[sridhu]

Saw this damning report on VW after sales service.

Is this one off or fairly consistent for VW? I am seriously considering buying the VW Vento (in Bangalore) and hence this is not academic.

PS: I have no clue about Sushanth Khurana or the actual incident.

[el lobo 6061]

Originally Posted by sridhu

Saw this damning report on VW after sales service.

Is this one off or fairly consistent for VW? I am seriously considering buying the VW Vento (in Bangalore) and hence this is not academic.

Read the complete ordeal written by one Mr. Sushant Khurana. What I was expecting that's what happened.
Quoting from the website

The first five hundred kilometers went quite smooth, but then, my car touched a small bump on the road and after a kilometer or two it stopped.

First of all the car is a Polo 1.2 TDi in which the oil sump is placed quite low which has a tendency to hit over improper roads. I know its not an excuse. But please do hear me out. I'm no VW fanboy.

In newer Polo 1.2 TDi it has been revised where the ground clearance has been increased and plastic oil sump cover introduced to prevent any instances of sump hitting road.

Getting back to one Mr. Sushant Khurana quote, he has reported that the car Polo 1.2 TDi hit its underbelly and after a few kilometers it stopped. What can be inferred from is basically, he hit a stone and damaged the oil sump which in turn resulted in engine oil leaking from sump. Over the period of few kilometers engine oil completely drained out and engine stopped on itself which is basically engine seizure.

As its a engine seizure, it would definitely not be covered by manufacturer under warranty and as well as by Insurance company as it is a customers fault. As such in engine seizure the cost of repairing would be very high.

Lastly the ordeal he faced at VW Bhopal is certainly very bad on VW's After Sales part. Hoping there is a prompt solution to his ordeal.

[SirAlec]

THis is really scary considering we are going for a very expensive one very soon. the 1.6 TDI.

Please go through the blog! Here
blog.sukh.us/2013/10/planning-to-buy-volkswagen-car-in-india.html

Don't let this Diwali be a dreadful experience. For people who have a notion that German engineering is the only aspect to consider while buying a Volkswagen car, think again!


My car proved to be a toy within three months, encountering constant problems and pathetic after sales experience. And I'm not the only one here. The internet is filled with cases where people had similar experiences. In my case, a small bump on the road and some minor manufacturing defects led to a small bill of Rs. 4,00,000 not covered under warranty or insurance for a car costing Rs. 5,98,000 and that's for replacing the complete engine in 3 months (no body defects).


And the sad part is, it wasn't my mistake at all, no driving issues, no accidents! I have owned cars from Nissan, Maruti Suzuki and Hyundai, but this experience is something worth narrating. Also be aware that I don't represent any brand, I'm a Senior Product Manager in a software company. If you don't want to get duped, read on.


About four months back, I had to move to New Delhi. Looking for a nice A+ hatchback, I zeroed in on a Polo, took a test drive and booked it the same day in Noida. Pretty excited to buy a diesel car, just out of curiosity, I wanted to test the mileage of the car, especially since I lived closed to a highway (expressway) which has a speed limit of 100 kmph. To my surprise, the car was running between 13-14 kms per litre (the company claimed 22.7).

I got the car checked and there was a defect in fuel injection, which they corrected, didn't make any service receipts since the car was new (and probably they didn't want to document this) and things seemed fine now.


Three days later, the car charging point fuse was discovered off, again the same trouble of going to the service station, got it corrected, all good, no receipts, no charges.


In about two - three months, because of some uncertain changes in my life, I had to move to Bangalore. Because I had the experience of driving from Pune to Delhi, I thought I should take this car as well (I do love the driving experience of the car though, I won't deny that). Little did I know, I was in for an experience of my life.


The first five hundred kilometers went quite smooth, but then, my car touched a small bump on the road and after a kilometer or two it stopped. Being extra cautious about a new car, I thought I would call up the Road Side Assistance that was a part of my first year's warranty to help me know what the problem is and tow the car to the nearest dealership for any repairs. To my surprise, they were unaware of the nearest service station and said it would take them 14 hours to arrange help! And it was 8 in the morning on a Friday - when everyone's working. These guys were so lazy, I must have made at least 20 calls to follow up and get assistance. First I was connected to the Bangalore office of their outsourced company AXA Assistance, then their Delhi office. People were out for lunch when I tried to follow up. No towing truck could be arranged for the nearest service station in the capital city of a state, Bhopal (they were guiding me to Indore and Gwalior which were hundreds of kilometers away). After about 8 hours or so, they offered to take the car to a local repair shop nearby, which was totally unacceptable since I didn't want a new car to be touched by a non VW employee / dealership since it was under warranty and I did not want that to be void in any circumstances.



