[nemo]

A bit off topic for this thread but if there is better place to park this post, mods pls do.

I was duped by an eBay seller of an order I placed a few months ago. The order never got shipped but eBay is claiming they have been delivered. I have all the proofs to prove that I've not received the products, including a letter from Blue Dart which clearly says the goods did not travel on their network.

I have lodged complaint with the consumer forum last week and today there was a 1st hearing for what they call the admission process. In my compliant I have mentioned eBay's Mumbai address as the Opposite party's address, which is available on their website, observing this the judge told me that I either have to pursue this case in Mumbai consumer forum or I need to provide a local entity address for them to admit this case. In my brief search I couldn't locate eBay.in's Bangalore address. I will continue to look but if any of you know it pls do share.

Also, pls let me know what other options I have to take a legal action against eBay. Pursuing this case in Mumbai is not an option for me. Apparently one has to visit the court at least 10 times over a period of a year.

[revved_up]

Originally Posted by nemo

A bit off topic for this thread but if there is better place to park this post, mods pls do.

I was duped by an eBay seller of an order I placed a few months ago. The order never got shipped but eBay is claiming they have been delivered. I have all the proofs to prove that I've not received the products, including a letter from Blue Dart which clearly says the goods did not travel on their network.

I have lodged complaint with the consumer forum last week and today there was a 1st hearing for what they call the admission process. In my compliant I have mentioned eBay's Mumbai address as the Opposite party's address, which is available on their website, observing this the judge told me that I either have to pursue this case in Mumbai consumer forum or I need to provide a local entity address for them to admit this case. In my brief search I couldn't locate eBay.in's Bangalore address. I will continue to look but if any of you know it pls do share.

Also, pls let me know what other options I have to take a legal action against eBay. Pursuing this case in Mumbai is not an option for me. Apparently one has to visit the court at least 10 times over a period of a year.

Hi, Sorry to hear about this incident.
As far as ebay is concerned, I have also noticed that their claims team's (or guaranteed claims) quality and eagerness to solve the issue has deteriorated. With ebay, I have always noticed that if you give a negative rating to the seller, it hurts them alot and they are willing to sort out your issue. Have you tried this?

Also, have you tried to lodge an online complaint on PORTAL FOR PUBLIC GRIEVANCES - pgportal.gov.in, AFAIK, you can lodge a complaint here irrespective of the location of the other party.

[nemo]

Originally Posted by revved_up

Also, have you tried to lodge an online complaint on PORTAL FOR PUBLIC GRIEVANCES - pgportal.gov.in, AFAIK, you can lodge a complaint here irrespective of the location of the other party.

Thank you, will check this out…

[Anupam]

Originally Posted by commonman

It was a small item costing around 6 dollars, inclusive of shipping.I think the duty side is taken care by the seller. I didnt pay anything extra. Don't know if they have shipped it as gift item . I paid for it through card. There is no issue with Alibaba as they serve to people around the world. I would suggest you to go ahead.

I have now purchased a 5ton tow rope and a iPhone case from aliexpress costing around 14usd in totality and looking forward to see how does it go with my fingers crossed

The delivery time is almost 6 weeks and the seller has apparently dispatched the material today


Sent from my iPad using Team-BHP

[bravo6]

Originally Posted by nemo

I was duped by an eBay seller of an order I placed a few months ago. The order never got shipped but eBay is claiming they have been delivered. I have all the proofs to prove that I've not received the products, including a letter from Blue Dart which clearly says the goods did not travel on their network.

If you paid by credit card, call your bank and ask for a charge back on that transaction. Show them Bluedart's letter if they ask for proof.

If eBay is claiming the item was delivered, ask them to show proof - packages will be handed over only upon signing the delivery slip.

Last resort, get a friend in Mumbai to hire a local lawyer and fight the case there.

[saket77]

Originally Posted by bravo6

If you paid by credit card, call your bank and ask for a charge back on that transaction. Show them Bluedart's letter if they ask for proof.

If eBay is claiming the item was delivered, ask them to show proof - packages will be handed over only upon signing the delivery slip.

