[ikoneer]

Originally Posted by aniketi

When prices of everything is increasing, petrol is also going to increase. But this pain is due to fact that Diesel is not increasing? What if diesel has also gone up with Petrol?

the typical 'why me... why not You?', though it might give a momentary happiness (just kidding !!).
Considering the number of times petrol rates has been revised in a year and considering my 8.8 kmpl mileage from i10, what choide have i got but to regret.

[amolpol]

Well, if I had a choice, I could swap the i10 for a diesel figo or a micra. With the petrol prices up at rs.71 and a mileage of 12 kmpl for the 1200kms every month, its become an expensive small car. While I love the way the car handles itself in the city, the fuel cost happens to be 50% more than the Safari.

We got it primarily for my wife coz it would be easier to drive a petrol car(she needed a tiny car and she hadnt found the diesel indigo easy to drive, so I thought a petrol would suit her better). But now I'm regretting on the decision of buying petrol vs diesel.

[mi2n]

Originally Posted by aniketi

Just one question to all. I know it hurts when you fill the petrol with increased rates. When prices of everything is increasing, petrol is also going to increase. But this pain is due to fact that Diesel is not increasing? What if diesel has also gone up with Petrol? Your thinking would have been same or different? Just a thought

Its quite obvious that the gripe/outcry would have been much lesser if the diesel prices were also heading skywards simultaneously. But that said, a price hike would still hurt, intermittent hikes would be even more annoying notwithstanding the price levels of the alternative fuel.
Thinking rationally, a price hike in diesel would still be passed on to petrol car users indirectly by means of escalated prices of most daily commodities. So that's not desirable anyways.
The "pain" you are talking about would exist nevertheless. We do have a tendency of planning our monthly finances/expenses in advance and sudden/intermittent price escalations do make us uncomfortable.

[n:CorE]

Originally Posted by aniketi

Just one question to all. I know it hurts when you fill the petrol with increased rates. When prices of everything is increasing, petrol is also going to increase. But this pain is due to fact that Diesel is not increasing? What if diesel has also gone up with Petrol? Your thinking would have been same or different? Just a thought

Why not? IMO, Diesel engines are really torquey, and in many instances have a turbo and if its put down well, voila you might just end up with a winner (VW Vento), despite its diesel engine. Diesels earlier were rejected because of refinement/noise (which still is an issue in the small-car segment, but will eventually be taken care of).

With the entry of a player like Volkswagen, German technology and engineering has become more accessible and its not just restricted to the Big 3 (Merc/Audi/BMW). And the Germans are most definitely known for their diesels. The fact that petrol prices are rising is because its global.

Diesel is the next-gen fuel solution IMO, we will just have to wait and watch.

I came across two Civic A/T owners in this thread, i have one too, undoubtedly its an incredible car, but i seriously wished i had a Laura TDi DSG or a Chevy Cruz A/T when i am out on even a slightly distant drive, i feel like a fool when I push the throttle a wee-bit hard .

My family is looking out for a new car, replacement for my old Corolla 1.8 A/T (2005) and what has now caught my eye is the new VW Passat, we were thinking of going premium (5-series/A6) but because rising fuel prices and other expenses, we have decided to go smaller. I don't think the car can be hampered just because it has a diesel under the hood. The review by ajmat has got me pretty much convinced, its just a matter of a TD now. The blue credentials, a nice 168bhp 2.0 TDi engine and a DSG Gearbox .. Is a winner for me

[tj123]

I will still say if a person is doing less than 1000 km every month then there is no point going in for a diesel as the time to recover your extra investment on diesel engine will be quite long.

Secondly Governments skewed fuel policy is harming the nation; leading to dieselization of cars & SUV's in the private segment. I feel its really criminal to see high end SUV running on subsidized diesel diet meant for transport and agricultural sectors.

Let’s hope government has the courage to take harsh decisions.

[smrtdvl]

Originally Posted by mi2n

Thinking rationally, a price hike in diesel would still be passed on to petrol car users indirectly by means of escalated prices of most daily commodities. So that's not desirable anyways.

+1 to that. Think of paying 10% extra on almost all your monthly expenses cos of diesel prices going up

Am saving Rs.1250 p.m cos of choosing a diesel option ahead of petrol thus saving 15k per year and eventually on 5 years of my ownership 75k. And while selling my car diesel variant will fetch me price accordingly. So its your decision guys so no grudge on diesel owners.

