[Knightrider]

Originally Posted by 1.2TSI7DSG

I would rather say they are spot-on against Tiago EV in terms of positioning. They have nearly the same specs with hopefully more space and better ride and handling. The footprint is perfect for someone who wants to have a second car for his daily office commute of 15-20 km each way (charging would last a week).

Totally agree. They are targeting Tiago-EV as a competitor and not the Nexon-EV or XUV4OO. The ICE C3 starts at Rs.5.98L. The eC3 might start at 8.49L or even lesser to compete with Tiago EV. Currently, most of the Indian buyers want EV as a second car for daily city commuting. This fits in perfectly. If they manage to bring the most affordable EV, they might sell in decent numbers.

[ashutoshb]

When I sat in a test e C3, it immediately reminded me of my first car, the Alto lx, which I had, way back in 2004.

Built to a cost interiors, IVRMs with stick thingy, no rear wiper et al. I didnt mind the budget interiors back then, it was my first car, or you can say the first step of the ladder. I was just happy that I have got a car.

And I somehow understood, who Citroen is targeting here. The first time buyers. Because only this logic makes sense.

Anyone who is upgrading from a budget hatch will most likely skip the C3, because it isn't premium enough to be called an upgrade.

The first time buyers, I agree, have matured. They want all the features in their first car as well. But Citroen, seems like, is still pinning their hopes on them. Hoping they will be forgiving enough and consider their product.

With the ICE C3, it was a cheaper entry to the big hatch / pseudo SUV club and with the E C3, its the EV club.

A micro SUV looking EV at the Tiago EV's price, might get people to their showrooms.

Another logic is, they have the C3 Aircross in the pipeline and is built on the same platform. They need to have appropriate price gap between the two.

If the C3 is barebones, its Aircross sibling should come with all the bells and whistles.

And this also seems like the reason why they call the C3 a hatch, because their 'SUV' is still coming.

Ideally, they should have cashed in on their European heritage, and launched products in line with the 'premium' tag, which comes attached with it. Solid built cars, brimmed with features and people would have looked at their cars as serious upgrades to the Korean, Japanese and Indian brands.

Their strategy has, at least, failed on me. I was interested in their car, but have looked away after seeing the feature list and the build quality. I would wait rather wait for the Punch ev.

[purohitanuj]

Originally Posted by Sabyasworld

Battery is 'Naturally Cooled'. Not sure if this means a air cooled battery like the Nissan Leaf. If yes it will certainly be a problem, specially during the hot summer months.

Its shocking to see this design with battery pack sticking outside and calling it "air cooled" . I would be scared driving this thinking of the 170mm lowest point and that too being the battery pack directly. How good can take hits?

Looks like bad design to me. Could work internationally where the road conditions are perfect, unlike ours.

[vsrivatsa]

Citroen bets on fleet segment to get initial charge for new EV drive with e-C3



Read more at: Link

[SKC-auto]

^^This will be a better strategy, with companies like OLA announcing 10000 EV cabs in one year in Bengaluru, a cheap EV as a taxi will be wonderful, want to see Bengaluru full of eC3's.

[Sankar]

When I heard of Citroen's electric C3 I expected it would be bring the fight to Tiago EV and being a global brand thought it would do better. But now looking at the specs it has all the makings of being a flop. Not just the buyers but the dealers too would be disappointed looking at the specs.

Did they really mean aircooled when they say natural cooled ? When Toyota used an aircooled 1.6KWh NiMH pack in the Hycross hybrid instead of using the aircooled LiIon pack citing our tropical conditions; I don't know how it would be okay for Citroen to run a 29KWh LiIon (LiFePo) pack in the same tropical conditions.

[sunilarkt]

I'm not quite sure how this would remotely pass the side impact crash test !

Originally Posted by purohitanuj

Its shocking to see this design with battery pack sticking outside and calling it "air cooled" . I would be scared driving this thinking of the 170mm lowest point and that too being the battery pack directly. How good can take hits?

Looks like bad design to me. Could work internationally where the road conditions are perfect, unlike ours.

