[recker_us]

Originally Posted by lamborghini

If you're relocating to HP, and see yourself doing a lot of high altitude drives; I would actually recommend the Liva Cross 1.5 for the better GC, build quality, and the NA 1.5L engine mated to a light body.

As an option: I'd look at picking up a pre-owned Liva Cross, and getting a pre-owned off-roader to satisfy the itch.

Sir, I check with Toyota yesterday.. It seems Cross has been discontinued now. The Etios Cross is not less than 5L in NCR for pre-owned cars.. Keeping my fingers crossed to find a better deal.

Originally Posted by somspaple

Himachal Pradesh .. abode of Himalayas!! Lucky you!

I've mostly seen only Marutis [mostly Altos] dotting the mountain roads of HP whenever I've been there on treks/trips. I guess ASS is an important factor and I guess MASS is the leader even there. In that case please test drive Ignis Petrol manual [we've an Ignis AMT back home being used by Dad]. Though it is slightly tall but has wide track [same as Swift I guess] and so much fun to drive around [with Manual override option].

Right Sir.. These Altos are the most preferred Car and Taxi in the mountains.. The low height and compact size makes it preferred choice for the mountains... That's the whole reason I was stuck on Zen as it offer the similar advantage with higher power.

Now Tiago is topmost in my list..

[giri1.8]

Originally Posted by recker_us

Now Tiago is topmost in my list..

Hope it's the JTP version! My Tigor has the NA engine from the normal Tiago, it does run out of breath easily! Most modern petrol cars have weak low-end punch, make sure you TD before making a decision

If Build quality isn't the top priority, I would pick the Ford Freestyle.

[lamborghini]

Originally Posted by recker_us

Sir, I check with Toyota yesterday.. It seems Cross has been discontinued now. The Etios Cross is not less than 5L in NCR for pre-owned cars.. Keeping my fingers crossed to find a better deal.

Right Sir.. These Altos are the most preferred Car and Taxi in the mountains.. The low height and compact size makes it preferred choice for the mountains... That's the whole reason I was stuck on Zen as it offer the similar advantage with higher power.

Now Tiago is topmost in my list..

Tiago JTP - would recommend taking a test drive there as the higher altitude to get an idea of how it would actually fare for your conditions.

Regarding the Liva Cross - you have to go the pre-owned way for a good deal. These cars weren't chart toppers so negotiate hard when you come across one.

Also, do have a look at the Swift 1.2 P, and the Figo TDCi as well.

[recker_us]

Originally Posted by lamborghini

Tiago JTP - would recommend taking a test drive there as the higher altitude to get an idea of how it would actually fare for your conditions.

It may not be easy to get a test drive at higher altitude... However, I tried to do some research on Turbo engine performance on higher altitudes and it looks like the efficiency of a Turbo charged engine much better than a Naturally Aerated vehicle...
Pasting an excerpt from a website on turbocharging.. Hoping that the moderators would allow this copy-paste for the sake of an informative discussion to the larger audience. Thanks a lot Sir for bringing your perspective to this discussion:


"The high-altitude performance of a turbocharged engine is significantly better. Because of the lower air pressure at high altitudes, the power loss of a naturally aspirated engine is considerable. In contrast, the performance of the turbine improves at altitude as a result of the greater pressure difference between the virtually constant pressure upstream of the turbine and the lower ambient pressure at outlet. The lower air density at the compressor inlet is largely equalized. Hence, the engine has barely any power loss.

Because of reduced overall size, the sound-radiating outer surface of a turbocharger engine is smaller, it is therefore less noisy than a naturally aspirated engine with identical output. The turbocharger itself acts as an additional silencer."

[$tar_boy]

We own a TIAGO XZA it is primarily used in the city and have done a few trips around the ghats(though not steep mountain regions). The performance is adequate, the only thing is that in the AMT variant the ECU is too eager to shift gears but you have the option to slot it into manual and thrust the Sports mode button for a little more punchy performance.

[recker_us]

Based on the recommendation of the experts here, I was considering four vehicles and took test drive of three vehicles:
1. Ford Freestyle: Petrol Version.
2. Tata Tiago JTP: Petrol.
3. KUV 100.
4. Etios Cross.

