[Sprucegoose]

Originally Posted by quickdraw

Argueing that a Mac cant do specialized tasks for the niche market is kind of a knee jerk defence because if you would really want to do all that stuff with a Mac why dont you design the SDK or whatever yourself? In essence when we are discussing a PC its a personal computer not a specialized piece of machinery so dont take the argument to technical side. So whatever you throw at it word edition, designing and other daily tasks 99% of PC users around the world use their PC's for the Mac does it better, faster and in style!

Dude!! designing an SDK is no easy task.
it'll work out faster, cheaper and better to just buy a compatible system.
besides if you need direct hardware control, then designing an SDK will require intimate knowledge of how the OS itself is constructed.

If writing software was that easy, windows would never hang & nor would a mac

but they do.

[johnda]

I'm a mac user and a Mac lover! I picked up my mac mini in 2007 - in a lot of ways the wrong machine to pick considering my purpose and reason. But I have not had any of the issues that I have with my windows machine. No blue screens and no Ctrl Alt Del, no hangs, or resource pangs!
I've never ReStarted other than the usual software update that require it or on 2 occasions when a faulty DVD got stuck.
The Mini runs on tiger 10.4.11 and the Windows on XP pro.
Well, its not think different but Think Radical!!!
IMO - As far as Apple Mac goes their products rate in descending order even in their debut - I say this a as a total mac guy.
Mac computers
iPod
iPhone.
I have all three- My Mac is the BEST
and the iPod is a great piece but has many a competition;
and the iphone- apple should make computers!
I hope to upgrade my mini to Leopard and also addon some RAM!

[Samurai]

Originally Posted by quickdraw

Argueing that a Mac cant do specialized tasks for the niche market is kind of a knee jerk defence because if you would really want to do all that stuff with a Mac why dont you design the SDK or whatever yourself?

It is obvious you are new to the world of SDKs. See, it works like this. When a company sells a peripheral hardware that needs to work with a wellknown OS/platform, they provide device drivers to make the OS and their hardware communicate. Going further, if they want third party developers to develop applications on their hardware, they provide the Software Development Kit or SDK for the third part developers to communicate with their hardware. The driver or the SDK can't be made up by people outside of the company since it needs complete access to hardware design and internal APIs.

Originally Posted by quickdraw

In essence when we are discussing a PC its a personal computer not a specialized piece of machinery so dont take the argument to technical side. So whatever you throw at it word edition, designing and other daily tasks 99% of PC users around the world use their PC's for the Mac does it better, faster and in style!

You are a student if I am not mistaken, do you feel you have already seen everything? I know I haven't, and I am still surprised every often by the kind of applications where Windows is used.

Comparing MacOS and Windows is like comparing Apple and Oranges. MacOS is primarily used as desktop/laptop OS. While Windows is used as desktop/laptop/server OS. The term server is a really a big deal. Since most software that runs on XP/Vista can run on Win2003/Win2008 servers, it enables hordes of enterprise developers to develop/test on their Windows desktop and deploy on Windows Server. I know Apple has a server product line, but I haven't really seen any corporate use Apple servers in their data centers. Meanwhile, Windows servers are clear market leaders.

Enterprise server OS market shares: Windows – 65-70%, Linux – 15-20% @ IT Facts

That means most enterprise developers develop for Windows server OS, and guess which desktop they have to use for it? BTW, enterprise developers have the most say when it comes to technology decisions regarding platforms in enterprises. Apple didn't understand this in the 80s or 90s. Microsoft had the first mover advantage here. Windows was the first major OS that had binary compatible desktop OS and server OS. Linux/Solaris followed a few years later, but are still having a very hard time to catch up with Windows. You may not understand this fully if you haven't seen the enterprise scene prior to WinNT. Before Microsoft pulled this coup with WinNT, enterprise developers like me had to use unix workstations, I have personally used HP workstations and Sun workstations which were way more expensive than desktops. Somewhere in 1997, we all got busted from expensive HP/Sun workstations to lowly PC desktops. That was a huge cost savings for corporates.

Remember what Proximo said to Maximus in the movie Gladiator, "Win the crowd and you will win your freedom". The IT version of that would be "Win the enterprise crowd and you will win the OS war". This is what Microsoft did. As a desktop user, you can argue all you want about the pros and cons, but it is the enterprise/corporate user who decides the winner. Actually it is no different than the stock market where the institutional buyers are the one who make the difference and not the individual invester.