The car carefully dragged away from the road.

Standing next to a jungle at 11 PM and an alien village by the highway, with my parents, I finally managed to arrange a cab and a towing van on my own so that the car could be taken to the nearest dealer for inspection. The whole day had gone in struggling to find contacts there and I had realized that their Road Side Assistance is just another inefficient outsourced company that wouldn't even care if something happens to me or my parents in the middle of the highway.


The next morning, we gave the car for knowing what the problem is. It was discovered that the chamber under the car was touched and the engine oil had leaked. Apparently, the engine oil indicator was faulty as well! Not taking the trouble to following up with the company on such defects, their service folks immediately called the insurance company for inspection. By now, there was no job card made and no inspection done by the service engineers to tell the insurance company. I was too surprised, but was recovering from an eventful day by the highway. The service head gave me a verbal estimate cost of repair as 20,000 INR saying that half of it would be taken care by the insurance company and no job card was provided. He did not even specify how much time it would take and said he'd give me a call.


I decided to book a hotel room and book flights for my parents back as it didn't make sense for them to wait for the service people. Till now, if you're thinking that it was only the Road Side Assistance who had tortured me, you'd want to read further.


The road to Bhopal The same evening, one of the representatives at VW Bhopal gave me a call saying that the car is damaged and it would take about 50,000 INR to repair the car and these were "wear and tear" parts not covered by insurance or warranty. Interesting to know that the parts of a 3 months old car engine were damaged by "wear and tear" and not covered by warranty even. No one talked about the faulty oil indicator and all damages had to be borne by me. Amazing! I still didn't know that this was a confirmed written estimate from them and they said they would inspect further and If I didn't want the car to break down on my way, I should keep it with them.

Apparently, the same day, a guy calls me from VW, not willing to disclose his name and says that he could privately repair the car for 20,000 INR without involving Volkswagen and there would be no impact on the warranty. I refused saying that I cannot trust him and wanted the repairs to happen through the company itself.


Day 3 in Bhopal was a Sunday and I had to be back at work tomorrow. I had already wasted two days sitting in a hotel room waiting to know how much time it would take and how much money I had to spend to get my car back. I had already spent about 80,000 INR in flights, hotel and towing. Sunday evening, I'm told that it should take them 3 more days to get the car back to normal and they would call me to tell me the exact estimate. They ask me to sign a paper permitting them to open up the engine. I was pretty surprised how a bump on the road could lead to so much damage that they're not willing to tell me the estimate cost of repairing. I smelt something fishy. Either the car is too delicate or the dealership is trying to trick me since I was not a local.


About 7 days later I am told that the turbochargers might need to change as well, they're not damaged but they might be faulty. The new estimate now is about Rs 1,20,000 (that's 20-25% of my car cost). Interesting! I ask them to give this to me in an email to which they refused. I send a local friend to check with the dealership and a lady at the dealership informed him that the service head has threatened them to keep their mouth shut, the cost of repair was not more than 50,000 INR out of which some of it could be covered in insurance / warranty. I am surprised yet again!


About 10 days later, I am told that the complete engine needs replacement and it would cost me Rs 4,00,000 (Rs 2,00,000 more and I could buy the same car again!). Yet Again! nothing covered in warranty or insurance. Is the company liable for what they sell or not! I googled about similar stories and I found interesting references of similar things happening frequently all across India. I would update this post with the screenshots I took pretty soon.
Shirani Automobiles


Clueless, I asked my father to contact anyone in the ministry or court in Bhopal and help settle this situation. I felt cheated. After 15 days, the first written estimate came, after my father's friend, a high court judge in Bhopal called the owner of the dealership to his office. The cost of repairs had suddenly reduced to Rs 116,000 (still 20% of my car cost though).


I also emailed the VW Germany dialog center and customer care in India and narrated the whole experience. I also told them, the feedback calls are just a waste and no action is taken in favor of the customer. I had wasted enough time and money. Leave apart the mental pressure of dealing with a bunch of idiots who think they could get away with anything they want because I was not in their city.


