[nandab]

@arvind71181 and @PatienceWins:
Thanks, will consider Alto K10

Originally Posted by govigov

In my opinion please stay from both the options.

1. Tata nano is a pain at parking speeds with no power steering.
2. Hyundai eon has pathetic FE and cramped on space, you should also consider space as since you have two kids, it will require more space.

Great inputs. I had assumed FE of Eon should be good. What are the realistic numbers?

Originally Posted by govigov

What is the actual reason for selling the 1.6 Sports? Is the low FE bothersome? I would actually suggest that you stick with the 1.6 Sports unless you want to get rid of it.

Low FE is not the primary reason given my usage. It's the service aspect that is quite jarring. Several dealers have stopped servicing Palio, spare parts are difficult to come by, service network is abysmal. I had a decent service in Chennai during 2010 but the number of service centers has dwindled by 2012. Fiat has still not cracked the service problem and I am not sure going alone will improve things.

Originally Posted by govigov

Why not look at the pre-owned route for some options?

I can provided there is a good deal. Will continue to check this

[Viju]

Originally Posted by nandab

A little background since this post may be slightly different from others.

Given this, I am thinking of exchanging my Palio for a PointA-PointB city car. The exterior or the style/prestige factors are not important.

The following are my requirements in the order of importance:
1. Low cost => low initial cost, low running expenses, low maintenance
2. Drivability in the city => Slightly fuzzy factor but I think you get it. One should enjoy driving the car and not wish for a chaffeur
3. Hassle free ownership => opposite of Fiat's A.S.S
4. Decent interiors
5. Longevity => expect to use it for next 10 years
6. Budget => Ideally, I would like to pay the least but can review based on a strong rating in #1-5 above

Tata Nano and Hyundai Eon seem to fit the bill. What are your thoughts? Are there any other cars I should consider?

Hello Anand

I can very much relate to your situation.

When we needed a second car for my wife, I had pretty much the same priorities - having owned 3 Marutis, I took a chance - test-drove the Nano, loved it and bought one. It is another story that my wife doesn't touch the Nano now - once she became confident of her driving - as she prefers my Ritz. But I love the way it can be driven in the city - pretty much like a 4 wheeled Activa.

I would suggest you take a test-drive at the 2013 Nano with your wife and kids and decide if you like it.

The points where the Nano may not score (in my opinion) are:
2. Drivability in the city - although it is fun to drive, you need to downshift quite often. The low-end torque is not good and you may not enjoy the city drives in Bangalore traffic. Why don't you test-drive it in Bangalore peak traffic with 4 people and AC switched ON?

3. Hassle free ownership - fortunately, I have not had any bad experiences as far as TASS is concerned, yet. But we had a biker T bone the car and it was at TASS for over a month - over 2 weeks of the wait was to procure a single alloy wheel which was broken. The service experience so far has not been extremely bad, but nowhere close to what I have been experiencing at MASS.

5. Longevity - even I plan to keep the Nano for a long time, but I don't expect it to hold up as well as a Maruti or Hyundai somehow. Don't know why. But I hope I am proved wrong.

All said, I think the Nano would be cheap to run and cheap to maintain. Most of the spares are really cheap (cheaper than Maruti spares I feel). Even the labour charges are reasonable. It is the service experience which I found to be lacking.

It is not very practical if you do huge monthly grocery-shopping. The boot space is not as bad as people make it out to be, but the inaccessibility is really a pain!

As for the Eon, I am sure it fits the bill, but I really am not sure how fun it is to drive in the city. I remember driving one from the first batch and the refinement was not at par - it was a bit buzzy and the gear lever vibrated a lot.

If I was in your position, I would have given a though to the Alto K10 VXi. Yes, agreed that it is an old platform and all that, but I think it's an under-rated car. Would suggest you to test-drive one.

Hope this helps in some way. Happy shopping!

Cheers!

[govigov]

Originally Posted by nandab

Low FE is not the primary reason given my usage. It's the service aspect that is quite jarring. Several dealers have stopped servicing Palio, spare parts are difficult to come by, service network is abysmal. I had a decent service in Chennai during 2010 but the number of service centers has dwindled by 2012. Fiat has still not cracked the service problem and I am not sure going alone will improve things.

I can provided there is a good deal. Will continue to check this

Your reason is a valid reason. A good service network was one of my requirements as well when looking for a car, and as the car ages, it tends to show more troubles. It is good that you are looking at replacing this looking at a reliability point of view.

