Never Take Your 4x4 Safari To TASS.

HappyWheels · 23rd May 2009, 15:13

Aman,

This is crazy! If this is what people at TATA are training these guys, then to hell with everything!

Crazy, absolutely crazy! 4H @ 80kmph!!!!

This is as crazy as it can get and I am running out of what to think of these guys!

Please (PLEASE) get a scanned copy of the "Training" material. This is definitely not even worth the paper it is being printed upon, but we need to have proof.

Quote:

Originally Posted by siddartha

...nothing wrong in using 4h on a wet/ slippery curvy highway especially if you are doing some serious speeds.

Seriously mistaken, Siddartha. Do not attempt to drive for long distance (not taking inter-state here, anything more than few KM's is long). If you do so, bye bye 4x4!

Quote:

Originally Posted by AMAN_SACHDEV

...According to me the TASS dumb guys have driven around 20-40 kms in 4H on highways,
what are the major parts that should I ask them to inspect which could have been damaged....

I would say anything and everything involved in the 4x4 needs to be inspected. It would be great (provided the new person who is coming knows about 4x4 properly) if you can get the person Varda, to repeat his out-of-this-world understanding of 4x4 in front of him.

AMAN_SACHDEV · 23rd May 2009, 15:25

definitely will try today to get a copy of those training material today...

BaCkSeAtDrIVeR · 23rd May 2009, 20:11

This is rather surprising. I can understand ignorance. I can understand foolhardiness. I can under dumbness. But justifying a misdeed claiming that they were told this is OK at TATA's training? Hun? Hope Tata waterboards the service guys.

BTW, where steeroid?

FanaticOnWheels · 25th May 2009, 10:26

It's sad that authorised dealers are doing such silly stuff. Hope nothing major happened to your Safari. And yeah, we are all eagerly awaiting those "notes"

.

rhandle · 25th May 2009, 10:41

Hahaha. Nothing can surprise me coming from TATA after 3 years of owning Safari. The advice to TATA owners is say "Tata to TATA". I am yet waiting though for a vehicle which can replace safari.

BTW it happened to me in Force Motor Delhi where the mechanic put the vehicle with Front Differential locked taking it to be Hand brake. Fortunately I saw it after driving a few meters.

tsk1979 · 25th May 2009, 10:50

Check the following parts
1. Front and Rear diffrential
2. Front auto locking hubs - Remove them and get them refixed
3. The locking pin
4. Tires.

Somebody from NIOC cancelled their xenon booking when they discovered that as part of PDI they had driven 100kms on the highway in 4H. The tires were damaged, and ditto for the diff.

If any part is making unusual whine etc., get it replaced. No repair, replacement.
If possible for you, I would recommend the check be done at Autolinks Gurgaon. Those guys were very very competent about the 4x4, and just by hearing the sound could make out that a pin was bent.
When the hubs cracked, they diagnosed the issue one shot, no hit and trial there.

AMAN_SACHDEV · 27th May 2009, 15:15

So today Customer Support Manager came to Dinco Motors,
Checked my vehicle and told me it was ok,
but I will also get it checked at Autolinks , Gurgaon.

For guys who don't know why part-time 4x4 should not be used on hard surfaces,
here are the link
Different wheel speeds in turns - Harald Pietschmann's 4WD basics
part time 4WD systems can not be used on pavement
Driveline bind, binding hubs, axle wind up, axle bind, drive line wind up - all terms for one thing: stress due to part time 4 wheel drive

suman · 27th May 2009, 15:45

I think you should take it to another workshop & ask them to check without giving them the background.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AMAN_SACHDEV

hi suman, this mail id is not working..