Attachment 2407279

[AdhikR]

Citroen missed a trick here.

They had a solid template to build a feature loaded, consumer-focused EV and they come up with a barebones car that actually appears LESS desirable than the ICE counterpart.

Sure, they might be targeting the fleet market, but I don't think this will click. Fleet operators will prioritise reliability and stick with an established brand. The fleet-focus also won't help Citroen's fledgling brand in India.

[Aman2438]

I am utterly confused by the strategy of Citroen India. At one end they started with C5 Air Cross which is a premium crossover at the premium end of the market portraying themselves as a premium brand and at the other end they brought this C3 hatchback which lacks some really basic features that many customers expect even in B1 hatchbacks these days. Their car is mechanically competent as many reviewers have expressed in their reviews of the petrol C3 but the car lacks appeal. I was expecting eC3 to be a solid alternative to Tiago EV but the spec sheets and feature list suggest something else.

[guptad42]

Originally Posted by 1.2TSI7DSG

I would rather say they are spot-on against Tiago EV in terms of positioning. They have nearly the same specs with hopefully more space and better ride and handling. The footprint is perfect for someone who wants to have a second car for his daily office commute of 15-20 km each way (charging would last a week).

Where M&M is targeting the upper segment with a nexon + big boot; I would be happy if they launch it around 10-15l. Being electric, hoping Citroen's disadvantage of low service centres will not be a problem. That apart, battery life, life of the company in India, and poor resale will be the negatives of the car.

For the 20km each way drive you mentioned, even the tiago MR XT will be more than enough with just 19KWH battery. It will be approx. 9.4-9.5L ex-showroom after revised pricing. It also shows up in TaMo's booking data- they received more LR 24KWH model bookings than they expected, but in metros (with some chargers in place) MR 19KWH model has good bookings. And buying a small car with a small battery pack has value in terms of a smaller carbon footprint, but 19kwh/140-150km real range is just too small for most people to accept.

Citroen's Achilles heel: They have not understood that a 10Lac rupee car is still an aspirational product in India, even if it is used for basic commute duties. TaMo have worked on making the tiago.ev feel premium. Citroen have not.

Citroen's best path will be to set themselves apart as clearly superior to tiago, knowing that TaMo already has a reputation for EVs in India and Citroen do not. Citroen can do it with 2 variants + options approach, if they are willing.

1. A cheap base model for city commuters with range anxiety. For example, just add basic cruise control (instead of connected car tech) with the larger 29KWH battery to claim that eC3 can be the only/first car for many people who may struggle with tiago's much smaller 19-24KWH battery packs. 9.99L as intro pricing to garner initial bookings, can rise to 10.5L easily once some demand is established.

2. Higher spec model: Full featured, with same battery pack but liquid cooled. Can easily be 1.5 -2 lacs above the base model. Don't miss visible external elements like LED tail lamps, LED headlamps (can even be LED bulbs from a quality OEM in the same housing), connected car tech. Electric ORVM, IRVM dimmer, climate control, rear wiper & defogger, reversing camera etc.

Add option packs (not just individual accessories) for things like alloy wheels, leather seats and soft touch fabric pads for doors, air purifier, interior ambient lighting kit etc. that can be easily added at dealer end without too much hassle.

eC3 has the larger battery pack and larger interior size and a good suspension/ driving dynamics in it's favour already. Market these and features like wireless android auto/apple carplay for base model. They can try to upsell from tiago and undercut nexon with this approach. Will they?

[aim120]

Originally Posted by purohitanuj

Its shocking to see this design with battery pack sticking outside and calling it "air cooled" . I would be scared driving this thinking of the 170mm lowest point and that too being the battery pack directly. How good can take hits?

Looks like bad design to me. Could work internationally where the road conditions are perfect, unlike ours.

Ground clearance of 170mm should be fine considering the wheelbase length of 2540mm. A Ioniq 5 / EV6 at 178mm is worse due to its wheelbase of 3000mm, even Byd E6, Atto 3 has similar 170mm and 175mm ground clearance with 2800mm and 2720mm wheelbase respectively.

