[GTO]

Abhishek shares his predicament and is looking for advice from the community.

I owned a BMW 730 LD (2007 model), the said car was stolen around two months back. I had both the original keys with me; one key was in my immediate possession when I came to know about the said theft & the other key was safely locked in a cupboard at my residence. For complying with the insurance conditions, I handed over both the said original keys to the Investigator concerned appointed by the Insurance Company.

Now after 2 months, the Insurance Investigator is saying that they have obtained the last activation status of one of the original keys from the BMW dealership, and the said status reveals that one of the said keys had been activated / used in my vehicle after the time of theft.

To my utter surprise, the insurance company is now trying to imply that I myself had a role in the theft of my car.

Please help me out by throwing light on the following:

(i) Can the last activation status of the key handed over by me to the Insurance Investigator be altered/ hacked/ compromised;

(ii) What could be the probable reason that such a status is being shown by the BMW dealership when the original key was safely kept at my residence under lock and key.

Please quote some sources of the information shared by you to help me quote the same at the time of giving my justification to the Insurance Company.

The key of the said vehicle looks like this:

[hothatchaway]

Am assuming that the complainant had filed FIR with the police. If the insurer is implying that he had any malafide intent, let the police investigate.

[--gKrish--]

Are they overlooking the fact that keys can be replicated? Here is a related news article.

hhttp://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencet...-help-out.html

BMWs made before September 2011 at risk of theft from £18 cloned key-fobs (but company says it is 'not legally obliged to help out')

In a statement to the BBC, BMW gave a brusque response: 'Certain criminal threats, like the one you have highlighted, simply do not exist when cars are designed and developed.

'This does not mean the car companies have done anything wrong, neither are they legally obliged to take any action.'

'We are now in the process of offering, to any concerned customers of targeted models, extra technical measures which will mean that their car cannot be taken using the equipment highlighted in these stories, although of course there is no such thing as an unstealable car.'

Earlier this year, a 7 series was stolen in minutes.
https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-new...s-bmw-12118309

[Turbanator]

status reveals that one of the said keys had been activated / used in my vehicle after the time of theft.

I don't think BMW Keys communicate on their own with BMW servers at dealerships or elsewhere so unless someone physically brings the car or the key, how is it possible?

[v12]

Can we have more details on which city, color, registration number of the said car? Its difficult to hide a 7 Series for very long - it would surely come up somewhere. Pics of the car would help.

[Maverick5490]

A BMW 7 series being stolen in India is unheard off. Is he the first owner of the car? has a key ever been lost also was the car serviced at a local place where the key might have been replicated.

[Akshay1234]

Why don't you take your key to the BMW dealership and do a key scan, and see what all results pop up on the scan. I remember seeing the key scan of the E90 I had earlier, and I don't think it had any parameter like this. If your key hasn't been used in that vehicle then I don't understand how they can claim it has been used after the theft.

I think in cases like this its possible the IDV of the car is more than the actual resale value, so insurance company may get some cases like this which are scams.

[Jaggu]

Originally Posted by --gKrish--

Are they overlooking the fact that keys can be replicated? Here is a related news article.

Originally Posted by Akshay1234

Why don't you take your key to the BMW dealership and do a key scan, and see what all results pop up on the scan. I remember seeing the key scan of the E90 I had earlier, and I don't think it had any parameter like this. If your key hasn't been used in that vehicle then I don't understand how they can claim it has been used after the theft.

Clear cut solutions and what can be the other reason why the vehicle was stolen are mentioned above.

But knowing that insurance company went with so much of trouble to check for key scan etc is quiet surprising. Especially in an Indian context? Is it a private insurance company?

[AMG Power]

Information on the last use of a BMW key CAN BE RETRIEVED FROM THE KEY if the key has been used.

This is something that CANNOT be fabricated and if it shows that it has been used, that would be accurate information.

Once this information is retrieved from the key, it will be on the BMW service portal permanently and can be retrieved by any BMW ASS.

The current owner can go to any ASS and find out this information for himself and easily call the insurance company's bluff if that be the case.

However, if the car is tampered with by unauthorised personnel before the information is retrieved from the key by the ASS the information can be permanently lost. However this doesn't happen to be the situation in this case.

[v12]

Just digged some info and the Service Center can access a whole load of info.

http://www.1addicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=401433

VIN number - factory name
model - model number
type - color code (exterior)
kms/miles - todays date & time!
key version - key number sub set
interior option color code - origin
last time key was used - in service date
production date -next service date
next service date -fuel tank level in liters
brake fluid change date - outside temp
coolant temp - ?
average distance per week - ?
engine codes/failures - ?
factory coding - ?
key number - ?

[Turbanator]

Originally Posted by AMG Power

Information on the last use of a BMW key CAN BE RETRIEVED FROM THE KEY if the key has been used.

You mean, if we take the key to Dealership, they can tell when was the last time car was opened or closed? I don't think this is possible.
However, they can surely give information about the last time it was run/ started as they key will have that recorded.

So, going by the observations of Insurance company, it means that the complainant or the thief had run the car with one of the Keys after a theft was reported? If that's the case, then I am afraid, it needs to be explained.

[v12]

Found some more news - 2 months old and involves a BMW 7 Series.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.fin...?source=images

[anjan_c2007]

Originally Posted by GTO

Abhishek shares his predicament and is looking for advice from the community.

They cannot get away with such false and defamatory allegations. Please send them a legal notice, saying that the owner will be compelled to file two petitions in a competent court of law :-

(1) To pay the insured value of the car (with an interest @ 12 % p.a.) till the date of such repayment by the insurer. Mention that the car was stolen using unspecified keys/unlocking device/s and refer to the FIR lodged by the owner (FIR no. Police Station, Dist., State and Date).

(2) A criminal defamation suit to claim a few crores (the owner with his lawyer can fix such an amount) of damages for defaming the owner by making defamatory, mischievous and frivolous allegations about the "False" theft of the car. Because they are trying to imply that the owner himself had a role in the theft of his car. The owner can state that such allegations have agonised him and have lowered his esteem in the society, despite his being a law-abiding citizen.

[Rehaan]

Originally Posted by Turbanator

... unless someone physically brings the car or the key, how is it possible?

He says he gave the Insurance Company the keys:

"I handed over both the said original keys to the Investigator concerned appointed by the Insurance Company."

Originally Posted by Jaggu

But knowing that insurance company went with so much of trouble to check for key scan etc is quiet surprising.

Indeed - and the fact that they took 2 months for this.


If the Insurance Company is denying his claims on these grounds - Abhishek should ask them to share the official key readout report from the BMW dealership for starters. There's a good chance there's something incorrect there itself (eg. misreading of the date / misinterpreting of the parameters - or it could even be a report from another vehicle).


Even if the car was stolen with a "duplicate" key -- this last-activation info would NOT be on the key fob he had with him / in his cupboard.

So the only 2 possible outcomes I see are:

1) This key was used to open or drive the car after it was stolen
2) The "key report" is being falsely/incorrectly used as a claim-denial tactic by the insurance company

EDIT: 3) If a signal receiver/extender like shown in the video below is used - will the key log it?

[Jeroen]

Apparently it is real easy to steal a BMW-7.

Have a look at this”

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5nimhemmpxs