Well, that did not help either, at the end of the day, VW Germany relayed the request to the India customer care (who were cc'ed in all my 18 - 20 emails I sent over the next 10 days) and then India customer care seemed to be a third party who forwarded the emails directly to the same Bhopal Service Center guy who was giving verbal estimates. I understood that the whole mechanism of after sales and sales was faulty and that's the reason why people were stopping me from buying a VW car.


I had no clue about the level of problems I had to face. And this is just a glimpse of it. The car dealership guy was adamant about doing phone calls and insisted on not giving estimates on emails. He finally gave me some stuff in writing when I marked the VW Germany dialog center but no one did anything about it. I do have a strong case to file in consumer court and I would probably do that.


To save himself, this guy emailed me that the car repairs are done and tested, and the cost of repairs is around 60,000 INR (not replacing the turbochargers - but it's strongly recommended since they have failed, but not damaged). Now he's asking for my permission to increase the invoice to 1,20,000 INR again stating that car would not be fully functional otherwise. I have consistently emailed the customer care about not dealing with this thief and escalate the issue about a damaged car being sold to me and the whole after sales experience. No one from their after sales team or customer care responded except for an auto reply! Even that is inconsistent!


My emails have just fallen into deaf ears and hence this initiative to tell the public about how Volkswagen works in India. This article is purely aimed to educate the public on the shortcomings they could face after buying a Volkswagen car. Don't let this happen to you! I would make sure that this article is also published in newspapers and I would pay to advertise the whole experience if I have to including sponsored posts on social networks to spread awareness about such a company.

Details about the car:

Car purchased from - Viraj Automobiles, Noida, UP, India - 30th June 2013
Given for repairs to - Shirani Automobiles (authorized VW service center), Bhopal, MP, India - on 5th Oct 2013 (Reported RSA on 4th Morning - 8:45 AM)

Registration Number - UP16AP6602
Current Status - At VW Bhopal Service Center (Shirani Automobiles): I am of a firm opinion, that they might be stealing original parts FROM MY CAR and doing private work for other clients, as they offered on the very first day (5th October, 2013).

PS: Mods Please move to relevant section

[Zappo]

My God!!! Everytime I read these cases I shudder to think what the potential buyers of VAG cars keep as their plan B!

These issues may crop up with any make or model. But it is the post experience narratives of shady dealerships and underhand dealings that are extremely scary! The estimates going up and down like a yo-yo. No written estimates. Shady phone calls to get these repairings completed in just 1/20th or even lesser costs without anyone being the wiser... They all point to this groups self-defeatist strategies that are working so against it.

[nitinbose]

Hi SirAlec,

I can understand the car getting damaged when you went over the bump. Its quite natural that the oil sump might have got a hit and oil leaked, in which case any manufacturer would deny warranty.

However, how is it that the bill started inflating like a balloon? From 50K to 200K? Are they trying to club up a few other car repairs or what? How is it that the turbo got damaged when the car hit a bump?

Though your car is under warranty I'd still recommend you to take it to a multi-brand service centre for a second opinion.

One more point to ponder, did the engine oil indicator glow steady when the car stopped? That should be the case if you vehicle oil had leaked off.

[pyrodrive]

Wow. This is just so pathetic. No words to say. The dealership guys are real crooks. Why do their estimates change so drastically and why do they deal only through phone calls?
An indifferent company and dealerships manned by crooks. They must think we Indians will lap up everything they throw at us in the name of german engineering. Glad to see you taking the fight to them. You are being treated very unfairly. Its a crying shame. We are with you. Enclose a link to this page in your further emails to the VW head honchos.

[asit.kulkarni93]

Even if offered for free of cost i wouldn't use any Skoda/VW product ever. Probably would sell them and buy a Toyota/Honda/Nissan. This is horrifying. I have no hopes of Skoda/VW progressing in India with such pathetic dealerships in India!

[amit_arya]

Oil leak and you drove, it is considered as Consequential damage and would not be covered by the insurance company. usually the BMW Secure , TATA Platinum AMC etc comes handy in such situations.

Since this is a new car, and you already had issues and the oil indicator light was not functioning and you have approach(s) at the court, you would win the case and you can use this to threaten the dealership but it would have a lot of pains with delayed gains.

