[SuhasManjunath]

Originally Posted by drmohitg

if you really want to be on the safer side or give any importance to this issue, then don't just shy away from this dealership but rather altogether avoid Skoda. Only then they might understand the gravity of cheating a customer.

Very true !

Originally Posted by BopsKA12

And Skoda India is still trying to push people towards Vinayak Skoda? Would not even touch Skoda with a bargepole. Skoda is not for me and the people I know.

Originally Posted by shubhu3112

Skoda India was a bit pushy on trying to execute this sale through Vinayak Skoda. Not sure why.

This trend is still continuing and it might probably be due the financial year closing and the need to meet targets.
It's quite evident that Skoda is scared to lose dealers over customers, This can easily be understood when I had questioned Skoda to inform me the action taken against their dealer and Skoda was not ready to make a statement about the action taken against Vinayak Skoda and simply said "there has been a very stern action taken internally and it cannot be stated publicly" this also looks like a fake statement; When two of my friends had requested for a test drive of the Kodiaq and had plans of buying it, they were asked to visit Vinayak Skoda instead of Tafe Access (even though they live quite close to Tafe Access) and since they're not BHPians, they were unaware about my issue and the moment I spoke to them, they simply took their business to Toyota as they wanted peace of owning a car over anything else but I feel Skoda fails to understand that running a dealership will only be successful once they have satisfied customers and not just a dealer.

[AkMar]

Hi Suhas,

Are there any updates to share about your case? Saw this piece in May edition of about your case

Skoda clearly playing dirty here by claiming Suhas knew about the conversion before he bought the car

[Raghav_K]

Unrelated to the topic discussed here, but related to the manufacturer being discussed here.

I'm in the market for a car around 25 lakh, and the current state of Indian market is such that there are only a handful of options between 20-30 L. The Octavia falls in that range, and i checked it out yesterday at Gurudev Chennai. I did not even take a test drive, but i was impressed by the build and quality of the car, that i was convincing myself to go for this car.

Woke up today morning and i was browsing Team-Bhp while sipping coffee. This thread came up in the recent posts, i already knew about this thread, and clicked to see the latest updates. Sadly nothing much has changed, I really hope justice is served for you soon.

I smacked myself in the head, what was i thinking? After being a Hyundai customer for nearly a decade, most car manufacturers would be a downgrade for the after sales support, but Skoda, that would be a wild ride in opposite direction. I'm not ready for that yet, maybe never!

If Skoda is following this, One less customer for you, and one less car sold from your inventory!

[scorpian]

Buying a car is for peace of mind ownership at-least for a minimum of couple of years at-least that's how i look and think most of us would agree. With amazing build quality and whatever bells and whistles the skoda might offer,if the dealing nor service is transparent and customer friendly that itself is a big no-no for me.
After reading numerous horror stories regarding skoda, i wouldn't touch one,man i cant take the heartburn of a gearbox failing or having my car in the workshop for days together. Il rather stay happy with the other but more reliable brands, forget the brand at-least i have peace of mind that in case something goes wrong i have a channel to raise a complaint and see action happening,rather then running from pillar to post after paying my hard earned money.

[sxenimit]

Originally Posted by SuhasManjunath

Very true !

This trend is still continuing and it might probably be due the financial year closing and the need to meet targets.
It's quite evident that Skoda is scared to lose dealers over customers, This can easily be understood when I had questioned Skoda to inform me the action taken against their dealer and Skoda was not ready to make a statement about the action taken against Vinayak Skoda and simply said "there has been a very stern action taken internally and it cannot be stated publicly" this also looks like a fake statement; When two of my friends had requested for a test drive of the Kodiaq and had plans of buying it, they were asked to visit Vinayak Skoda instead of Tafe Access (even though they live quite close to Tafe Access) and since they're not BHPians, they were unaware about my issue and the moment I spoke to them, they simply took their business to Toyota as they wanted peace of owning a car over anything else but I feel Skoda fails to understand that running a dealership will only be successful once they have satisfied customers and not just a dealer.