Sorry about that mate - its pramod.shanbhag

tsk1979 · 27th May 2009, 16:44

Yup, agree with suman. Tell them you are hearing strange noises when you engage 4x4. They will open up the hubs and all. If there is any damage, they will easily give warranty replacement, unless there are easy too see damanges caused be 4x4 on tarmac. If they say 4x4 on tarmac damaged this, then you can jump on Tata and tell them to replace all damaged parts.
That said, did the customer care guy get the 4x4 diff etc., opened and then he made the statement, or did he take a small TD

AMAN_SACHDEV · 27th May 2009, 17:01

Hi Tanveer and Suman,
He took a small test drive, didn't opened anything.
And then lifted the car on hydraulic lift and asked a guy to start engine and put gear into 1st with 4H and let the all wheels roll at idle engine speed. Then standing underneath the vehicle he checked if any different kind of noise was coming.
I asked him open the hubs but he said they are working fine. and same for diff..

Will get it checked at Autolinks for sure, by the way is the warranty void if differentials are opened.

tsk1979 · 27th May 2009, 17:10

Warranty will be void only if somebody other than TASC opens them

BaCkSeAtDrIVeR · 30th May 2009, 17:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by tsk1979

Warranty will be void only if somebody other than TASC opens them

How will they know?

I mean, if electronic equipment is opened, there would be a seal. But on automobiles with so many "openable" parts??

HappyWheels · 2nd July 2009, 14:51

Aman,

Did this progress? Do you have any more issues or is everything sorted out?

Samurai · 2nd July 2009, 15:25

Oh god, I saw this thread only today. I think no training is better than this kind of wrong training. I hope Maruti guys are not tesing my GV on locked mode.

In India, there is very little knowledge about 4WD driving outside of enthusiast circle. Even mechanics don't know how to use 4WD. The local Mahindra service advisor who is otherwise very competent, actually thought 4WD is for driving in ghats. Since I was repeatedly going to Agumbe ghats for testing the cooling system last year, he thought I was also using 4WD while climbing on tarred ghats roads. Good thing I always leave the free wheeling hubs in unlocked mode. Once I had found the Jeep in 4H when I got it back from the local mechanic. Since hubs were unlocked, there was no cause for worry.

Hubs are the first line of defence against axle and transmission windup. They will crack under the windup stress before anything else. You should insist they open and check the hubs.

tsk1979 · 2nd July 2009, 15:37

In the safari even if hubs are damaged it will not show up.
Only after you open the hubs, and then refit them you will discover that they are not gripping.

23rd May 2009, 15:25	#17
AMAN_SACHDEV BHPian Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: N.C.R. Posts: 112 Thanked: 6 Times View My Garage	definitely will try today to get a copy of those training material today...
	() Thanks

23rd May 2009, 20:11	#18
BaCkSeAtDrIVeR BANNED Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Kochi Posts: 2,522 Thanked: 752 Times	This is rather surprising. I can understand ignorance. I can understand foolhardiness. I can under dumbness. But justifying a misdeed claiming that they were told this is OK at TATA's training? Hun? Hope Tata waterboards the service guys. BTW, where steeroid?
	() Thanks

25th May 2009, 10:26	#19
FanaticOnWheels BHPian Join Date: May 2009 Location: Chennai Posts: 330 Thanked: 111 Times	It's sad that authorised dealers are doing such silly stuff. Hope nothing major happened to your Safari. And yeah, we are all eagerly awaiting those "notes" .
	() Thanks

25th May 2009, 10:41	#20
rhandle BHPian Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Ghaziabad Posts: 549 Thanked: 117 Times	Hahaha. Nothing can surprise me coming from TATA after 3 years of owning Safari. The advice to TATA owners is say "Tata to TATA". I am yet waiting though for a vehicle which can replace safari. BTW it happened to me in Force Motor Delhi where the mechanic put the vehicle with Front Differential locked taking it to be Hand brake. Fortunately I saw it after driving a few meters.
	() Thanks

