Team-BHP > Electric Cars


Reply
 
14,741 views Search this Thread
Old 30th May 2023, 06:31   #46
BHPian
 
evil_grin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2020
Location: Hyderabad
Posts: 276
Thanked: 947 Times
Re: EV vs Petrol for long-term city usage

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoBabyGo View Post
I am taking 10 years life of my second car which I am planning to buy. My current monthly expense on fuel is Rs.11000/- and If I buy EV, it will be reduced to around Rs.2500/-.

My budget for new car is 9-12 lacs on road Delhi / Noida.
You haven't mentioned a need for two cars or urge for changing your car or fascination with the EV driving experience. And most of your discussion is around the costs. So I'm assuming reducing your expenses is your primary objective.

You'll have 10 lakhs in running costs over 10 years. But you'll have to spend 12 lakhs today to do so. How exactly are you saving money? Isn't continuing to commute in your City cheaper?
evil_grin is offline   (1) Thanks
Old 30th May 2023, 10:51   #47
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jan 2023
Location: Noida
Posts: 215
Thanked: 570 Times
Infractions: 0/1 (5)
Re: EV vs Petrol for long-term city usage

Quote:
Originally Posted by evil_grin View Post
You haven't mentioned a need for two cars or urge for changing your car or fascination with the EV driving experience. And most of your discussion is around the costs. So I'm assuming reducing your expenses is your primary objective.

You'll have 10 lakhs in running costs over 10 years. But you'll have to spend 12 lakhs today to do so. How exactly are you saving money? Isn't continuing to commute in your City cheaper?
Hi evil_grin - I am entitled to a company car every 5 years. My current Honda City is little over 5 years old and I can now get a new car as per my entitlement. Honda City is transferred to me and hence it will remain with me. My budget for new car is under 12 lacs out of which 10 lacs is my entitlement and maximum I am okay to spend from my pocket is 2 lacs. I agree that I have fascination of new technology and EV is top most in the list. With EV I will get a proper AT car as well as it will save me minimum Rs.8500/- per month on fuel. Those who have not driven an EV can not imagine the pleasure of driving it.

My primary objective is to get an AT (not AMT), saving cost as my 98% drive is within city (home to office & back or driving around NCR). My current expense of fuel is Rs.11000/- minimum.
GoBabyGo is offline   (2) Thanks
Old 1st June 2023, 12:24   #48
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jan 2023
Location: Noida
Posts: 215
Thanked: 570 Times
Infractions: 0/1 (5)
Re: EV vs Petrol for long-term city usage

Hello BHPians - Something new I have come across and seek your suggestion on this:

"We need to have 3 phase meter and also need upgrade our KW load if we opt for EV. I read that if my current domestic load is 7KW and I need to install 7.2kWh charger, than need to have additional 7KW load in addition to existing 7KW. If this is true then I have to spend money for additional load (close to 15K for additional load).

Even if I go with 3.3kWh charger, I need to have it in a separate phase i.e. my household items will run on separate phase and EV load on separate phase. (My current 7KW load is barely sufficient for my domestic use). If I don't go for 7.2kWh charger and use domestic meter for charging, then how much load I need to increase so that EV will charge without any trouble beside my daily household electrical items consumption."

I can ask this question to Tata or MG dealers, but I would like to have user experience before asking to a sales person.

PS - My question is for general people's awareness & knowledge too.
GoBabyGo is offline   (1) Thanks
Old 1st June 2023, 14:02   #49
Distinguished - BHPian
 
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: HR51/HR29/HR26
Posts: 2,390
Thanked: 17,050 Times
Re: EV vs Petrol for long-term city usage

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoBabyGo View Post
Hello BHPians - Something new I have come across and seek your suggestion on this:

"We need to have 3 phase meter and also need upgrade our KW load if we opt for EV. I read that if my current domestic load is 7KW and I need to install 7.2kWh charger, than need to have additional 7KW load in addition to existing 7KW. If this is true then I have to spend money for additional load (close to 15K for additional load).

Even if I go with 3.3kWh charger, I need to have it in a separate phase i.e. my household items will run on separate phase and EV load on separate phase. (My current 7KW load is barely sufficient for my domestic use). If I don't go for 7.2kWh charger and use domestic meter for charging, then how much load I need to increase so that EV will charge without any trouble beside my daily household electrical items consumption."

I can ask this question to Tata or MG dealers, but I would like to have user experience before asking to a sales person.

PS - My question is for general people's awareness & knowledge too.
Fast charging setup of any kind at home is really not required for a small city car like Tiago EV. The OP can charge his car overnight every other day using a normal single phase 15amp socket, the kind we use for ACs and geysers and dishwashers. From a charging point of view think of Tiago EV as adding an extra AC to your house.