Last resort, get a friend in Mumbai to hire a local lawyer and fight the case there.

Brings me to a question...in fact, I always think about it when the order is prepaid. What if the courier delivery guys or anyone else just puts your initials on the delivery receipt paper that they carry and take your stuff? Since the order is prepaid, this can be easily done, isn't it? And then the sellers can always show the other person's signature as proof of delivery. How would you prove that the delivery was not taken by you? If the signature does not matches your original signature, the seller can always claim that you had the intentions of cheating(?)

[Sankar]

Originally Posted by nemo

A bit off topic for this thread but if there is better place to park this post, mods pls do.

I was duped by an eBay seller of an order I placed a few months ago. The order never got shipped but eBay is claiming they have been delivered. I have all the proofs to prove that I've not received the products, including a letter from Blue Dart which clearly says the goods did not travel on their network.

If the item has net yet been shipped, then it will be marked as not shipped in the paisapay page. What does it show there? If it has not been marked as shipped then how did the payment go to the seller.

Or is it that the item was marked as shipped in paisapay with a tracking number but you didn't receive it?

If ebay is not doing anything about it do not wait any more and raise a charge dispute with the bank. Do not wait, do it now! First you email them from within your netbanking page (if you have that option) and you should get a reply within 24hours. They will ask you to send them a credit card charge dispute form. Send them the dispute form alongwith all details including printout of emails (if necessary) along with the charge dispute form. The letter from bluedart is important and should be included.

I feel that the bank will close this dispute in your favour.

[speedmiester]

Originally Posted by nemo

A bit off topic for this thread but if there is better place to park this post, mods pls do.

I was duped by an eBay seller of an order I placed a few months ago. The order never got shipped but eBay is claiming they have been delivered. I have all the proofs to prove that I've not received the products, including a letter from Blue Dart which clearly says the goods did not travel on their network.

Please share the seller's detail as well, a negative word on the social media about the seller will hurt their reputation the most.

[Latheesh]

Tricky situation - I placed an order for a belt from myntra couple of days back and discount available was 20%. I opted for cash on delivery option and they already shipped the item. I checked the belt price today and see that discount increased to 40%. I wrote an email to their customer care regarding this and they will take atleast 12 hours to get back to me. What should I do, take delivery and forget about the additional discount?

NB: I faced similar problem two times with amazon USA and they offered discount equivalent to the difference in my next order.

[binand]

Originally Posted by saket77

What if the courier delivery guys or anyone else just puts your initials on the delivery receipt paper that they carry and take your stuff? [...] If the signature does not matches your original signature, the seller can always claim that you had the intentions of cheating(?)

Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer.

When you claim in a lawsuit that your e-commerce order was not delivered, you are accusing the vendor of cheating. As with all legal matters, there is a presumption of innocence until proven guilty; so you need to prove the guilt aspect. This will be tough, as the sections of IPC dealing with cheating all require you to prove intention to cheat - which the vendor can easily refute by showing that they have shipped your order within a reasonable amount of time after receiving payment for it. Depending on the contract between the vendor and the courier, it is quite likely that the court will find that the vendor is not responsible for pilferage by the courier's agent.

So the better option for you is to sue the courier company. Here you are on surer footing, as they cannot escape liability for the actions of their employees. You will produce letters, cheques etc. that you routinely sign to show how your signature looks like, the court will then take a look at the signature on the courier's documentation and will probably decide the case in your favour. The courier company can then sue its employee, but most likely they'll just absorb the loss, fire the fellow and proceed as usual. If the courier company counter-sues you claiming that you intentionally made a false signature, the onus is on them to prove this assertion - which they probably will not be able to (unless the field staff have GPS-enabled devices and the recipient's location has visitor registers and CCTV coverage etc.).

Practically speaking, all this legal activity is expensive and not good for the brands concerned; so the e-commerce vendor will simply refund you and absorb the loss. They will change couriers if such issues persist with their current vendor. The competition in the field, the fickleness of brand perception and the ease with which reputations can be destroyed keep everyone concerned honest by if nothing, compulsion. :-)

Yet, the occasional Timtara does emerge.