25th May 2009, 10:50	#21
tsk1979 Team-BHP Support Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 23,717 Thanked: 22,825 Times View My Garage	Check the following parts 1. Front and Rear diffrential 2. Front auto locking hubs - Remove them and get them refixed 3. The locking pin 4. Tires. Somebody from NIOC cancelled their xenon booking when they discovered that as part of PDI they had driven 100kms on the highway in 4H. The tires were damaged, and ditto for the diff. If any part is making unusual whine etc., get it replaced. No repair, replacement. If possible for you, I would recommend the check be done at Autolinks Gurgaon. Those guys were very very competent about the 4x4, and just by hearing the sound could make out that a pin was bent. When the hubs cracked, they diagnosed the issue one shot, no hit and trial there.
	() Thanks

27th May 2009, 15:15	#22
AMAN_SACHDEV BHPian Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: N.C.R. Posts: 112 Thanked: 6 Times View My Garage	So today Customer Support Manager came to Dinco Motors, Checked my vehicle and told me it was ok, but I will also get it checked at Autolinks , Gurgaon. For guys who don't know why part-time 4x4 should not be used on hard surfaces, here are the link Different wheel speeds in turns - Harald Pietschmann's 4WD basics part time 4WD systems can not be used on pavement Driveline bind, binding hubs, axle wind up, axle bind, drive line wind up - all terms for one thing: stress due to part time 4 wheel drive
	() Thanks

27th May 2009, 16:44	#24
tsk1979 Team-BHP Support Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 23,717 Thanked: 22,825 Times View My Garage	Yup, agree with suman. Tell them you are hearing strange noises when you engage 4x4. They will open up the hubs and all. If there is any damage, they will easily give warranty replacement, unless there are easy too see damanges caused be 4x4 on tarmac. If they say 4x4 on tarmac damaged this, then you can jump on Tata and tell them to replace all damaged parts. That said, did the customer care guy get the 4x4 diff etc., opened and then he made the statement, or did he take a small TD
	() Thanks

27th May 2009, 17:01	#25
AMAN_SACHDEV BHPian Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: N.C.R. Posts: 112 Thanked: 6 Times View My Garage	Hi Tanveer and Suman, He took a small test drive, didn't opened anything. And then lifted the car on hydraulic lift and asked a guy to start engine and put gear into 1st with 4H and let the all wheels roll at idle engine speed. Then standing underneath the vehicle he checked if any different kind of noise was coming. I asked him open the hubs but he said they are working fine. and same for diff.. Will get it checked at Autolinks for sure, by the way is the warranty void if differentials are opened.
	() Thanks

27th May 2009, 17:10	#26
tsk1979 Team-BHP Support Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 23,717 Thanked: 22,825 Times View My Garage	Warranty will be void only if somebody other than TASC opens them
	() Thanks

2nd July 2009, 14:51	#28
HappyWheels Senior - BHPian Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Bangalore Posts: 4,106 Thanked: 537 Times	Aman, Did this progress? Do you have any more issues or is everything sorted out?
	() Thanks

2nd July 2009, 15:25	#29
Samurai Team-BHP Support Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Bangalore/Udupi Posts: 25,828 Thanked: 45,555 Times View My Garage	Oh god, I saw this thread only today. I think no training is better than this kind of wrong training. I hope Maruti guys are not tesing my GV on locked mode. In India, there is very little knowledge about 4WD driving outside of enthusiast circle. Even mechanics don't know how to use 4WD. The local Mahindra service advisor who is otherwise very competent, actually thought 4WD is for driving in ghats. Since I was repeatedly going to Agumbe ghats for testing the cooling system last year, he thought I was also using 4WD while climbing on tarred ghats roads. Good thing I always leave the free wheeling hubs in unlocked mode. Once I had found the Jeep in 4H when I got it back from the local mechanic. Since hubs were unlocked, there was no cause for worry. Hubs are the first line of defence against axle and transmission windup. They will crack under the windup stress before anything else. You should insist they open and check the hubs.
	() Thanks

2nd July 2009, 15:37	#30
tsk1979 Team-BHP Support Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 23,717 Thanked: 22,825 Times View My Garage	In the safari even if hubs are damaged it will not show up. Only after you open the hubs, and then refit them you will discover that they are not gripping.
	() Thanks