[poloman]

Originally Posted by sagarpadaki

Your inbox is full. Hence putting the details here

Here are the details of the Mitsubishi dealer for AC-

Name - Densol Engineering
Location - Vijayanagar(RPC layout)
Ph - 080-2314 8349/2314 6349

They dont have a showroom. It is just a godown kinda outlet.

Thanks Sagar, I had called up few Mitsubishi dealers nearby. One guy told he had wound up the business due to shortage of skilled man power. This reflects the scenario on ground. Almost all ac manufacturers are taking major hit on their reputation and brand value due to third rate installation and repair services. Anyway will check this dealer out.

[Guite]

Originally Posted by poloman

One guy told he had wound up the business due to shortage of skilled man power.

It is my opinion that the skill is not lacking, money is. The market is so cost sensitive that companies cut corners to beat competition. This I believe is true at manufacturing stage as well as servicing. For same brand why is made in Thailand better than made in India? An AC dealer tells me quality is compromised in made in India for India.

In terms of after sales service, companies can very well invest in training and retaining skilled man power, but it cost more money than delegating to a local workshop.

In the end I think we get what we pay for.

[tush]

Skilled man power shortage is true thing. How many in this forum could tell that their installer avoided core cutting of the beam and advised otherwise. Or if we set a vote we would find more then 90% installation done with core cutting of the beam. Forget about rest of the installation, is this even safe or a skilled thing to do. It's all chalta hai unless a disaster happens.

But things can change as rightly pointed out on providing trainings. But in our populated nation low cost is the survival factor where there is always a jugaad provider for getting it done cheap and jugaad receivers who don't mind due to their lack of awareness/education and a greed to get as much discount as possible (nimbo ko nichodke pura juice nikal detey hai customers, that's the level of bargaining that happens and hence the low quality in every aspect of engineering)

Was in Greece in 2014, did not find core cutting done into the beams for where I stayed. My friend there said very basic things like building structures is taught in the schools. Between I saw many local brands as well as Mitsubishi, Panasonic and Daikin there.

[Aroy]

Originally Posted by tush

Skilled man power shortage is true thing. How many in this forum could tell that their installer avoided core cutting of the beam and advised otherwise. Or if we set a vote we would find more then 90% installation done with core cutting of the beam. Forget about rest of the installation, is this even safe or a skilled thing to do. It's all chalta hai unless a disaster happens.

But things can change as rightly pointed out on providing trainings. But in our populated nation low cost is the survival factor where there is always a jugaad provider for getting it done cheap and jugaad receivers who don't mind due to their lack of awareness/education and a greed to get as much discount as possible (nimbo ko nichodke pura juice nikal detey hai customers, that's the level of bargaining that happens and hence the low quality in every aspect of engineering)

Was in Greece in 2014, did not find core cutting done into the beams for where I stayed. My friend there said very basic things like building structures is taught in the schools. Between I saw many local brands as well as Mitsubishi, Panasonic and Daikin there.

Cutting a core in a beam or column is structurally dangerous as it will weaken the structural integrity of the whole structure (in case the reinforcement is cut). The weakening would rarely be noticed in normal circumstances (unless more than 25% of the beam/column cross section was cut), but even a mild earthquake will lead to structural collapse, especially if the beam/column in question is a corner one.

What we do is to introduce a 50mm diameter pipe across the beam/column, through the centre so that the pipe is surrounded by reinforcement steel. That ensures that there is a path for utility through the duct in the structure. Such ducts are laid in consultation with HVAC engineer so that there is always a duct available for AC piping. In case there are a lot of ducts required, structural engineer takes those into account while calculating the strength and designing reinforcement.

[cjsarora]

I have to put AC's in 2 rooms. approx size 10 X12 each. Both bedrooms. Plan to put 1.0 ton inverter unit (split) in both. After researching a few shops in South Delhi, have zeroed in on General ASGA12JGC - 1.0 Ton model.

Would that be a good choice? Any negative experiences in Delhi?

[sgiitk]

I will say, as long as core cutting is minor and no reinforcement is damaged it may be fine. I agree that it is best avoided but there are situations. I wonder whether putting a steel pipe will help a bit.

[anupmathur]

Originally Posted by sgiitk

... I wonder whether putting a steel pipe will help a bit.

He obviously means putting a steel pipe at the time of the concrete being poured, during construction. Inserting a pipe after boring a hole in an existing wall/slab is essentially meaningless.