[saket77]

Originally Posted by binand

... The competition in the field, the fickleness of brand perception and the ease with which reputations can be destroyed keep everyone concerned honest by if nothing, compulsion. :-)

That sums up everything that today's market place is.

Thanks for the detailed reply. Makes things much clear. So, still much is based on trust & reputation. I always wondered that how a seller can agree to replace an item which was dead or broken on arrival, and such cases. Do you think that there might be a possibility that they get the stuff insured too before shipping?

[Sankar]

I bought couple small of electric items worth GBP72 from a reputed e-retailer in UK. the items were dispatched by the shop on 16th June through royal mail signed for service (with end to end tracking). I received the parcel on 26th June at my residential address. When i opened the parcel to my horror i found that the items had been stolen and in its place some plastic packing materials and a Hindi pamphlet was stuffed into. Now this was a first. I have had costlier items come from Europe and UK through postal service before but never had the case of stolen items before.

The parcel entered India at Delhi, where it was stuck for some time and probably the location of the crime, and then forwarded to Cochin and then to TVM.

Since the UK retailer was a reputed shop they refunded the total cost when i informed them of what had happened with the parcel. They have lodged a complaint with Royal Mail and i had lodged a complaint with our Postal department regarding this. I received a reply from Assistant Director (CS) of Kerala Circle that the complaint has been forwarded to Supdt of PO, TVM for further investigation and a further reply from them can be expected.

I do not want to disclose the name of the shop because ours is a public forum and i do not wish any unscrupulous elements taking advantage of the shop and claiming refund for the items received.

[nemo]

Folks, Thanks for your time and your inputs. Here are my responses to the queries

Originally Posted by bravo6

If you paid by credit card, call your bank and ask for a charge back on that transaction. Show them Bluedart's letter if they ask for proof.

If eBay is claiming the item was delivered, ask them to show proof - packages will be handed over only upon signing the delivery slip.

Last resort, get a friend in Mumbai to hire a local lawyer and fight the case there.

@bravo6, yes, I paid via my credit card and I reported the incident to them and had them raise disputes, twice, one before I contacted Blue Dart and the 2nd time after Blue Dart confirmed in writing that the goods did not travel through their network. In both the cases they have closed the dispute in the bank's favour stating that the transaction in question was genuine and that they cannot be held responsible for non-delivery of goods. They have sent me a bunch of papers to prove that I initiated the transaction, this is quite baffling because I never challenged the authenticity of the transaction per se, i have mentioned that my issue is that i did not receive the goods.

Good suggestion on engaging a lawyer in Mumbai....will give that a try. thanks!

Originally Posted by saket77

Brings me to a question...in fact, I always think about it when the order is prepaid. What if the courier delivery guys or anyone else just puts your initials on the delivery receipt paper that they carry and take your stuff? Since the order is prepaid, this can be easily done, isn't it? And then the sellers can always show the other person's signature as proof of delivery. How would you prove that the delivery was not taken by you? If the signature does not matches your original signature, the seller can always claim that you had the intentions of cheating(?)

@saket77, There is no instance of signature fraud here, neither eBay nor ICICI bank has given me the delivery slip with any signature on it as a proof of delivery, this is in-spite of me repeatedly asking for that information.

Originally Posted by Sankar

If the item has net yet been shipped, then it will be marked as not shipped in the paisapay page. What does it show there? If it has not been marked as shipped then how did the payment go to the seller.

Or is it that the item was marked as shipped in paisapay with a tracking number but you didn't receive it?

If ebay is not doing anything about it do not wait any more and raise a charge dispute with the bank. Do not wait, do it now! First you email them from within your netbanking page (if you have that option) and you should get a reply within 24hours. They will ask you to send them a credit card charge dispute form. Send them the dispute form alongwith all details including printout of emails (if necessary) along with the charge dispute form. The letter from bluedart is important and should be included.

I feel that the bank will close this dispute in your favour.