Please check the hyundai eon ownership threads, if driven properly it delivers an ok mileage, just a dab of spirited driving, and you can see the fuel level dropping. The interiors are ok and not that great. Coming from the magnificent and majestic interiors of the palio, you may not like the eon. Please look at the official report of the eon as well. However the eon is reliable and had good service network.

The TASS is not that great, for service center as a primary requirement it should not be considered. However the TASS has good reach and parts for the nano should not be an issue.

I would suggest to look at Maruti (Alto k10) for new and in the pre-owned market i would suggest Honda's and Toyota's.

[drmohitg]

I would suggest you choose from between the Nano and Alto if you want to keep your budget low. The Nano has been continuously improving and 2013 version looks quite promising. Tata's have showed all the signs off late of improving there after sales service and taking the private car business seriously. Easy to drive, park and spacious.

If not then you can also think of stretching your budget and going for the WagonR, one of the most practical MSIL city cars.

[nandab]

Originally Posted by Viju

2. Drivability in the city - although it is fun to drive, you need to downshift quite often. The low-end torque is not good and you may not enjoy the city drives in Bangalore traffic.

I had a test drive of the Nano today and understand what you mean. The drivability factor is a bit of a problem especially at lower speeds.

3. Hassle free ownership - fortunately, I have not had any bad experiences as far as TASS is concerned, yet. But we had a biker T bone the car and it was at TASS for over a month - over 2 weeks of the wait was to procure a single alloy wheel which was broken.

My Palio's current services are at a Tata motors service center. As you mentioned, they are adequate without anything special.

If I was in your position, I would have given a though to the Alto K10 VXi. Yes, agreed that it is an old platform and all that, but I think it's an under-rated car. Would suggest you to test-drive one.

Hope this helps in some way. Happy shopping!

Cheers!

Thanks, it was indeed helpful. Will check out the Alto K10.

[nandab]

All,

I had a test drive of Alto K10 yesterday. The engine and driving surpassed my expectations. If I was in the market for a new car (instead of exchange) and had the same expectations, no second thoughts about going for an Alto K10.

With the exchange, this is what Maruti offer:
Palio 1.6 Sports 2006 model (22500 kms) => 1.02 L
Season discount => 30 K
Exchange Bonus => 15 K
Corporate Discount => 3 K

Deriving from GTO's earlier thread on cost of car upgrades, this is what I arrive at:

Stay with Palio for next 5 years
Maintenance cost = 20K/year = 100000
Insurance = 8K/year = 40000
Fuel = 300000 (6000 km/yr, 9 kmpl, 90 Rs/litre)
TCO = 440000

+ Bigger car
+ Used (well-attuned; no worry about scratches)
- Fiat service quality
- Older car, more niggles

Switch to Alto
Cost of new Alto = 387000 (considering discounts)
Current resale value of Palio = 102000
Interest outflow = 37000 (10.5% interest loan foreclosed after 2 years)
Maintenance cost = 5K/year = 20000 (reduce year 1)
Insurance = 8K/year = 32000 (insurance waiver for year 1)
Fuel = 168750 (6000 km/yr, 16 kmpl, 90 Rs/litre)
TCO = 542750

+ Maruti A.S.S
- Smaller car

What are your thoughts?

Regards,
Anand

[nandab]

Originally Posted by nandab

What are your thoughts?

I missed adding my own thoughts:
1. If my commute increases in the future, moving to Alto seems a better option
2. If I move out of Bangalore, I will need to sell the Palio. Servicing in Bangalore is ok for now
3. Palio's resale value seems to be abysmally low with the dealers. The individual resale can fetch a higher price - but not sure how much more.
4. A lateral upgrade to a used sedan like Honda city doesn't cost me much more than a new Alto. However, I think the cost of ownership for a sedan will be higher than the Alto's.

In short, I think it's best to continue with Palio and reconsider if there are changes to #1-4 above. Please share your thoughts.

Regards,
Anand

[nandab]

Over the last 2 weeks, I have agonized over selling my Palio 1.6 and moving to a low maintenance car. Mainly, it was triggered by a harrowing service in Chennai last year and an upcoming service that could easily cost 8K. I went through several TBHP reviews, ownership reports, used car sales and test drives.

