SAFIRE vs FIRE: Same engine different FE?

mohandas · 23rd December 2009, 10:05

TBhpians:
Here is a strange situation. My younger brother is considering the following hatchbacks and trying zeroing on one.

GP 1.2 Active (Fiat) (Ex-sh @ hyd : 4.06 lacs)
Indica Vista Aqua Safire (Tata) (Ex-sh @ hyd : 3.64 lacs)

From the research, i have found that both are the same engine which is 1172 cc, 8V Fiat. They are also tuned to produce same power and torque. Moreover, they are also designed to pull vehicles of similar weighs.

However, when it comes to FE, I see them widely different. Most of the reviews (professionals and current owners) on 1.2 Active are claiming good FE. On the other hand, majority of them on Vista safire claim okay to poor FE.

How this is possible? Any insight.

DieselFan · 23rd December 2009, 10:13

FE depends a lot on factors other than engine - ECU, exhaust system, Air filter, Transmission, suspension, wheels and tyres being the most important elements that influence the FE over and above engine.

tj123 · 23rd December 2009, 10:18

Adding to DiesalFan....some other parameters are Drag coefficient, weight , engine tuneup parameters, gear rations etc

mohandas · 23rd December 2009, 10:37

what is Drag coefficient? Is this something to do with Chasis?
To my knowledge, most of the things that you and Diesel Fan have mentioned are same or similar. For eg, ECU, and engine tuneup are same, both are having fiat Transmission, both have got same suspension according to spec. Don't know about exhaust system and Air filter. But, then, how come they are sooooo different? Surprising? Isn't it?

msharma_79 · 23rd December 2009, 10:54

May be you need to go back to your source which has given the info at the first place. Test drive the cars and let us also be aware of the changes.

I would like to believe that vista should give a better mileage!!

mohandas · 28th December 2009, 11:28

From a little research, this is what i have found.
The ECU mapping of the SAFIRE and FIRE is difference. The chasis, and wheelbase of punto and vista is also different. Primarily, due to this, the FEs of vista and punto 1.2 are different.

23rd December 2009, 10:05	#1
mohandas BHPian Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Hyderabad Posts: 266 Thanked: 27 Times	SAFIRE vs FIRE: Same engine different FE? TBhpians: Here is a strange situation. My younger brother is considering the following hatchbacks and trying zeroing on one. GP 1.2 Active (Fiat) (Ex-sh @ hyd : 4.06 lacs) Indica Vista Aqua Safire (Tata) (Ex-sh @ hyd : 3.64 lacs) From the research, i have found that both are the same engine which is 1172 cc, 8V Fiat. They are also tuned to produce same power and torque. Moreover, they are also designed to pull vehicles of similar weighs. However, when it comes to FE, I see them widely different. Most of the reviews (professionals and current owners) on 1.2 Active are claiming good FE. On the other hand, majority of them on Vista safire claim okay to poor FE. How this is possible? Any insight.
	() Thanks

23rd December 2009, 10:13	#2
DieselFan Senior - BHPian Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Bangalore Posts: 1,584 Thanked: 259 Times	FE depends a lot on factors other than engine - ECU, exhaust system, Air filter, Transmission, suspension, wheels and tyres being the most important elements that influence the FE over and above engine.
	() Thanks

23rd December 2009, 10:18	#3
tj123 Senior - BHPian Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: BLR Posts: 1,148 Thanked: 680 Times	Adding to DiesalFan....some other parameters are Drag coefficient, weight , engine tuneup parameters, gear rations etc
	() Thanks

23rd December 2009, 10:37	#4
mohandas BHPian Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Hyderabad Posts: 266 Thanked: 27 Times	what is Drag coefficient? Is this something to do with Chasis? To my knowledge, most of the things that you and Diesel Fan have mentioned are same or similar. For eg, ECU, and engine tuneup are same, both are having fiat Transmission, both have got same suspension according to spec. Don't know about exhaust system and Air filter. But, then, how come they are sooooo different? Surprising? Isn't it?
	() Thanks

23rd December 2009, 10:54	#5
msharma_79 BHPian Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Gurgaon Posts: 262 Thanked: 23 Times View My Garage	May be you need to go back to your source which has given the info at the first place. Test drive the cars and let us also be aware of the changes. I would like to believe that vista should give a better mileage!!
	() Thanks

28th December 2009, 11:28	#6
mohandas BHPian Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Hyderabad Posts: 266 Thanked: 27 Times	re From a little research, this is what i have found. The ECU mapping of the SAFIRE and FIRE is difference. The chasis, and wheelbase of punto and vista is also different. Primarily, due to this, the FEs of vista and punto 1.2 are different.
	() Thanks

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