Lets start with the elimination and then focus on the ones that made to final selection:

1. KUV 100: Good exterior looks but very crude and boxy feeling inside. Didnt feel that power or punch. So, eliminated.
2. Etios Cross: No more manufactured by Toyota. They were more interested in selling the Liva Special Edition or Etios. So, eliminated.

This leaves us with Freestyle and Tiago JTP. I had around 10kms of test drive on both the vehicles, so sharing my experience:

1. Power and Punch:
- With Freestyle, I could rev easily to 75 at second gear. Third gear takes us to 105. Power transmission is smooth and very linear.
However, the fourth gear is a complete Dud and doesn't have any power. This would make it difficult to overtake at high speed on the highways. 5th gear is good... But I was not able to test it beyond 120.
- With Tiago JTP, 2nd gear can takes you 80. Both 3rd and 4th gears have good punch and I didnt go beyond 120 in 4th. Didnt got a chance to shift to 5th.

So, Tiago is a winner on this criteria. JTP has an edge over Freestyle especially in 4th gear.

2. NVH:
Freestyle is very smooth... You do not hear any engine noise until you have hit 90 on 3rd gear. Very refined indeed.
Tiago JTP is typical Tata product here... You feel the engine noise beyond 40 and the NVH is comparatively high which doesnt make you feel comfortable to floor thepaddle once you are at 100.
Freestyle is a clear winner here.

3. Suspension: No perceptible difference in the two vehicles when you run over a speedbreaker or a pothole. Its a Tie for this criteria.

4. Air Conditioning:
Freestyle steals the cake when it comes its powerful AC. I was driving when outside temperature was around 40 degrees. Within 10 minutes, I could feel my fingers getting chilled and had to move the vents to different angle. Freestyle gets 5/5 on AC.

Tiago AC is very ordinary.Nothing special to talk about it. It was just enough to keep driver from not sweating at 40 degrees. I would rate it 2.5/5 on AC.
Freestyle wins hands down on its AC performance.

5. Handling at 80+:
Freestyle is lot more composed and grounded at high speed too.

Tiago on the other hand doesnt feel stable at high speed. It kind of comes from its lower NVH values compared to Freestyle.

No doubts Freestyle is a winner here.

6. Ground clearance:
Compared to 175 from Tiago, Freestyle provides you that peace of mind with GC at 190mm.

7. Delivery: JTP is produced on-demand, hence the waiting period is 6-8 weeks.
Freestyle on the other hand is immediately available in the showroom. They provide additional discount of 10k if the vehicle is already in stock in the showroom.

8. Exterior Looks:
While I am not very keen on the looks, I love the roof rails on freestyle which is missing in Tiago.

Based on all these criteria, Freestyle looks like a good option. There are few options which I have not yet verified:

9. Fuel Efficiency:
- Tigo JTP claims 17kmpl in city mode.
- Freestyle claims it to be 19kmpl but i would like to hear actual numbers from the Freestyle owners in this forum.

10. After Sales Service:
I am under the impression that Ford would provide a better ASS compared to Tata. But unsure on the availability of their services in remote locations like Lahaul, Spiti or Upper areas of Uttarakhand and Ladakh. Tata might have a better coverage than Ford. This is where I am looking forward to inputs from you.

11. Cost of ASS:
I am under the impression that ASS cost for Ford would be much higher compared to Tata especially in terms of replacement of spares. A first hand feedback from any Ford owner would be very useful.

12. Now lets come to pricing:
- In Gurgaon, JTP comes at 7.6L. No corporate discounts, exchange offer available in Tiago JTP.
- Freestyle comes with Corporate discount, Exchange bonus, Cash discount which makes Freestyle almost 25k cheaper than JTP. I am considering the price of Freestyle Titanium for comparison here.

Looking forward to your inputs to take a final decision between the two.

Thanks
JP

[jetsetgo08]

Originally Posted by recker_us

- Freestyle comes with Corporate discount, Exchange bonus, Cash discount which makes Freestyle almost 25k cheaper than JTP. I am considering the price of Freestyle Titanium for comparison here.

Looking forward to your inputs to take a final decision between the two.

Neither an expert nor do I own any of the cars mentioned above. But my pick would be the Freestyle, however in its diesel avatar for the simple reason that critical engine spares are readily available as the 1.5tdci is omnipotent in the sub 4m Fords. However, sharing your use cases might help others pitch in with their opinion. Expect the Ford and Tata 1.2 petrol engines to be thirsty.