7kw and above chargers come into picture once the battery size increases to 45kwh or so. Then, it becomes impractical to slow charge at 2.5 or 3kw. Thumb rule, every 10kwh of battery gives 60-70km of range, and needs 3-3.5hours of charging time on basic slow charging. Calculate accordingly.
Shreyans_Jain is online now   (1) Thanks
Old 1st June 2023, 14:06   #50
BHPian
 
Join Date: Sep 2022
Location: Kolkata
Posts: 26
Thanked: 36 Times
Re: EV vs Petrol for long-term city usage

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoBabyGo View Post
Hello BHPians - Something new I have come across and seek your suggestion on this:

"We need to have 3 phase meter and also need upgrade our KW load if we opt for EV. I read that if my current domestic load is 7KW and I need to install 7.2kWh charger, than need to have additional 7KW load in addition to existing 7KW. If this is true then I have to spend money for additional load (close to 15K for additional load).

Even if I go with 3.3kWh charger, I need to have it in a separate phase i.e. my household items will run on separate phase and EV load on separate phase. (My current 7KW load is barely sufficient for my domestic use). If I don't go for 7.2kWh charger and use domestic meter for charging, then how much load I need to increase so that EV will charge without any trouble beside my daily household electrical items consumption."

I can ask this question to Tata or MG dealers, but I would like to have user experience before asking to a sales person.

PS - My question is for general people's awareness & knowledge too.
Multiple options are available. You can take a separate meter connection for EV charging. Many states are providing flat rate subsidised meters for EV charging only.
You can increase your existing load also if you are taking the 3.3KW charger. It depends on what charger you are opting for and the car you are looking for.

3.3KW charger is sufficient for Tiago/Nexon Prime/Tigor, while it's better to take 7.2KW charger for Nexon Max/MG ZS/Hyundai Kona.

If you want to take whole load of Domestic+EV 7.2KW charging in one meter then 3 phase may be required but it will be a costly affair as wires have to be changed and connection system have to be tweaked.

I recommend taking a separate EV meter if it is available in your locality.
souravdas808 is offline   (1) Thanks
Old 1st June 2023, 14:22   #51
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jan 2023
Location: Noida
Posts: 215
Thanked: 570 Times
Infractions: 0/1 (5)
Re: EV vs Petrol for long-term city usage

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shreyans_Jain View Post
Fast charging setup of any kind at home is really not required for a small city car like Tiago EV. The OP can charge his car overnight every other day using a normal single phase 15amp socket, the kind we use for ACs and geysers and dishwashers. From a charging point of view think of Tiago EV as adding an extra AC to your house.

7kw and above chargers come into picture once the battery size increases to 45kwh or so. Then, it becomes impractical to slow charge at 2.5 or 3kw. Thumb rule, every 10kwh of battery gives 60-70km of range, and needs 3-3.5hours of charging time on basic slow charging. Calculate accordingly.
Thanks Shreyans - Let's take example:

1. Nexon EV Prime with 30kWh battery. If I put it on 15amp socket with 20% charging left at 8.30pm and remove charger at 8.30am (next day), do you think it will charge 100% in 12 hrs.

2. Nexon EV Max with 40.5kWh battery - Similar situation

3. MG ZS EV with 50.3kWh battery - Similar situation.

What I mean is a user with just 15amp socket at home should charge his/her EV considering the time he/she has to charge e.g. I generally reach home at 8.30pm and leave for office at 8.30am. If I buy EV, I should put it on charging when charging is at 30% to ensure it is 100% in 12 hrs. We have zero power cut in Noida (99.99% times). There is a 25KW fast charger 100 meter from my home (its a car service workshop, they have 3 points there).

There may be few people who are like me and not interested in 7.2kWh charger (at additional cost) and hence asking. If I will have only 15amp socket for charging then I will have to calculate my range ARAI minus 50% to give me actual mileage (100% to 30%) after which I have to charge it. Although this is very theoretical, but I do my working like this.
GoBabyGo is offline  
Old 1st June 2023, 14:28   #52
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jan 2023
Location: Noida
Posts: 215
Thanked: 570 Times
Infractions: 0/1 (5)
Re: EV vs Petrol for long-term city usage

Quote:
Originally Posted by souravdas808 View Post
Multiple options are available. You can take a separate meter connection for EV charging. Many states are providing flat rate subsidised meters for EV charging only.
You can increase your existing load also if you are taking the 3.3KW charger. It depends on what charger you are opting for and the car you are looking for.

3.3KW charger is sufficient for Tiago/Nexon Prime/Tigor, while it's better to take 7.2KW charger for Nexon Max/MG ZS/Hyundai Kona.

If you want to take whole load of Domestic+EV 7.2KW charging in one meter then 3 phase may be required but it will be a costly affair as wires have to be changed and connection system have to be tweaked.