It's quite appalling you even had to go through this, as well as having absolutely no support from fraud. Have you tried contacting news organizations and seeing if they will be of any assistance to you?

[SuhasManjunath]

Originally Posted by AkMar

Skoda clearly playing dirty here by claiming Suhas knew about the conversion before he bought the car

Hahaha , very true they are as dirty as their workshops look ?! They have been using this card ever since I dragged them to the courts but nor at any place have they provided anything to substantiate their claim .

Originally Posted by Raghav_K

Woke up today morning and i was browsing Team-Bhp while sipping coffee.

I smacked myself in the head, what was i thinking? After being a Hyundai customer for nearly a decade, most car manufacturers would be a downgrade for the after sales support, but Skoda, that would be a wild ride in opposite direction. I'm not ready for that yet, maybe never!

If Skoda is following this, One less customer for you, and one less car sold from your inventory!

That decision of yours to let go a Skoda would probably be the best that you have taken in terms of peace and reliability for you ! Also you've given yourself more peaceful mornings of sipping on coffee like you usually do.
Buying a Skoda would probably make you pitch a tent at the court or a police station and be fighting for your justice .

Originally Posted by sxenimit

It's quite appalling you even had to go through this, as well as having absolutely no support from fraud. Have you tried contacting news organizations and seeing if they will be of any assistance to you?

Yes, It was telecast-ed on News9 earlier and even the link for it was posted by me in a previous post.


Update :

On the legal side, the case is posted for 10th of May 2018 and we have to submit our arguments and post which the opposite parties will do theirs and later the judgement would be passed. Expecting the Judgement to come out by another two months.
Since the elections are around corner (12th of May 2018) I have a feeling that the case might get adjourned to another date by the of the month.

Skoda or the dealer on the other hand have not filed their side of evidence and it's quite interesting to see what their arguments would be, if at all they do so.
The dealer who had filed an application to contest the case after being an ex-parte for over 150 days has replicated his previous status by staying silent at the court again ! This action of his clearly indicates he just wanted to drag the case and not fight it out.

The apprise through Autocar :

I have been in touch with them for nearly 3 months and there has been a lot of too & forth negotiations.
Firstly Skoda said they would offer me Rs.8 lakhs and I shall have to return the car. When I put my point to Autocar saying this is a very substandard price to settle it, Autocar replied stating that Skoda said "offering Rs.8 Lakhs is itself a very high price since the car had apparently been driven for 80,000 kilometers already." This struck me saying their is some clear miscommunication as the car has not crossed the 7500 kilometers mark also.
Maybe the dealer has updated Skoda saying that the owner has happily used the car and driven 80,000 kilometers and hence we cannot give him a new car and closed the issue to make sure the manufacturer does not build pressure on the dealer to resolve the matter. This might be the the reason for Skoda making such a statement to Autocar.
Later I sent snaps of my ODO meter to Autocar to prove them about the actual reading of kilometers driven and further to that Autocar again spoke to Skoda and Skoda said they would offer the complete on-road price as refund against returning the car.
A few days later I received a e-mail saying they would refund Rs.11.37 Lakhs against returning the car. I simply declined this offer for the reason being I would lose out a-lot of money in terms of EMI and for the reason being the actual on-road price of the car is Rs.11,72,000 and not Rs.11,37,000
Such weeded quote by Skoda again hints me there is a lot that the dealer has been hiding from the manufacturer and is clearly playing dirty to make money in such situations also.

On the write-up by Autocar in their issue for May states three valuable points.

1. That I knew the conversion of the car before I bought it.
   
   If that's the case then why does a few of the documents (Such as Booking Order Form or their counterfeit Invoice ) issued by them state that it's a Black Package car?
   