[Bhatia.D17]

Hello everyone.

I am looking for a new car to replace our 9 year old i20 petrol. I am considering Grand i10 Sportz (P) as of now.

Requirements are a small car with 90% city use. Budget is around 6- 6.5 Lacs onroad.
Average running will be around 800kms per month.
The car will be kept for at least 5 years.
Given the fact that the car is having good discounts, is it a good option?

Another option is Baleno Delta but that will be quite a stretch! At 7.2L onroad, it is 60k dearer and add to that the discount on i10, the gap increases.

Will be having a look at both the cars today and get the exact pricing.

[Iyencar]

Originally Posted by Bhatia.D17

Hello everyone.

I am looking for a new car to replace our 9 year old i20 petrol. I am considering Grand i10 Sportz (P) as of now.
Given the fact that the car is having good discounts, is it a good option?

Another option is Baleno Delta but that will be quite a stretch!
Will be having a look at both the cars today and get the exact pricing.

As a current Grandi10 owner, I can very strongly recommend the car. Has a lovely engine and amazing fit and finish. The only deal breaker for me in this car is that I need to manually lock the doors once I start driving. The rest of the typically mentioned issues like fixed headrests and lack of 60:40 split don't really matter.

Originally Posted by Bhatia.D17

Another option is Baleno Delta but that will be quite a stretch!
Will be having a look at both the cars today and get the exact pricing.

Avoid since it is especially going to be used in the city. The shell is very very light and easily accumulates dents and scratches. Bargain hard on the i10 since it isn't selling that much for some strange reason. if you really want a Maruti, the Ignis is a nice product also having nice discounts currently.

[self_driven]

Originally Posted by Bhatia.D17

Given the fact that the car is having good discounts, is it a good option?

Definitely. If space and fuel efficiency is not a concern, Grand i10 is a better product than Swift and Baleno for the amount you pay (after discount). Long list of features, light controls, soft suspension, compact size and nice quality all around make it a good all-rounder for city drives.

In my city, total discount on Grand i10 is almost 1 lakh rupees for mid variants which makes it a steal deal. How much are you getting?

[ampere]

How does this equation change, if you need to consider BS VI norms? Might be worth while to take a look from that angle also.

[Bhatia.D17]

Originally Posted by Iyencar

The only deal breaker for me in this car is that I need to manually lock the doors once I start driving.

This is one thing that I don't like about my current car. But now I have developed a habit of doing the same.

Originally Posted by self_driven

Definitely. If space and fuel efficiency is not a concern, Grand i10 is a better product than Swift and Baleno for the amount you pay (after discount).

Regarding space I need to make sure of the back seat space. Me and my father are 6'2. Although I think it will be sufficient.
Regarding the FE, i am used to getting 10kmpl in my i20 so anything better is good.

In my city, total discount on Grand i10 is almost 1 lakh rupees for mid variants which makes it a steal deal. How much are you getting?

The discounts are pretty much same. I will share the exact price after I make a visit to Hyundai later this evening.

One question: Is it worth going for Asta variant ?

[Iyencar]

Originally Posted by Bhatia.D17

This is one thing that I don't like about my current car. But now I have developed a habit of doing the same.
Good for you. I still keep forgetting to do so a lot of times.

Originally Posted by Bhatia.D17

One question: Is it worth going for Asta variant ?

Depends. Here are the differences over the lower models grouped on what matters to me:


Very Important: ABS, rear washer and wiper, height adjustment for the driver seat, luggage lamp.

Didn't know you needed it until you got it: Leather wrapped steering wheel, diamond cut alloys

Meh:ACC (it doesn't work great on my car. Almost always end up with a very high and noisy fan speed in the summer).

Don't care for it: Push button start/keyless entry, chrome door handles, rear spoiler

[Bhatia.D17]

Originally Posted by Iyencar

Very Important: ABS, rear washer and wiper, height adjustment for the driver seat, luggage lamp.

Dual Airbags and ABS with EBD are standard across the range.
Rear Wiper is very helpful.
Height adjustment seat - will have to check if it is needed.
Luggage Lamp - can live without it
Other features like ACC, alloys, Push Start Stop are nice to have features but not a necessity.

[Iyencar]

Originally Posted by Bhatia.D17

Dual Airbags and ABS with EBD are standard across the range.

Not according to their brochure. Link