BTW, I have said this before. I am not a Mac hater, I would love to have one, but I can't.

[diabloo]

Originally Posted by spadival

Mac OSX is "Unix in a nice suit" !!

Well said mate .

Originally Posted by Akki_5

Are we talking about computers? There is only one i know of - Macintosh OS X. Others are mere boxes for entertainment!

Its actually other way round - MAC is like TV, switch on use & switch off. Don't try anything else.

Well, a Mac can do everything Windows can, plus do it a lot better

Not really - applications are limited for MAC. But Windows have huge, a very huge number of applications. Hence you can do more in Windows.

No crashes, no freezes, no blue screens, no auto restarts, no viruses, no nonsense.

MAC is as good as Unix. It can crash - either if the application are poorly written or if there is hardware fault. I agree, Windows 95/98 used to freeze. But after XP, its as stable as any MAC.
Windows has huge installation base. So any virus writer would want to write virus for Windows since he would get maximum effect. Till then MACs are safe .

The GUI is awesome! The features are very good. Agreed that the price is a drawback but then its worth every penny.

I agree GUI is good, hardware if good but its expensive. MAC Desktops starts at 55K. For that price you would get 2 Windows desktops of similar specs.

We have few MACs in our office. Very few uses them but use Windows since:
1. Not many applications on MAC. Eg, no GTalk on MAC
2. They don't like to browse net thru' Safari. Nor they Firefox on MAC.

[spadival]

Originally Posted by Rudra Sen

Apple (local) is going to change my OS to Snow Leopard as it comes out. Both my machines are PowerPC base.

Rudraji, some thing does not add up here. Are you changing the hardware as well? Snow Leopard will run only on Intel based Macs (and non mac's, like my Compaq ) and wont run on PowerPC macs. Posting the link to General requirement page on Apple site.

Originally Posted by Samurai

It is obvious you are new to the world of SDKs.

.. and I might add, new to the world of computer hardware. I can understand about buying a Mac and associated software, but why would anyone buy an expensive Apple branded Time Capsule hardware when a regular USB HDD and a wifi router will do? Time Capsule probably has the same Taiwanese made HDD underneath the skin. Its a glorified hard disk wearing lipstick.

Maybe it'll get you some bragging rights, but nothing much from a technical standpoint. Who wants to take wireless backups? How lazy can you get??

[Rudra Sen]

Originally Posted by spadival

Rudraji, some thing does not add up here. Are you changing the hardware as well? Snow Leopard will run only on Intel based Macs (and non mac's, like my Compaq ) and wont run on PowerPC macs. Posting the link to General requirement page on Apple site.

I didn't know this. Thanks for educating me. Looks like I have no choice but stick to my current OS. I don't know if Leopard is going improve anything from my current OS. So I suppose I'll stick to this one only for the time being. In terms of operation I don't have any issue right now.

[Live To Jive]

Originally Posted by extreme_torque

Mac isnt just about the build quality and the looks... the best thing about it is the OS thats come with it.... windows any version isnt even close.

Dosen't Linux offer everything (or more) that Mac offers, that too for free? As for windows I stopped using it many years ago.

Originally Posted by Samurai

Has anyone wondered why Apple is more stable than Windows? Apple OS runs on Apple Hardware. Meanwhile, Windows has to run on hardware made by thousands of PC makers all over the world.

Well Linux too has to run of different hardware like Windows. But it manages to be stable like Mac.

[pranavt]

Originally Posted by Live To Jive

Dosen't Linux offer everything (or more) that Mac offers, that too for free? As for windows I stopped using it many years ago.

Don't fool yourself. Media related functionality in Linux is abysmal at best. No, Gimp and Audacity don't count. Same with gaming, where Mac also suffers.

Originally Posted by Live To Jive

Well Linux too has to run of different hardware like Windows. But it manages to be stable like Mac.

Again, these days, stability depends on the hardware you're using. Operating Systems have matured to the point where random show-stopping bugs are incredibly rare.

[Samurai]

Originally Posted by Live To Jive

Dosen't Linux offer everything (or more) that Mac offers, that too for free? As for windows I stopped using it many years ago.

Does that mean your Windows experience is outdated by many years? Since Windows 2000, most of the stability issues of the past have become history. People who had problems with Vista did so because they ran it on under-speced machines.