   
2. That I have asked for an Octavia as compensation.
   
   This quiet made me feel like they have scrapped a statement from a comic book as never ever in my life I would want another Skoda, at least not a Skoda with failed gearbox
   
   The above two claims made by the dealer has whatsoever no evidence and even Autocar finds it suspicious.
   
   
3. They should have offered a brand-new car as compensation.

Most of the people that I have spoken to feel that offering a new car is the least that the dealer had to do and also Autocar feels the same.

This clears the air that the dealer is still not ready to give a suitable resolution !

Whether whatever done by Autocar has yielded me the desired result or not, I completely thank Autocar India for supporting me and doing their bit to push the dealer to at least to commit a price that they're willing to refund. Autocar writing about this on their magazine has again added some mileage for me to fight for justice.

Will keep the BHPians posted once a major action takes place.
Thank the family of team-bhp for the support and valuable advice.

[PraNeel]

Originally Posted by SuhasManjunath

A few days later I received a e-mail saying they would refund Rs.11.37 Lakhs against returning the car. I simply declined this offer for the reason being I would lose out a-lot of money in terms of EMI and for the reason being the actual on-road price of the car is Rs.11,72,000 and not Rs.11,37,000

All things aside, you are getting 11.37 lacs against on road price of 11.72 lacs for 7500 km run car. Don't you think it is a fair compensation by Skoda?
I am not defending dealer / skoda, but it will save a lot of legal hassles, time and frustration for you.

[SuhasManjunath]

Update :

After a heated ARGUMENTS session at the court between my lawyer and the dual opposition advocates, after stating the facts and piercing the Judge to make him understand the facts and the foul-play by the dealer, The case at the consumer court has now fast moved to a favorable situation.

At present, most of the proceedings are completed and the the case is posted for "for order" / Judgement.
After witnessing the whole session and hearing out to what the Judge had to say to the opposition lawyers post the arguments, I'm pretty confident of winning the case at the court and also getting complete Justice for the whole trauma. [I have a notable insight to the outcome of the judgement but will restrain from posting it till the judgement is pronounced]

Originally Posted by PraNeel

All things aside, you are getting 11.37 lacs against on road price of 11.72 lacs for 7500 km run car. Don't you think it is a fair compensation by Skoda?
I am not defending dealer / skoda, but it will save a lot of legal hassles, time and frustration for you.

It would have been a fair deal if the dealer had offered this when I first approached him to resolve my issue but instead the dealer went on to challenge his move of selling a fake-ed variant and now it's been over 15 months since I'm fighting it out and almost reached the desired solution.

On the other side, It took a-lot of effort even from Autocar to push the dealer to send out an e-mail stating their compensation.
If things can be analysed well enough, then we need to understand that the dealer was not keen for making this deal as they took NO or very little effort to even communicate with me (a couple of days to send a simple e-mail and no further communication or the will to negotiate with me)

Keep aside the above analysis, just think the trap that the dealer could have laid if at all I had agreed for this out of court settlement !? Maybe a claw or twisted term of settlement that could backfire post agreeing the offer.

when the dealer can state baseless comments to Autocar, sell a fake-ed car and further defend themselves as saints, then this option would've been a risky choice when I all I have to do is wait few more weeks for a Justifiable Justice from the court, that can made public and accepted without sour heartbeat of having a doubt the dealer will trouble you in other ways.

[drmohitg]

Originally Posted by SuhasManjunath

After a heated ARGUMENTS session at the court between my lawyer and the dual opposition advocates, after stating the facts and piercing the Judge to make him understand the facts and the foul-play by the dealer, The case at the consumer court has now fast moved to a favorable situation.

That is indeed great news. When is the judgement expected now? And can Skoda drag this further by going to a higher court? I only want to request you to not sign any non disclosure and let us all know the punishment awarded to the rogue dealer and car maker.

[SuhasManjunath]

Originally Posted by drmohitg

That is indeed great news. When is the judgement expected now? And can Skoda drag this further by going to a higher court? I only want to request you to not sign any non disclosure and let us all know the punishment awarded to the rogue dealer and car maker.

