Team-BHP - Honda India : The Way Forward

Quote:

Originally Posted by dozer (Post 3408747)

Why would people buy this car? I don't get it.

The same can be said about Innova,Fortuner both hot sellers of Toyota. Also the Audi A4 and so many cars.

It all depends on what are your needs. One person may need performance while the other may prefer comfort and would not mind sacrificing on features and power.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dozer (Post 3408747)

I personally find it shocking that people go for the new City i-Dtec.
It's got the engine of the lower segment's Amaze and is nothing compared to its competitors in terms of engine specs. It's priced much higher than the petrol version for the lower segment engine! This is shockingly overpriced!
Why would people buy this car? I don't get it.

The petrol variant however is a massive improvement in terms of features. Yeah the diesel one's got it too, but the gap in prices for a smaller engine is a big minus IMO. I'm wrong though, it sells!

It is India my friend and it is a Honda, so ANYTHING sells.

I don't find anything wrong with the Honda City i-DTEC engine. So what if it is a 100 PS engine and that doesn't mean it has to be used ONLY in the Amaze as the evince as it was launched in that car. Do by this theory why should one pay money for the cats that sorry the 1.3L MJD that is used in hatchbacks and sedans of the next class.

1) Maruti uses that engine in Swift Dzire + SX4 + Ertiga.

2) Tata uses the same in Manza other than Vista.

3) Fiat uses this engine in Linea other than Palio and Punto.

4) Toyota uses a silly 2.5L D-4D engine in the Corolla (D-segment car with 87PS) other than Innova.

In India performance is NOT the need of hour but fuel efficiency and to keep costs down so overlap and carryover is regular.

Anurag.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dozer (Post 3408747)

Another way of looking at it is that Amaze has got a 'premium' engine so both should sell and they do.

Quote:

Originally Posted by a4anurag (Post 3409094)

...
1) Maruti uses that engine in Swift Dzire + SX4 + Ertiga.

2) Tata uses the same in Manza other than Vista.

3) Fiat uses this engine in Linea other than Palio and Punto.

4) Toyota uses a silly 2.5L D-4D engine in the Corolla (D-segment car with 87PS) other than Innova.

SX4, Ertiga, Manza and Punto offers more horse power than the one below it's segment.
Agreed with Toyota too - a very poor engine spec for the segment - I don't get this either!
Honda City has the exact same engine specs and a heavier vehicle (probably) than the Amaze.
But like someone else here said - Amaze has the premium engine perhaps for it's segment.
The Asian diesels are no match for the European ones though - just compare the Vento specs to the City iDtec! I love Honda but I'd personally feel a bit ripped off by the specs.

Quote:

Originally Posted by a4anurag (Post 3409094)

Toyota uses a silly 2.5L D-4D engine in the Corolla (D-segment car with 87PS) other than Innova.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dean5545 (Post 3408780)

The same can be said about Innova,Fortuner both hot sellers of Toyota.

Both Toyota examples are incorrect. They don't share diesel engines across segments, though Etios and Corolla get engines that belong a segment below!

Etios - 1.4 L / 68 PS
Corolla - 1.4 L / 88 PS
Camry - 2.5 L / 181 PS
Innova - 2.5 L / 102 PS
Fortuner - 3.0 L / 171 PS

Quote:

Originally Posted by zenren (Post 3409356)

Both Toyota examples are incorrect. They don't share diesel engines across segments, though Etios and Corolla get engines that belong a segment below!

Etios - 1.4 L / 68 PS

Corolla - 1.4 L / 88 PS

Camry - 2.5 L / 181 PS

Innova - 2.5 L / 102 PS

Fortuner - 3.0 L / 171 PS

What I meant to say was :
There are so many people on this forum who hate the Innova because of the lousy engine power.
Many hate the Fortuner because of lack of safety features and utilarian interiors.
But both are loved by so many people on and off the forum. Because of comfort provided by the Innova and looks and toughness of the Fortuner.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dozer (Post 3409323)

Honda City has the exact same engine specs and a heavier vehicle (probably) than the Amaze. But like someone else here said - Amaze has the premium engine perhaps for it's segment. The Asian diesels are no match for the European ones though - just compare the Vento specs to the City iDtec! I love Honda but I'd personally feel a bit ripped off by the specs.