I recommend taking a separate EV meter if it is available in your locality.
Thanks souravdas808 - I need small explanation, I have 7KW load which is barely sufficient for my domestic use. If I put my EV on charging at night and also use my 3 ACs + normal home stuff, will 7KW manage to take the load of EV or I will have to increase my 7KW load to say 10KW to make EV's additional load. How much load EV take if one charge from 16amp socket (as compared to say running additional AC). In my case if my load run above 7KW, then my meter trip and I have to reset it with a code. Which I why I have to be very careful to be within 7KW load (for example I can not run my 4 ACs together 3 are 1.5 ton and one is 2 ton AC)
GoBabyGo is offline  
Old 1st June 2023, 14:49   #53
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jan 2023
Location: Palakkad
Posts: 179
Thanked: 496 Times
Re: EV vs Petrol for long-term city usage

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoBabyGo View Post
How much load EV take if one charge from 16amp socket (as compared to say running additional AC).
Theoretically you can draw at most 16 x 230 W = 3.6 kW out of it but I think the spec
of the charger is 3.3 kW.
electric_eel is offline   (1) Thanks
Old 1st June 2023, 14:51   #54
BHPian
 
coldice4u's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Delhi
Posts: 343
Thanked: 601 Times
Re: EV vs Petrol for long-term city usage

My Tiago EV charges at a rate of approx. 10% an hour on the 3.3KW slow charger. Since the battery on the LR Tiago EV is 24KW, so a 3.3KW charger adds about 2.2-2.4 KW per hour which indicates it draws about 2400W. I would expect the Nexon EVs to draw a similar amount of power on the default 3.3KW charger.

Last edited by coldice4u : 1st June 2023 at 14:52.
coldice4u is offline   (1) Thanks
Old 1st June 2023, 15:11   #55
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jan 2023
Location: Noida
Posts: 215
Thanked: 570 Times
Infractions: 0/1 (5)
Re: EV vs Petrol for long-term city usage

Quote:
Originally Posted by coldice4u View Post
My Tiago EV charges at a rate of approx. 10% an hour on the 3.3KW slow charger. Since the battery on the LR Tiago EV is 24KW, so a 3.3KW charger adds about 2.2-2.4 KW per hour which indicates it draws about 2400W. I would expect the Nexon EVs to draw a similar amount of power on the default 3.3KW charger.
Thanks coldice4u - Does 3.3KW slow charger and 16amp charging socket has same charging speed or there is a difference. Sorry for such a silly question please.

What is your experience on charging. Do you recommend charging an EV every day even if it is charged say at 50% or we should ideally charge it at less than 30% (between 10% to 30%) or charging EV randomly will impact battery degradation in long run. My intended use of EV will be close to 2 lacs km in 10 years. I am waiting for Punch EV to launch with 24kWh battery pack.
GoBabyGo is offline  
Old 1st June 2023, 18:03   #56
BHPian
 
ferrarirules's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Faridabad
Posts: 461
Thanked: 1,333 Times
Re: EV vs Petrol for long-term city usage

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoBabyGo View Post
Thanks souravdas808 - I need small explanation, I have 7KW load which is barely sufficient for my domestic use.
No it is not sufficient based on the requirement you have. It is better you get it extended 10kw. You can start on that process now as that it is not a simple process if it is to be done by discom

Quote:
Originally Posted by GoBabyGo View Post
Thanks coldice4u - Does 3.3KW slow charger and 16amp charging socket has same charging speed or there is a difference. Sorry for such a silly question please.

What is your experience on charging. Do you recommend charging an EV every day even if it is charged say at 50% or we should ideally charge it at less than 30% (between 10% to 30%) or charging EV randomly will impact battery degradation in long run. My intended use of EV will be close to 2 lacs km in 10 years. I am waiting for Punch EV to launch with 24kWh battery pack.
A 3.3 kw charger plugs into a 16 amp socket, charger usually draws 2.6 KW not the complete 3.3 kw load. Charging every day depends on your need / distance travelled daily. Coming to charging pattern, you should charge to 100% as much as possible. Also charge from below 20% to 100% once a month for cell balancing. My Nexon max charges from 10% to 100% in 14-15 hours. As tiago and tigor have 24 kw battery, they charge much faster.
ferrarirules is offline   (2) Thanks
Old 1st June 2023, 20:32   #57
FNM
BHPian
 
Join Date: Jan 2023
Location: Mumbai
Posts: 65
Thanked: 25 Times
Re: EV vs Petrol for long-term city usage

Aside from the Punch EV and the updated Nexon EV, are there any other small EVs going to be launched within one year, say by April 2024? Such as a next-gen Kona etc?

Last edited by FNM : 1st June 2023 at 20:43.
FNM is offline  
Reply

Most Viewed
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Copyright 2000 - 2023, Team-BHP.com
Proudly powered by E2E Networks