[khoj]

1 ton machine in a 120 sq foot room in Dilli will be grossly inadequate. Upsize to 1.5 ton or at least 1.2 ton to be able to benefit from the install especially during peak summers.

Originally Posted by cjsarora

I have to put AC's in 2 rooms. approx size 10 X12 each. Both bedrooms. Plan to put 1.0 ton inverter unit (split) in both. After researching a few shops in South Delhi, have zeroed in on General ASGA12JGC - 1.0 Ton model.

Would that be a good choice? Any negative experiences in Delhi?

[sandeepmohan]

Originally Posted by naveenroy

How are the Sansui 1 Ton Split ACs? Saw some good deals in Flipkart? ASS?

Sansui are making air conditioners? This brand was once known for really good Hi Fi. They made nothing else.

Please avoid. After sales is handled by the same folks who handle Videocon. If I am not mistaken, the manufacturing is also out sourced to Videocon, which is no bad thing but then, you much rather buy a Videocon itself. You will get service, just don't expect it to be high grade. Also; check energy efficiency ratio and power consumption of the unit before putting your money down.

[Guite]

Originally Posted by tush

Skilled man power shortage is true thing. How many in this forum could tell that their installer avoided core cutting of the beam and advised otherwise.

I would not put entire onus on the AC technician. Of course he should have the conviction to avoid core cutting on beam or column. At the same time home owners should be aware where there are columns and beams in their house, and aware of the risks involved in cutting through them. About ten years back a multi-storied building collapsed in north Mumbai, near about Goregoan I think, because the people on ground floor cut some column.

Originally Posted by cjsarora

I have to put AC's in 2 rooms. approx size 10 X12 each. Both bedrooms. Plan to put 1.0 ton inverter unit (split) in both.

Would that be a good choice? Any negative experiences in Delhi?

Only if the rooms have only one wall exposed and facing north. For rooms with wall / window facing south or south-west 1 ton maybe insufficient.

Originally Posted by sgiitk

I will say, as long as core cutting is minor and no reinforcement is damaged it may be fine. I agree that it is best avoided but there are situations. I wonder whether putting a steel pipe will help a bit.

Putting steel pipe post construction will not alleviate the danger posed by cutting through the beam or column.

[Aroy]

Sorry for the confusion. The steel pipes are put in the beam/column before pouring the concrete (in the form work), so that after the concrete sets there is a duct from one side to the other.

[sgiitk]

Originally Posted by anupmathur

He obviously means putting a steel pipe at the time of the concrete being poured, during construction. Inserting a pipe after boring a hole in an existing wall/slab is essentially meaningless.

I was actually suggesting retro-inserting a decent GI pipe and firmly setting / anchoring it into place. The hole should also be somewhat circular.

[Rahul Rao]

Originally Posted by Aroy

Cutting a core in a beam or column is structurally dangerous as it will weaken the structural integrity of the whole structure (in case the reinforcement is cut). The weakening would rarely be noticed in normal circumstances (unless more than 25% of the beam/column cross section was cut), but even a mild earthquake will lead to structural collapse, especially if the beam/column in question is a corner one.

In India most builders are cutting corners by making large beams right from Lintel level to the slab level. What is actually needed is a 0.5 M tall beam below the slab / roof, and a 150mm lintel just above door frame or window frame. This is what it should look like " == ". The brick work between beam and lintel is usefull for everything else, electric wires, Ac pipes, water pipes etc.
What builders do instead is have a single beam which is 0.8 M or more, which is easier for them to work on, but makes things like drilling in beams, and core cutting necessary.

[cjsarora]

Originally Posted by Guite

Only if the rooms have only one wall exposed and facing north. For rooms with wall / window facing south or south-west 1 ton maybe insufficient.

None of the walls of these two rooms face S/SW
Walls of one room which is in the corner are in East & North East whereas the only free wall of the other room is E/SE

[anupmathur]

Originally Posted by cjsarora

None of the walls of these two rooms face S/SW
Walls of one room which is in the corner are in East & North East whereas the only free wall of the other room is E/SE

One of the USPs of inverter ACs is that they can deliver very low output, if needed, and can deliver up to 20% or so more than rated, if required. It is just the first cost that could be bothering you. If you have decided on inverter ACs (which, by the way, I personally do not recommend in India) then do shell out a bit more and get 1.5 ton units.