICE vehicle to electric.
+1 to your arguments against.

However, there is the significant advantage of reducing overall costs with 'Re-badging'. Since vendors would not have to be developed for the newer models and R & D costs can also be limited.
Moreover, the testing shall be limited to the engine and not on the car dynamics AFAIK.

It will make an interesting value proposition. You definitely could have increased 10-20% range/efficiency with a proper design/structure, but the costs/unit sold would be a big deterrent.

These are baby steps, the manufacturer will adopt extensive research only if there is viable scalability and it favours his/her PL statement.
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Old 8th August 2019, 10:19   #5
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Default Re: Mahindra confirms KUV100, XUV300 & Ford Aspire based EVs

Quote:
Originally Posted by twin_turbo View Post
I think it is a very bad idea to re-badge an ICE vehicle to electric. I do not want to go into reasons why an electric vehicle is an extremely difficult sell in India (from Range Anxiety to Electricity infrastructure) but even if all these are ignored, i feel that it is extremely difficult to find a target market for these re-badged vehicles.
While I agree that its better to have separate platforms for EVs which will bring greater efficiency and other advantages, Hyundai/Kia are able to convert the Kona/Niro platform to EVs and still able to develop very efficient vehicles. Problem for the likes of Mahindra and Tata is they are entering the EV market late just like Ford, Toyota, etc... New platform development takes 3-4 years minimum and they don't want to be left behind as the EV sales are growing rapidly. That is why Ford had to partner with startups like Rivian or traditional rivals like VW to use already developed platforms. Toyota also doing the same with the likes of Chinese partners GAC and new partner BYD.

Its more about time rather than money for most of these big automakers. While Hyundai/Kia are able to use the existing platforms for EVs successfully, they are also developing new platforms for EVs separately. Among traditional automakers Hyundai/Kia, GM, VW group (VW, Audi, Porsche, Skoda, Seat) have the advantage of developing EVs and platforms much earlier in addition to Chinese companies like BYD, Geely, SAIC(MG), etc...

Biggest advantage for reusing the existing platforms is rapid development of battery technology over the last few years. Renault Zoe 2013 has 22kWh battery while 2016 model has double capacity at 44.kWh and 2019 model has 55 kWh battery all within same dimensions and package. Kia Soul capacity has increased from 30kWh to 64 kWh in just 3 years. All these are due to rapid battery density improvements each year.

Last edited by sri_tesla : 8th August 2019 at 10:45.
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Old 8th August 2019, 10:31   #6
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Default Re: Mahindra confirms KUV100, XUV300 & Ford Aspire based EVs

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Originally Posted by india008 View Post
Hope the range is better than the current e-Verito range of 110-140.
Yeah. Its going to be 200km+ as they gonna use battery pack of 25kWh. But the question is whether Mahindra is the only one who is going to sell it or Ford too will think to make it to their showrooms ??
Also we can expect Tata to upgrade the range of Tigor EV (current: 142km) once they start selling it to private customers.
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Old 8th August 2019, 13:47   #7
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Default Re: Mahindra confirms KUV100, XUV300 & Ford Aspire based EVs

Quote:
Originally Posted by twin_turbo View Post
If the ICE vehicle does not sell well, how can an electric vehicle build off of that vehicle sell? Tough chance.

In short, you would be spending a lot of money modifying the car to make it electric without a lot of benefits. The best bet would be to go all in on a new platform exclusively for an electric vehicle rather than doing a half job on an existing vehicle.
Isn't this precisely the reason why the vehicles mentioned in the thread want to use the existing platform of the ICE to sell an EV as well? They want to avoid development cost for a new platform which is significantly high when they know that competent vehicles (talking about the Aspire) themselves don't sell in the required volumes.

I say such a move is welcome since it lays the foundation for a low cost EV landscape which is not significantly costlier than the equivalent ICE counterpart and this itself will become a selling point as people will be able to compare apple to apple and soon see the running cost/km is considerably lower for the EV (remember the diesel vs petrol debate).

Once the economies of scale and the pricing of battery components reduce due to mass production, then we can have dedicated platforms for each vehicle type.

In my view, the next 5-6 years are like a proving ground for EV launches and most customers who buy them will be early adopters as well as guinea pigs in some cases. However, the years after that is when we will have really capable and efficient products.

Last edited by racer_ash : 8th August 2019 at 13:52.
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Old 8th August 2019, 14:07   #8
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Default Re: Mahindra confirms KUV100, XUV300 & Ford Aspire based EVs

Quote:
Originally Posted by twin_turbo View Post
I think it is a very bad idea to re-badge an ICE vehicle to electric. I do not want to go into reasons why an electric vehicle is an extremely difficult sell in India (from Range Anxiety to Electricity infrastructure) but even if all these are ignored, i feel that it is extremely difficult to find a target market for these re-badged vehicles.
Very good point. IMHO for existing platforms, Hybrid tech is the way to go and EVs should not have past and current ICE engine variants at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sri_tesla View Post
While I agree that its better to have separate platforms for EVs which will bring greater efficiency and other advantages, Hyundai/Kia are able to convert the Kona/Niro platform to EVs and still able to develop very efficient vehicles. Problem for the likes of Mahindra and Tata is they are entering the EV market late just like Ford, Toyota, etc... New platform development takes 3-4 years minimum and they don't want to be left behind as the EV sales are growing rapidly. That is why Ford had to partner with startups like Rivian or traditional rivals like VW to use already developed platforms. Toyota also doing the same with the likes of Chinese partners GAC and new partner BYD.
EV is the future and it's a long game. If companies are serious, then there's no shortcuts to it. They have to invest the time and money NOW. Half hearted efforts will only cost them more in the future.

In the Indian context, specifically to the products Mahindra and Ford are trying to offer in 2021, I'll place my bets on FLOP.

Failed products/nameplates seldom get a second chance in India.

Hypothetically speaking, if all things related to EV tech are the same between a Swift EV and Aspire EV, which one do you think people will buy?
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Old 8th August 2019, 21:27   #9
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Default Re: Mahindra confirms KUV100, XUV300 & Ford Aspire based EVs

Mahindra confirms KUV100, XUV300 & Ford Aspire based EVs-ekuv100-1.jpg

Mahindra confirms KUV100, XUV300 & Ford Aspire based EVs-ekuv100-2.jpg

Mahindra confirms KUV100, XUV300 & Ford Aspire based EVs-ekuv100-3.jpg

Mahindra eKUV100 Prototype Review, Test Drive by Autocar India.
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Old 8th August 2019, 21:59   #10
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Default Re: Mahindra confirms KUV100, XUV300 & Ford Aspire based EVs

Mahindra eKUV100 range is mentioned as 120 km. That might be a major deterrent in one's purchase decision.
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