When you run Windows on branded PCs like DELL, HP, IBM, etc., you seldom run into any problems. However, when you run Windows on assembled PCs put together by a local supplier, there is no saying how it will work. These PCs undergo no methodical integration testing, environmental testing, etc. They are no more reliable than the Jeeps we rebuild in local workshops. Since Apple hardware can't be built by a local supplier, Mac users never have to suffer inferior hardware.

I am all for Apple, I am glad you all like your Apple user experience, but that can be done without trashing Windows. When you try to promote Apple purely by trashing Windows, it removes all credibility from your statement.

[Live To Jive]

Originally Posted by Samurai

Does that mean your Windows experience is outdated by many years? Since Windows 2000, most of the stability issues of the past have become history. People who had problems with Vista did so because they ran it on under-speced machines.
When you run Windows on branded PCs like DELL, HP, IBM, etc., you seldom run into any problems. Since Apple hardware can't be built by a local supplier, Mac users never have to suffer inferior hardware.

Well I'm not trashing Windows or anything. I've never used an unbranded PC and have not had too many problems with Windows upto XP. The Vista experience was not very good and since I was already using Linux (dual boot) I was quite comfortable to switch totally to it. Windows does have i's advantages when it comes to running 3rd party softwares. However now Mac and Linux versions of many applications are available. If there's a Mac version there's always a Linux version too. I've not heard of any Mac user complaining about Mac but it comes at a price and that's why I picked Linux.

[Jaggu]

Originally Posted by abhinav.gupta88

I just purchased the Apple Macbook Pro 15" 2.53 GHz 2 days back.

Congratz! where did you get it (india or abraod) and how much?

Originally Posted by Samurai

When you run Windows on branded PCs like DELL, HP, IBM, etc., you seldom run into any problems. However, when you run Windows on assembled PCs put together by a local supplier, there is no saying how it will work.

Have to agree here, personally i have seen this happen in my office. All the support functions used to have locally assembled systems and used to get into issues and crashes, but the moment the machines were changed to branded stuff like IBM and Dell, things have become close to 99% stable.

In my case am running on Vista at office on dell machine and with 3GB ram and i dont have any single issue reported till date (close to 3 months now) and i do hell lot of multi tasking and crazy stuff in my machine. I just ensured everything apart from the OS and mandatory stuff were installed by me, reading the screen pop up and clicking the appropriate buttons. Instead of randomly hitting Ok or Cancel This is another problem if you dont install stuff properly things will go wrong.

I still am aspiring to bring home a MBP someday, hope its soon

[Samurai]

Originally Posted by Jaggu

I still am aspiring to bring home a MBP someday, hope its soon

Male Baldness Pattern? Bring it on, I am already beyond it.

[Akki_5]

Originally Posted by pranavt

Does not compute.

Since when does having a query imply that it isn't good?
It's just that i am new to Mac and so i have a query. It would happen even if i were new to Windows! But so far my experience is, Mac rocks (and i don't say Windows is bad or anything even remotely implying that but only that i like Mac)!

[Akki_5]

Originally Posted by diabloo

Not really - applications are limited for MAC. But Windows have huge, a very huge number of applications. Hence you can do more in Windows.

We have few MACs in our office. Very few uses them but use Windows since:
1. Not many applications on MAC. Eg, no GTalk on MAC
2. They don't like to browse net thru' Safari. Nor they Firefox on MAC.

Doesn't look like u use a Mac yourself. If so, you can't really argue unless you have seen both of them. I never said you get every application u have on Windows for Mac, but there are alternatives.
You don't have GTalk for Mac but then u have iChat with which u can log in to most IMs including Google, Live, AoL and Jabber. You can log into multiple accounts simultaneously.

BTW, you do have Firefox for Mac. It's only that it's absolutely unnecessary when you are on Safari :P.

[ph03n!x]

Originally Posted by Samurai

I am all for Apple, I am glad you all like your Apple user experience, but that can be done without trashing Windows. When you try to promote Apple purely by trashing Windows, it removes all credibility from your statement.

+1 to that- thats exactly what I felt like telling after reading all the posts in this thread.

Mac and Windows are from different schools of thought. Its like choosing a car, except that the choices are not so many

Thrashing Mac to underline Windows' superiority, or thrashing Windows to highlight a Mac's superiority is like telling "Your car is not a 10-second machine, mine is good hence!"

Btw, just to clarify, I have used both Macs and Windows. My primary OS is a Windows 7 - x64 on my laptop, and x86 on a desktop. I am more at home with Windows, more so because my work needs (and has always needed) me to be on Windows.