[selfdrive]

Originally Posted by mi2n

Thinking rationally, a price hike in diesel would still be passed on to petrol car users indirectly by means of escalated prices of most daily commodities. So that's not desirable anyways.
The "pain" you are talking about would exist nevertheless. We do have a tendency of planning our monthly finances/expenses in advance and sudden/intermittent price escalations do make us uncomfortable.

Perhaps there would be no price hike in diesel, but diesel car owners (the kind Mr. Ramesh was complaining about!) may be required to pay something like an annual tax on their car, that would increase the cost of diesel for them and ensure that the govt. does not provide subsidy for personal car usage.
Just a thought; I hope for the sake of you dieselheads this does not happen; otherwise it is pure crab mentality

All I hope is that they dont overcharge on petrol to compensate for the subsidy they say they are providing on diesel

by the way, I have a basic question: can the govt. not reduce the tax on both fuels and deregulate diesel prices? In this case the burden on the common man will be the same or less; the govt will have to just look for new sources of income!

[GTO]

I got the Civic home just about a year back and it gives me 9 kpl in Mumbai city traffic. Do I regret it? HELL NO! Well, a reason could be that my other 3 cars are all diesel . And when you high-revv that petrol at 7,100 rpm, your brain automatically goes "There is more to life than kpl". Of course, it sings a different tune when filling up 45 liters at the pump (when did a full tank start costing 3 grand!!!!)

There is no ways that I would have all 4 of my cars with a petrol engine in the current scenario. A regular 1,500 kms a month @ 9 kpl leads to a fuel bill of Rs. 11,333. You can get away with enjoying a petrol car - and you really can't match the high-revving sensation of a petrol in anything else - as long as you have another diesel in the house for the high mileage running.

Originally Posted by ar@v1nd

Making it a one time tax would make the amount too high for the buyers to bear. Also, if it is a one time tax, all the lucky buggers who already bought a diesel car, would escape

Not to mention, the resale value of existing diesel cars would shoot up!

Originally Posted by n:CorE

With the entry of a player like Volkswagen, German technology and engineering has become more accessible and its not just restricted to the Big 3 (Merc/Audi/BMW).

VW has given the Vento a great diesel, but the Polo's 1.2 L is poor. Too much lag and not that much power. I don't think VW has brought anything revolutionary to the sub 10 lakh segment. On the other hand, Hyundai was the first to bring crdi engines at a lower price point, while it's the Fiat MJD that really took common-rail turbos to the masses.

Originally Posted by tj123

I will still say if a person is doing less than 1000 km every month then there is no point going in for a diesel as the time to recover your extra investment on diesel engine will be quite long.

Not really. There are several cars whose petrol / diesel variants give 9 / 12 kpl (respectively). Even with an SX4, you'd recover the difference in less than 3 years. And that's with only 1,000 kms of running.

[sameern.85]

Not really. There are several cars whose petrol / diesel variants give 9 / 12 kpl (respectively). Even with an SX4, you'd recover the difference in less than 3 years. And that's with only 1,000 kms of running.[/quote]

My two cents -
I also think that at an impulsive level, its makes much difference for automakers to introduce more diesels.
Imagine a picture - You are filling up your Civic with petrol and next to you in a Jetta/ Laura filling up diesel.
He has to pay much lesser (considering the fuel rates) and go more distance.
Now imagine the same scene with a cost conscious buyer of the hatch segment. It makes a world of a difference.
I have driven a Swift diesel on a full tank for 1 week 6 days in Mumbai traffic with A/C. and I drive a Santro (petrol) full tank in Mumbai traffic just for 5 days. This has to do with fuel apart from the fact that Swift has a larger tank.

I think for mass models (hatchbacks, entry level sedans etc.) this absolutely holds true. For starters, just look at Figo sales figures, I'm sure they must be in the ratio of 65% diesel, 35% petrol.
Diesel is the ask of the day and customers don't mind paying more initially for a diesel powered car and reaping its benefits later.

[avisidhu]

Originally Posted by GTO

Not to mention, the resale value of existing diesel cars would shoot up!

VW has given the Vento a great diesel, but the Polo's 1.2 L is poor. Too much lag and not that much power. I don't think VW has brought anything revolutionary to the sub 10 lakh segment.

But then GTO, wouldn't that also lead to a corresponding increase in resale value of petrol vehicles as well? Since it might begin to make sense for a lot of folks to go for used petrol vehicles at such price points. At least that's what I would like to believe

Coming back to the topic, purchased ANHC around 6 months back, and have been regretting the decision not to have gone for the Vento. The waiting period had put me off, plus I underestimated my monthly running (it has exceeded 1500 KM's a month).