There was no single car in the hatchback segment that comes close to my Palio 1.6 NV Sports - styling is an evergreen classic, drivability in any condition from bumper-to-bumper to highways, great low end torque as well as mid range power, tank like build quality, rock solid at any speed, handling and cornering are amazing, steering feedback is spot on, clear gear shifting, riding is good, quite decent boot spacem. I get a FE of 9-10 kmpl in Bangalore without AC (not much lower than an i10, say). Servicing is not a major problem in Bangalore, as mentioned earlier.

I did TD of Nano, Alto K10, WagonR, Brio and read the reviews of i10, i20, A*, Ritz. There was something to like and dislike in each of these cars. In any case, none of them felt as well-put-together as the Palio. It could be my bias of course.

Considering want-vs-need, probability of issues in future and cost analysis, the logical decision is to stay with the car. The test drives helped me fall in love with my car again

It's quite amazing how more than a decade back, Fiat had put together a perfect car that manages to tick most of the boxes. If only the branding and marketing was done as it deserved :(

Thanks for all your inputs.

[deetjohn]

Originally Posted by nandab

I get a FE of 9-10 kmpl in Bangalore without AC (not much lower than an i10, say).

If you are OK with that FE, then none of the current budget hatchbacks will ever come close to your Palio on the other things that matter.

And more than anything, it was the FE which took Palio away from the initial success and the families. I recall the car even had a waiting period during the initial years when the market couldn't get enough of it.

One could also say, the car was well ahead of its time in our market. People were used to car like Zen, Santro, WagonR etc and not really ready for a B+ segment hatch. Well, hindsight is a wonderful thing!

[silverado]

I would not recommend TATA nano to any lady driver, since it does require some effort at parking speeds, and without any aids is difficult to reverse.

Apart from above mentioned things, Nano is a complete and absolute value for money City car.

[vasist]

The Nano's biggest advantage is also it's biggest bane , it's steering ! The non assisted steering is rich in feedback , communicative and direct , a rare thing in a Tata . At low speeds parking and u-turns requires quite a bit of effort . The engine is a happy bunny , feels peppy and eager . Braking on wet roads is scary though . Handling is decent , with a good measure of body roll thrown in . Compact dimensions makes getting in and out of peak hour traffic a breeze. Ride is a bit choppy . Special mention has to be made about the extremely powerful and efficient A/C . After having owned it for almost two years now , I can confidently tell it's every bit a proper car . In spite of all it's short comings you just can't help but fall in love with the cheerful Nano .

[PNTLovesNano]

Originally Posted by vasist

The Nano's biggest advantage is also it's biggest bane , it's steering ! The non assisted steering is rich in feedback , communicative and direct , a rare thing in a Tata . At low speeds parking and u-turns requires quite a bit of effort . The engine is a happy bunny , feels peppy and eager . Braking on wet roads is scary though . Handling is decent , with a good measure of body roll thrown in . Compact dimensions makes getting in and out of peak hour traffic a breeze. Ride is a bit choppy . Special mention has to be made about the extremely powerful and efficient A/C . After having owned it for almost two years now , I can confidently tell it's every bit a proper car . In spite of all it's short comings you just can't help but fall in love with the cheerful Nano .

I am exploring Nano as a second car. My Alto gives about 15kmpl in Bangalore peak traffic hours with about 30% AC all the time. What can I expect from Nano? Rather what's your mileage? This info will help me a lot

[vasist]

Originally Posted by PNTLovesNano

I am exploring Nano as a second car. My Alto gives about 15kmpl in Bangalore peak traffic hours with about 30% AC all the time. What can I expect from Nano? Rather what's your mileage? This info will help me a lot

With my driving style , and with the A/C on at all times I get a figure of around 17-18 . However my father who is a more sedate driver and doesn't use A/C as much get close to 21 in the city !

[PNTLovesNano]

Originally Posted by vasist

With my driving style , and with the A/C on at all times I get a figure of around 17-18 . However my father who is a more sedate driver and doesn't use A/C as much get close to 21 in the city !

Thanks Vasist. Thats useful info.

[sridhga]

Taking a re-look at this old thread. When I first started this thread, I wanted to buy a city car and compared a Nano and Spark. Most initial advice was against Nano and many suggested that Spark cannot be compared to a Nano and because Spark is a much superior car etc. Now when I look back at this thread, I see more Nano cars on the road and all those Sparks vanished. I am wondering how insight gained through collective intelligence can fail the test of time.