It is posted for 26th of June 2018 for orders, citing the behavior of the dealer so far, I expect them to not adhere by the court's judgement either, it will probably push them into forcing for implementation of the judgement and it will be a good visual for me to watch if that happens !

Yes , Skoda can appeal to the higher courts in order to save their prestige but considering the factors that they need to fulfill before appealing for higher court, I'll consider that also to be a uncomplicated challenge for me to come victorious. Also my legal team has thought of other handy operations and kept them right across their sleeves if they appeal to the higher court.

Definitely, not signing any non-disclosure is one of my agenda during this fight for justice , will keep my fingers crossed that no such legal hurdle would be placed in-front of me if only the right way of justice is ordered.

[PraNeel]

Originally Posted by SuhasManjunath

Keep aside the above analysis, just think the trap that the dealer could have laid if at all I had agreed for this out of court settlement !? Maybe a claw or twisted term of settlement that could backfire post agreeing the offer.

when the dealer can state baseless comments to Autocar, sell a fake-ed car and further defend themselves as saints, then this option would've been a risky choice when I all I have to do is wait few more weeks for a Justifiable Justice from the court, that can made public and accepted without sour heartbeat of having a doubt the dealer will trouble you in other ways.

The dealer did all of the above as you filed a case and everyone takes advantage of loopholes. Justice is delivered so late that is it not relevant.
I hope you get justice and the desired outcome. However, in most cases even court pushes for amicable settlement. Since court is involved there are no tricks to play.
You would have spent a considerable amount on litigation till now and it is natural to claim that. This is where things go to appealing in higher court etc.

Please don't think I am blaming you, however if you get an opportunity for a amicable settlement through court, go for it.
Even in Harish Kanchan's case things were resolved amicably only,where the cheating was of much higher order and for same company SKODA. http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...e-settled.html

[mac187]

Originally Posted by SuhasManjunath

Yes , Skoda can appeal to the higher courts in order to save their prestige but considering the factors that they need to fulfill before appealing for higher court, I'll consider that also to be a uncomplicated challenge for me to come victorious.

Finally we can expect some justice. Fingers crossed, hope this saga ends to your benefit.

Interesting to know that court can set-up pre-requisites before allowing to appeal to higher courts. Is this normal practice?

[SuhasManjunath]

Originally Posted by PraNeel

I hope you get justice and the desired outcome. However, in most cases even court pushes for amicable settlement. Since court is involved there are no tricks to play.
You would have spent a considerable amount on litigation till now and it is natural to claim that. This is where things go to appealing in higher court etc.

Please don't think I am blaming you, however if you get an opportunity for a amicable settlement through court, go for it.
Even in Harish Kanchan's case things were resolved amicably only,where the cheating was of much higher order and for same company SKODA.

The court did refer the case for mediation upon the request made by the advocate of Vinayak Skoda but what happened at the mediation was just killing the Judicial time and not the real will to settle the matter amicably, as the the representatives of Vinayak Skoda never turned up for any of the three mediation sessions and wasted over two months of time. So do you really feel they have any desire to settle the case ? [I have also posted the complete details of how the mediation proceeded and all important proceedings in the thread previously]

I have personally been in touch with Harish Kanchan, after hearing what he had to go through and what he had to do to get his case settled, I can easily say it was really traumatising for him.
Definitely, Harish being the gentleman, he gave me valuable inputs of how to go about and deal the Skoda crooks. I have considered them and followed it wherever possible.

What Harish experienced was something different, to quickly outline upon a few things around Harish's case :

• He bought a Skoda Octavia.(which was perfect at the time of purchase)

• Met with a unavoidable accident while driving on the highway, Sent the car for repairs.

• The dealer cheated him spurious-ly by fitting fake/non-genuine parts in his car.

• Caught the dealer red-handed with proof.

