[ferrarirules]

Originally Posted by volkman10

All negative response is good and failure of this will be sweeter so that no other manufacturer (car) will dare to do a BaaS

A manufacturer could still do BaaS but in the right way. Whenever you provide something as a service. First premise is that the "something" is owned by the service provider.

If MG wanted to do this right, they would have launched a plan which would have charged Rs x per km or Rs x per month from the customer for using the battery . The payment is till you are using the service/car. This Rs x would have included insurance, maintenance of battery and risk of ownership of battery by MG.

In case the customer was done with the car, he could have sold it back to MG as part of buyback or sold it to the second owner. If sold to MG, they would have gotten, the car back and paid the customer an agreed price and the battery was already theirs. If sold to second owner, the second owner would have kept on paying for battery as a service.

[Dabhi73]

Originally Posted by ron178

Or…they could just be using the trip odometer? I can understand your concerns about privacy, but the allegations seem to be based on an assumption that’s not extremely likely to be true or untrue.

I think we have to keep this in mind. There is no clarity on data storage , how are they going to store , what data they will keep. Whether the data will be stored in India or it will be somewhere else.

Most of the common people don't understand the power of data sharing, it can be used for number of reasons. If this data is comprised, then just imagine the scenarios it can lead to. Also what is the guarantee of they will not share this data for commercial purposes or they themselves will not use for commercial purposes. I really find this fishy. Someone can argue about data sharing through our mobile but in case of mobile we can always turn the data sharing, location settings off. But here we don't have the option but to share our data.

My point is why complicate things , why not just launch the car by adding battery cost. They can run lease option for few others who might've interested. Is it just to catch eyeballs with pricetag under 10L or not having enough confidence in the product.

[ZenMaster]

Let also not forget how MG might be able to claim losses on the their books since they might be paying upfront but getting paid only partially by the customer for battery packs they are selling to customers for the first year at least.

Also since this the batteries are MG's property, I bet they'll also be claiming hefty amounts as depreciation as well which they are not passing onto the customer.

[Contrapunto]

Originally Posted by ferrarirules

In case the customer was done with the car, he could have sold it back to MG as part of buyback or sold it to the second owner. If sold to MG, they would have gotten, the car back and paid the customer an agreed price and the battery was already theirs. If sold to second owner, the second owner would have kept on paying for battery as a service.

That is indeed the textbook way of doing this BaaS thingie. However, for executing this scheme "at national scale" for retail customers brings up a whole host of complexities that will need a long, separate post. That's why MG has structured this scheme in a way that dumps 95% of the risk on the customer and maybe 5% at most to the financier of the battery.

Where your scheme WILL WORK, though is in a fleet setting- whether ride-hailing platforms or corporate fleet operators (hotels, factory/ inter-office/ BPO shuttles etc). In these settings, typically, the entire operating cost is transferred to the customer with a negotiated markup which constitutes the "invoice value". You run more Kms, you pay a larger bill, its as simple as that. With some sense, MG will underplay this BaaS scheme for retail customers and make a pitch for fleet operators for ALL their EV models.

But then, who can defeat a bad idea whose time has come?

[vigsom]

Originally Posted by Venkatesh

Few pictures

This car quite resembles the Fiat Multipla with its weird exterior and "rounded" bits inside

Exterior Windsor


Fiat Multipla (Image Courtesy Parkers UK)


Interior Windsor


Interiors of the Multipla (Image courtesy Parkers UK)

[mariner80]

Originally Posted by Dabhi73

I think we have to keep this in mind. There is no clarity on data storage , how are they going to store , what data they will keep. Whether the data will be stored in India

I believe I read somewhere that MG gave a commitment to store consumer data in MS Azure datacenters in India. MG has previously sold "AI" cars where such concerns were raised.

---

Also, on an unrelated note, I doubt MG would have been able to lease/loan directly to consumers without involving NBFCs/Banks. Financing would be in RBI's domain and it would not be easy convincing RBI given MG's "heritage".

---

Maybe BaaS is one way of keeping sales low until MG achieves enough localization to maintain margins. Then they may sell the car with battery included.

[sunilkumarp89]

Guys, use the Avira chatbot in MG website for any queries. It answers clearly for almost everything. Here is what I have extracted and it seems a bit different from the FAQ section.

* In BaaS, the battery has a lifetime warranty
* The battery rental at 3.5 Rs. per km needs to be paid for the entire lifetime of the vehicle.
* The billing will be on a monthly basis
* Idle time will not be considered for billing. Only the kilometers driven will be taken into account
* When the vehicle is sold, the next owner needs to pay the rental per km and also the lifetime warranty will be still valid for the next owner(In FAQ, I remember reading the battery lease should be closed and then the vehicle should be sold and the next owner will be entitled for a warranty of 8 years/160000 kms. May be they changed their mind after going through this thread in team bhp

[SmartCat]

Originally Posted by sunilkumarp89

Guys, use the Avira chatbot in MG website for any queries. It answers clearly for almost everything.