Honda City is one the most loved car in the petrol segment and with rising fuel costs the customers demanded a diesel heart for which Honda has efficiently answered without much compromise to performance so I don't think there anything wrong in it. If power is your requirement then choose the Vento or go a segment higher. I am happy to see the Honda getting a diesel heart!

Quote:

Originally Posted by zenren (Post 3409356)

Apologies for the wrong specifications given in my post.

Anurag.

Quote:

Originally Posted by a4anurag (Post 3409365)

I tend to agree with Anurag and Yes I do own the new i-DTEC Powered City. It is very clear that Honda prioritized on Fuel Efficiency and delivered on it. You cannot expect the "most fuel efficient car in the country" to deliver too much on the performance side.

And as the name states, the City driving performance in terms of 0-60kmph is very good on the i-DTEC City. The highway performance is livable but when compared with Vento, Verna it definitely is less powerful. For performance lovers, the Petrol City would be the option.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dozer (Post 3408747)

If one compares based on engine alone, Renault's K9K 1.5 runs Scala, Duster and even Fluence!! I was surprised to see that even fluence uses the same

Honda Cars India is planning on setting up a new factory at Vithalpur in Gujarat by investing Rs. 4,000 crore soon.

Once finalised, it will be the company's third factory in India, after Greater Noida and Tapukara, Rajasthan. The new factory would have an output of 1,00,000 - 1,25,000 cars per annum, and that would make Honda Cars India the second largest company in terms of production volumes in India.

Quote:

Honda is in talks to buy 150 hectares of private land in Vithalapur-Manpur area near Mehsana, one of the two government officials cited above said. A component manufacturing plant is also on the cards, according to a proposal submitted by the car maker to the state government. Mint has reviewed a copy of the investment proposal made by Honda Cars India Ltd to the Gujarat government.

“Honda is actively looking for private land in Vithalapur-Manpur area for the new factory,” said a city-based realtor in the know of the development. He too did not wish to be named.

If Honda decides to build its third car plant in Gujarat, the company will become the second-largest Japanese carmaker in India by capacity after Maruti Suzuki India Ltd.

SOURCE - http://www.livemint.com/Industry/DOJ...000-crore.html

ACI reports via an exclusive scoop that Honda is working hard on quietening it's diesel engines' noisiness for it's current and upcoming offerings.

Quote:

Honda India engineers have realised the fact and have admitted off-the-record that they had underestimated the sense of Indian consumers as far as their sense of diesel engines go and their engines have turned out to be noiser than expected by the Indian consumer.

Honda has already begun work to fix this issue by adding more sound deadening material and by changing injection timing in its 1.5-litre all-aluminium motor and hence engine noise has been seen lesser in the City sedan as compared to the Amaze and is expected to be even lesser on the upcoming Mobilio MPV and the Jazz hatchback which will come later.

Honda will also fix the engine noise issue on the Amaze sedan but this won’t happen soon. Our sources tell us that Honda’s facelifted Amaze sedan will come in sometime next year and will come with reduced engine noise.

SOURCE - AutoCar India

One has to see the overall package. If you see the city D as an overall package it is not bad. What it lacks it compensate in other areas. Resale value is a big factor also here. Who want to start from scratch in financial planning when they want to go for next car? Honda definitely give peace of mind ownership and that is what people go for it. For D-tec, one has to see whether the car satisfy the expectation that their petrol counterpart enjoyed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by vsk2009 (Post 3482308)

For D-tec, one has to see whether the car satisfy the expectation that their petrol counterpart enjoyed.

With the i-DTEC, no driver/owner will be unhappy. AA neat engine for the City. Just that it needs refinement i certain areas to be a decent performer.

Since the engine is relatively new, the further models (upgrades) will have a refined one.

Anurag.