• Fought a legal battle and finally settled the case out-of-court as he got a reasonable and fair enough deal.

The difficulty that Harish faced was not when he bought the car but when he sent it for repairs, so it was the problem from the After.Sales.Service of Skoda and not the sales.

What needs to be considered in my case is altogether a different magnitude of foul-play.

• Booked a limited edition varriant , delivered a fake-ed lookalike car, without informing the customer of the tampering done to the car.

• The car was voided of it's warranty in different aspects even before they delivered it to me as it had non-standard fitments as per manufacturer standards.

• The insurance cannot be claimed if any unforseen accident took place as the varriant mentioned in the insurance is different from the actual car on road.

• Updated different Invoice values to the manufacturer and the customer, which opened a loophole to again make illegal profits.

In my case the problem has existed from Day 1 and it's from the sales and not A.S.S

To be honest, I have reasonable insights of Harish's case's settlement even though there was a non-disclosure form signed. The insight has come from a very reliable source and not Harish.

So, considering facts like the customer being in trauma from Day 1 of buying the car(in my case) and the way Skoda or it's dealer has handled the case. Further looking at the way Harish's case was settled, I would have also accepted an out-of court settlement if only a fair deal was offered at the right moment.
But nevertheless even till a day before the arguments took place in the court, I was open for negotiation and settling it amicably out-of-court but the dealer took no initiative to resolve it.
Now , it's a little late to take back the case as we are standing right in front of the finish line.

Originally Posted by mac187

Interesting to know that court can set-up pre-requisites before allowing to appeal to higher courts. Is this normal practice?

What I heard from my legal team is that, when you opt to challenge the case at a higher court, the court asks you to deposit the 50% value of the judgement awarded by the lower court.

[PraNeel]

Originally Posted by SuhasManjunath

The court did refer the case for mediation upon the request made by the advocate of Vinayak Skoda but what happened at the mediation was just killing the Judicial time and not the real will to settle the matter amicably, as the the representatives of Vinayak Skoda never turned up for any of the three mediation sessions and wasted over two months of time.

What I heard from my legal team is that, when you opt to challenge the case at a higher court, the court asks you to deposit the 50% value of the judgement awarded by the lower court.

Cheating is cheating whether done while delivering a new car or while doing accidental repairs. If the dealer is doing such malpractices then company shouldn't back them. You can see many cases on forum where companies like ISUZU and Ford have driven the dealer towards a solution. While Skoda and VW aren't in the same league.

Now, ideally whatever you are standing and fighting for, you should get it through court. However, given the legal loopholes and mindset of dealer and company it seems difficult. A verdict comes in your favour and then there is an appeal, the 50% money is deposited in court and not with you and the case keeps going on. And you keep on paying for litigation and other expenses.

Why not try again through court and settle a fair amount for returning the car + some extra amount for your troubles.

Just a thought and might be worth a try, otherwise you are already fighting the case. Good Luck.

[SuhasManjunath]

Originally Posted by PraNeel

Why not try again through court and settle a fair amount for returning the car + some extra amount for your troubles.

Unfortunately the court doesn't work that way, In the court when a stage of the case is closed, It's closed for good. The court does not let you go back and give you a second chance to go through the same stage again.
Saying that, we did have mediation at the court in an earlier stage where negotiations could have happened and even I was open to settle it and also attended 3 mediation sessions hoping they would come forward for negotiation and settle the matter, but unfortunately Skoda or Vinayak Skoda's representatives skipped all the mediation sessions and kept their reputation of not wanting to be customer friendly. Later the mediation was closed on the basis of their absenteeism and the case proceeded to the next stage.
And Irony here is, It was Vinayak Skoda's lawyer who appealed to the court to have mediation
If you can go through the posts earlier, you will also understand that Vinayak Skoda was an ex-parte for 155 days of the case and only later woke up from their sleep to try and fight the case at the court, so their absenteeism is not new to me or the court.