Miss Avira is contradicting herself when she says "minimum running required" is 1500 km per month and then says "you will only be charged for kms you drive and idle time will not result in billing"

Also, Miss Avira is hallucinating (AI terminology) when she says minimize idle time to conserve battery and improve "fuel" efficiency.

[Sedate driver]

Originally Posted by Dabhi73

Please let me know if MG has mentioned about how are they going to count the distance. It seems they will fit GPS or other navigation system for this purpose. This will expose their customer's whereabouts and also all his commute which I think is a great threat to privacy. I will be very much sceptical to share this data and that too to Chinese company. I think this is very dangerous.

MG already has the tracking feature in Hector and other cars as well. Their ismart app tracks the distance and route travelled for every trip. The tracking doesn't work only if there is no data in the in built SIM. Also the location of the car when parked is also available. This tracking data is available for a period of 1 year through the ismart app.

[speed79]

That is one ugly looking car!! It gets added to my list of ugly cars which include Verito Vibe, KUV100, Exter and Comet. The cross stitched rear seats in Cloud are abominable. I wonder why people are still discussing about the battery lease when this car looks so horrible.

When one buys anything Chinese stuff connected to the internet, one should not be worried about data safety because the data would definitely be sent to some servers in China. It is rumoured that when Indian army went to stop Chinese in Doklam, Chinese knew beforehand that Indian army is coming as some soldiers had Chinese phones.

[ferrarirules]

Just got a brochure from MG about the BaaS. Here are some details on the BaaS providers and plans. My thoughts
1. Still there is * T&C apply
2. It is still not clear on details like foreclosure or the MG buyback. What is the price to be paid of the battery?
3. Continue paying rental is mentioned so may be the second owner gets to pay the rental and enjoy unlimited warranty
4. Pay for additional kms is "NO" for Bajaj Finserv. Does that mean i cannot drive beyond 1500 kms?
5. Vidyut charges only Rs. 3.5 per km, are there any charges once I am done with the vehicle?
6. What is the 9% interest rate being charged by Bajaj and Hero?

Trying to get answers to this so that people are aware of what they are signing up for.



PDF as received from MG.

[nimbus1]

Great launch by MG, they have knocked the air out of everyone I feel. Now this disruptive buzz will definitely increase the footfall. This is the winning moment where MG will prepare the sheet showing how much upfront payment to be made for the battery rental and without it.

In simple terms this is a time and material model, where you pay as your go however as with any time and material model there is a minimum commitment so that the company offering it does not suffer. It is easy to ridicule MG saying what a bad idea they have come up with but then look at Comet, its selling 1000+ in numbers. The fixed sunroof is a good idea, and I can definitely vouch that in 2Yrs of ownership of a Vehicle fitted with sunroof I have not opened it even 2 times, there is simply no use case except getting out of it and showing the world that you own one with this feature.

Disrupters will always get ridiculed; did I mention that it was only after MG that others started following the Sunroof thingy (Panoramic). If the premium brands like Audi and BMW can user subscription service, then why not with BAAS. Simple example is I paid for the AMC upfront, now with every service when I see a zero bill the happiness index is so high. There won't be any monthly payment I can bet on that; people will pay upfront for no. of kilometers and then they will forget all about it. Imagine getting a car this big at price point of 10-12 L.

We will soon see Tata and Mahindra following this model.

[Doonite]

As a personal rule, I stay away from any product whose finances I can't make sense of. If I can't the understand and 5 other people can't do the same either, I'd rather stay away.

It's not like there's any shortage of cars in this segment.

[narayans80]

Originally Posted by ferrarirules

What is the 9% interest rate being charged by Bajaj and Hero?

Interest on the car loan.

9% interest of 8.94L gets the monthly EMI on the car (minus battery)



I think unless the battery value is declared and you know how much battery loan you have to pay, its still opened.

I think the broad terms are now clear and foreclosure is an option.

One more thing is not clear, is MG going to replace the battery after a fixed distance, say 160000 kms?

[GoBabyGo]

Hi, someone should approach them with an idea to launch Comet EV on BAAS model with starting price of 2.99 lacs + Rs.2.00 per km BAAS (plus GST), minimum 1000km monthly running and 60% buyback guarantee after 3 years 45000km. Probably many two wheeler owners will be tempted with this offer and go for Comet EV.