The only saving grace is that I use it mostly to travel to my hometown on weekends, and take some colleagues along as carpool, which really helps a lot. Also, fill it up in Haryana or Chandigarh, and make it a point to return back to Chandigarh without having to fill up in Punjab, where the prices have shot up to 70 plus bucks now (Diesel is at 36).

Btw what do the experts think is the more likely scenario, deregulation of Diesel or additional tax on Diesel vehicles, or maybe a mixture of both?

[SR-71]

Originally Posted by GTO

Not really. There are several cars whose petrol / diesel variants give 9 / 12 kpl (respectively). Even with an SX4, you'd recover the difference in less than 3 years. And that's with only 1,000 kms of running.

Correct me if I am wrong - What about engine life ? Isnt it true that a good diesel car would be worth its salt only till 1L Kms whereas a good petrol engine (in similar segment) would be happy to do another 50 to 60 K on the ODO. So wouldnt it make sense to buy a petrol if its long term ownership ?

[vina]

I went through the same dilemma between September last year and April this year.

given my requirements I needed a car with lots of space, but not much annual mileage - Figo petrol made sense (wife rejected Indica Vista out of hand) BUT the engine had been denounced many time.

Finally bit the bullet, spent the extra 1L and bought the diesel. Calculations at the time indicated that I'll be at a slight loss, and of course sometimes the diesel clatter annoys at high (for diesel) rpms. Now with the recent petrol hike, I'm more or less even, and going forward with every $ more on crude prices I'll be saving a little bit.

I sincerely hope that CNG becomes a standard fuel option and is more widely available - that will help many people opt for it instead of diesel.

[srikanthns]

Originally Posted by aniketi

Just one question to all. I know it hurts when you fill the petrol with increased rates. When prices of everything is increasing, petrol is also going to increase. But this pain is due to fact that Diesel is not increasing? What if diesel has also gone up with Petrol? Your thinking would have been same or different? Just a thought

Yes, the diesel price hike is in the air if you watch news channels. ANd people have started growling also about the disparity between diesel and Petrol. May not be long before the gap reduces to a significant value. My doubt is whether the car makers will also reduce the gap between petrol and diesel versions at that time?

[oxyzen]

Originally Posted by avisidhu

But then GTO, wouldn't that also lead to a corresponding increase in resale value of petrol vehicles as well? Since it might begin to make sense for a lot of folks to go for used petrol vehicles at such price points. At least that's what I would like to believe

I think otherwise.
Someone owning a petrol will be dying to sell of his car to get a diesel. Also in the 2nd hand market no one will be willing to put their hands on petrol vehicles looking at the hike in price. So the resale will definitely tank.

Originally Posted by SR-71

Correct me if I am wrong - What about engine life ? Isnt it true that a good diesel car would be worth its salt only till 1L Kms whereas a good petrol engine (in similar segment) would be happy to do another 50 to 60 K on the ODO. So wouldnt it make sense to buy a petrol if its long term ownership ?

Absolutely rubbish.
I have seen logan taxis with 2.5L km on their Odo. Innovas with 1.5L and happily cruising.
Only fact is diesels may require a bit more on maintenance. But considering the amount of money you save in fuel the extra cost is negligible.

[pgsagar]

Originally Posted by SR-71

Correct me if I am wrong - What about engine life ? Isnt it true that a good diesel car would be worth its salt only till 1L Kms whereas a good petrol engine (in similar segment) would be happy to do another 50 to 60 K on the ODO. So wouldnt it make sense to buy a petrol if its long term ownership ?

It's not at all an issue with modern diesels. I was using a petrol Cielo upto 2008. Liked it for its exhaust note and everything else, except for the trips I made to filling station. Just like you, I was very apprehensive about diesels and their reliability. And then in 2008, sold cielo and went for a 2000 Lancer diesel. I was more apprehensive because it had clocked 1.27 lakhs already. Three years later, it has clocked 1.9 lakh KMs and it runs absolutely like it was then. The local dealer says 2 lakh KMs is nothing for this car and that he saw two Lancer diesels which have crossed 5 lakh kms, yes repeat 5 lakh KMs, and they still run fantastic. Am I happy? Yesssss!!!!! So my advice is, close your eyes and buy a diesel. If a 2000 diesel Lancer is so reliable then imagine how reliable the 2011 diesels would be. Or, as GTO has rightly said have at least two cars--- one petrol to feel that redline surge on weekends and a mile-munching diesel for daily run.