Post on TBHP is good and now you need to make a blogger post and post it's URL along with flooding on Twitter and VW FB pages. Asking a few friends to counter post (not flood) VW FB page that due to such incident they are planning not to buy VW. This is the only sure short way to make these big corporates listen (Viral Marketing) and I have seen this working historically.

One of my friend who bought a premium (by Indian standarda) Hyundai car had got the engine seized in 15 days. He had to resort to all this and guess what? Whole engine changed and that too for free.

As a learning point, please take the Best AMC (if available) with Zero Dep insurance policy and a road side assistance service and have a few peaceful years of owning a vehicle.

I think you have got enough hints on your next steps and i wish you luck in dealing with the company.

[a4anurag]

Originally Posted by amit_arya

Oil leak and you drove, it is considered as Consequential damage and would not be covered by the insurance company. usually the BMW Secure , TATA Platinum AMC etc comes handy in such situations.

Since this is a new car, and you already had issues and the oil indicator light was not functioning and you have approach(s) at the court, you would win the case and you can use this to threaten the dealership but it would have a lot of pains with delayed gains.

I am sorry but owner didn't know it was an oil leak and the consequent damage as the oil leaks was informed to him the next day.

I quote from the owners post:

The first five hundred kilometers went quite smooth, but then, my car touched a small bump on the road and after a kilometer or two it stopped. Being extra cautious about a new car, I thought I would call up the Road Side Assistance that was a part of my first year's warranty to help me know what the problem is and tow the car to the nearest dealership for any repairs.

The next morning, we gave the car for knowing what the problem is. It was discovered that the chamber under the car was touched and the engine oil had leaked. Apparently, the engine oil indicator was faulty as well

He did the right job to stop driving and search a van to get the car towed to the nearest service centre.

The car is a lemon or VW A.S.S have changed parts like Skoda did or some such stuff and surprising part is neither of it is covered under insurance or warranty. Turbo Charger not under warranty is fishy stuff man.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



I am in the market for a hatchback as a replacement for my Ritz VDi. I was contemplating on Swift ZDi or a VW Polo GT TDI. But after this incident and another thread with DSG failure, I back off from VW, Skoda. Maruti it is!

India comes home in a Maruti - Absolutely and I vouch for it!

Anurag.

[amit_arya]

Originally Posted by a4anurag

I am sorry but owner didn't know it was an oil leak and the consequent damage was informed to him the next day.

I agree to you fully. However this is the truth. Read insurance policy legal terms and experience of others on this forum and other forums/sites.

Oil sump (some INR 500-1000) would be covered by insurance but the same would need to be paid because of co-pay (may be this is not the correct term, but its minimum amount the person needs to pay before insurance company pays). The damage to engine due to running without oil would not be covered by insurance. The faulty oil lamp should be covered by warranty.

Both VW and insurance company will wash their hands for damage to engine.This is a sorry state in india and nearly all products guarentees and warranties have the standard terms related to consequtional damages. Else I can sue the company on loss of business opurtunity for every delay due to malfunction of product or service. Just as an example, car broke down so could not reach office and lost job (or multi million dollar contract) and now car company/insurance is liable to compensate me with the same. Just substitute multi million dollar contract with engine seize in this case. The only grace for owner is that incase oil lamp was working correctly then he eould have stopped and avoided this damage and hence car company should correct the damage. Had that sensor been working fine I doubt any car company would have corrected for free (unlesd the maintenance AMC was bought)

I just shared my experiance and the best way forward. Would happy to learn any other alternate way the owner chooses and is successful to get the vehicle rectified by either insurance or warranty.

PS. Typed from mobile, sorry for typos and/or auto corrects by mobile.

[hrman]

Not good at all!! suspect the dealer has some shady deal up his sleeve. This guy should immediately have his car transferred to some dealer near where he stays and get it evaluated.
It appears his car underbody hit some stone or something (I don't believe his claim that his car's underbody was "touched " by a small bump) and fuel leaked, which caused his engine to seize. Pathetic response from the RSA is just not acceptable. When will VW learn?

[julupani]

The issues that seem to have cropped up here doesnt seem to be one of poor quality parts or poor manufacturing. The incident could probably happen to anybody, and in many cases insurance and manufacturer would probably not pay up.