I guess they placed the battery below the floor without compromising the interior space. It also still comes with a spare wheel. So those are significant advantages.

Originally Posted by SKC-auto

^^This will be a better strategy, with companies like OLA announcing 10000 EV cabs in one year in Bengaluru, a cheap EV as a taxi will be wonderful, want to see Bengaluru full of eC3's.

This has battery pack almost the capacity of the Nexon EV prime and its also lighter in weight, hence has higher range. It also has a boot space bigger then a Tiago and Tigor EV, with wider seats and rear passengers can tuck their feet under the front seats.

So despite the lack of power and features, it still has more space then competing EV both for passenger and boot space. It also has higher range then competing EV.

If you ask me, it will do insanely well in fleet and also for those people who want a second car, with more space then say a Taigo/Tigor. The only question is how will they price this EV.

Originally Posted by guptad42

2. Higher spec model: Full featured, with same battery pack but liquid cooled. Can easily be 1.5 -2 lacs above the base model. Don't miss visible external elements like LED tail lamps, LED headlamps (can even be LED bulbs from a quality OEM in the same housing), connected car tech. Electric ORVM, IRVM dimmer, climate control, rear wiper & defogger, reversing camera etc.

If they add liquid cooling, then no one will buy the air cooled version. They will also have to bump up the performance figures to justify the price increase.

[SKC-auto]

Originally Posted by aim120

If you ask me, it will do insanely well in fleet and also for those people who want a second car, with more.space then say a Taigo/Tigor. The only question is how will they price this EV.

I too think it's not a bad car for many people just because it does not come with liquid cooled battery. LFP batteries are fine in our temperatures, also like BYD blade batteries they are tested for nail penetration.

This should make a good second car or fleet car, it all depends on the pricing.

[GTO]

Originally Posted by vsrivatsa

Citroen bets on fleet segment to get initial charge for new EV drive with e-C3

Now, I am even more confused than in my earlier post on page 6.

1. The fleet segment is the least profitable. They place bulk orders, shop on price & specifications, and usually order the base variants.

2. Individual buyers (the more profitable segment) are known to be put off by vehicles that develop a "fleet" image. Think Dzire Tour (Maruti sold it only for cabs), Indica, Logan etc. Of course, there are a few exceptions to this rule (chiefly, the Innova), yet "yellow plate" business isn't usually preferred by carmakers.

Does Citroen have brand aspirations in India or not? Toyota can get away with fleet sales & yellow plate products, but a brand new unknown nameplate like Citroen will find it hard to shrug off the image.

3. Manufacturers around the world always prioritize sales to private buyers over fleet sales. In fact, many take active measures to reduce fleet sales.

4. Many OEMs sell to the fleet only when they have excess capacity or leftover production.

And here, it is part of the main "bet". Sigh...I reiterate, the French just don't get India. They never have.

5. Speaking of fleet buyers themselves, they are extremely shrewd. They will consider a "Citroen" over a "Tata" (or more established brand) only if they get an unbeatable low price. Else, they will play it safe.

[Comrade]

1. It's BS to say they are targetting fleet. They could have always released the stripped down version in taxi white color for fleet. They are offering dual tones with those basic interiors on top-end. They are clearly targetting urban crowd. To me, it seems like they are targetting VFM or affordable tag but cutting on features and engineering will not earn them those tags.

2. Temperatures in some parts of the country reach 40+ degrees in peak summer. Also start-stop traffic not reaching 20kmph+ many times in our urban setting. We have seen DSGs fail due to heat!! I have my reservations when others say air-cooled battery would just work fine in our conditions! And its not a cheap component that can be replaced easily! If Citroen denies warranty saying degradation is as per their expectation, then owners would be screwed!

[purohitanuj]

Originally Posted by aim120

Ground clearance of 170mm should be fine considering the wheelbase length of 2540mm....

Ground clearance of 170mm is fine, but the lowest part to call for that 170mm is the battery /pack itself. This is the problem.