@Sankar, good point on the shipment details update on PaisaPay page. I'm attaching a screenshot of this page and as one can see the shipment details is missing and the status is shown as Not-shipped. I have given this information to the bank and also to eBay, both of them seem to have ignored this important piece of information in their investigations.

As I have mentioned above, I have raised the dispute with ICICI bank. Unfortunately, the investigation is not thorough and my issue remains open. I didn't mention before but the transaction took place in September of 2013 and i have been going through this ordeal for sometime now.

I was hoping that ICICI will try to protect it's customer's interest and was banking on their influence to resolve this issue after eBay stopped responding to my queries. Unfortunately, that's not the case and i have been caught up between in the tripartite mess and each one pointing me to the other and making me run around to prove my case.

Originally Posted by speedmiester

Please share the seller's detail as well, a negative word on the social media about the seller will hurt their reputation the most.

GRDSTORE in eBay.in

Originally Posted by binand

Disclaimer: I am not a lawyer.

When you claim in a lawsuit that your e-commerce order was not delivered, you are accusing the vendor of cheating. As with all legal matters, there is a presumption of innocence until proven guilty; so you need to prove the guilt aspect. This will be tough, as the sections of IPC dealing with cheating all require you to prove intention to cheat - which the vendor can easily refute by showing that they have shipped your order within a reasonable amount of time after receiving payment for it. Depending on the contract between the vendor and the courier, it is quite likely that the court will find that the vendor is not responsible for pilferage by the courier's agent.

So the better option for you is to sue the courier company. Here you are on surer footing, as they cannot escape liability for the actions of their employees. You will produce letters, cheques etc. that you routinely sign to show how your signature looks like, the court will then take a look at the signature on the courier's documentation and will probably decide the case in your favour. The courier company can then sue its employee, but most likely they'll just absorb the loss, fire the fellow and proceed as usual. If the courier company counter-sues you claiming that you intentionally made a false signature, the onus is on them to prove this assertion - which they probably will not be able to (unless the field staff have GPS-enabled devices and the recipient's location has visitor registers and CCTV coverage etc.).

Practically speaking, all this legal activity is expensive and not good for the brands concerned; so the e-commerce vendor will simply refund you and absorb the loss. They will change couriers if such issues persist with their current vendor. The competition in the field, the fickleness of brand perception and the ease with which reputations can be destroyed keep everyone concerned honest by if nothing, compulsion. :-)

Yet, the occasional Timtara does emerge.

I have not considered suing Blue Dart because they have been very cooperative and provided the information i requested for. I sent an email with the top management in copy and within 2 weeks they came back stating the goods were not handed over to them and hence not delivered and that i should talk to the eBay seller and follow up.

[Gannu_1]

Originally Posted by ET

Bansal, 32, will spend a day later this month delivering to customers in Bangalore the latest in a string of customer outreach initiatives being launched by the seven-year-old company.

Chief operating officer Binny Bansal has already made a start. In May, he rode pillion on an eKart delivery boy's bike to deliver a product and pick up a returned one from a customer in north Bangalore. The Bansals, who are not related to each other, have also spent a day each answering customer calls.

Flipkart boss Sachin Bansal & other senior executives to make home deliveries, handle complaints

More like a publicity stunt.

[castiel]

Originally Posted by nemo

GRDSTORE in eBay.in

.

Wow these guys have 99.2% positive feedback and it is from a total of 3600

I was thinking I will be safe if I choose only sellers with above 99% positive feedback and also whoever sold many items in past.(a new seller with few items sold could easily get 100% positive)

This seller met both these criteria still you were cheated and even the"eBay guarantee" didn't work. I thought i will face trouble only if I go with some sellers with less feedback.

E bay is my main online source, almost 50000 worth items bought in last 2 months. No major issues so far, when something is not shipped or received wrong item, they always promptly refunded me.
Although it takes 2-3 weeks and some followup in case if the item is shipped and received(damaged/wrong item etc)

Automatic refund done for several items when something not shipped within the time frame
Now based on your experience I am not sure ebay shopping is a good idea however tempting the coupons and lower prices might be.

Let us know how your battle it turns out