But the problem here is not that some issue cropped up in the first place, but how the resolution of the issue was handled. The entire process is muddled, with the owner not getting any single clear picture.

And to me the worst thing of it all is, how VW themselves seem to handle the situation. There seems to be no effort on their behalf towards helping out a customer. It seems like VW has no intention of helping a customer once he has taken delivery of the car. All customer care seems to be handled by the dealers or other third parties who are free to do what they like, and resort to all sorts of cheats and scams to make money.

Even lazy after sales of companies like Tata and FIAT are much better than this. At least they react when you raise a complaint and make an effort to try and keep the customer happy. In this thread a Safari seems to have suffered from chronic issues which werent taken care of by Tata or its dealers. But at least Tata havnt washed their hands off the issue and have made an effort to sort the issue out amicably and to the customers benefit.

VW on the other hand seems to have a "I couldnt care less" attitude towards customer care.

[F150]

Let us all try to be objective.

Oil sump is broken and any consequential damage is not covered in any normal insurance policy, unless one opts for a policy with coverage for special instances like OIL sump damage and Hydro Lock.

No blame on VW here.

The initial estimate of Rs 20,000 is OK. Initial estimate is never accurate, it can go higher or lower.

No problem here too.

The oil indicator is faulty, how was this conclusion arrived at ?

Apparently, the same day, a guy calls me from VW, not willing to disclose his name and says that he could privately repair the car for 20,000 INR without involving Volkswagen and there would be no impact on the warranty. I refused saying that I cannot trust him and wanted the repairs to happen through the company itself.

The call was from the dealer and not VW, The dealer is definitely, murky. First signal to move the car to another dealer immediately.

VW Customer care didn't work as expected. VW is at fault here.

The customer should have been pro-active in moving the car to the destination Bangalore or to any other dealer., as soon as he smelled trouble.

All big brand names need heavy investments to open a dealership. It is often the case that people with deep pockets and undisclosed sources of income bid and win the dealership. They care a zilch about customer service.

It is a case of dealer being murky, VW has to take lesson or two on how MARUTI handles the dealers.


I dont think we should give too much weight to the claim that they may be exchanging parts. There is no proof, what so ever.

Mods please update the thread, to reflect the true picture and to remove any anti VW bias.

[eq24]

Originally Posted by F150

Let us all try to be objective.

Oil sump is broken and any consequential damage is not covered in any normal insurance policy, unless one opts for a policy with coverage for special instances like OIL sump damage and Hydro Lock.

No blame on VW here.

The initial estimate of Rs 20,000 is OK. Initial estimate is never accurate, it can go higher or lower.

No problem here too.

The oil indicator is faulty, how was this conclusion arrived at ?

Yes let's try to be objective, you say that we should remove any anti VW bias from this post, why?. Not saying that to incite negative sentiments for VW but in this position finding a positive is really impossible.

A poor guy is stuck in a different city with a faulty new car and he is doing his bit, the only bit one is told to do in such situations and that is to take the car to an Authorised Service Center, over there those guys rip him a new one.
At least he knows some people who speak on his behalf and maybe get things moving again, so to buy a VW car one should be connected. Even now the poor guy has no respite but to go to the courts, an unpleasant thing in its own right. And the dealer is an extension of the company itself isn't it? So if the dealer is wrong and the company does not do anything arent they equally responsible.

I agree there are people who have got good service from VW but looks like that is an exception, the rule being clearly that after you buy our car you are pretty much on your own.

[vb-saan]

Saw an old thread referring to the same dealer, probably a different city.
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...tomobiles.html

Unless manufacturers impose some stringent screening in dealership selection, these issues will continue to happen. And in many cases, a dispute with a dealer may prove costly for the manufacturer due to the monopoly (of the dealer) across various cities.

Originally Posted by a4anurag

I am in the market for a hatchback as a replacement for my Ritz VDi. I was contemplating on Swift ZDi or a VW Polo GT TDI. But after this incident and another thread with DSG failure, I back off from VW, Skoda. Maruti it is!

India comes home in a Maruti - Absolutely and I vouch for it!

Originally Posted by F150

It is a case of dealer being murky, VW has to take lesson or two on how MARUTI handles the dealers.

They do have a better record, but not absolutely free from these malpractices.
Related thread: http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...placement.html