[Maverick79]

Originally Posted by sgiitk

I think the MRTPC has served notice on automotive vendors about the non-availability/supply of spares in the open market. Tthe same old arguments about ensuring quality of service and the lot are coming out. It sounds like the Hospital insisting that the newborn baby comes to them for the rest of his life! Once you have sold me a car how I maintain it is my prerogative.

I also heard that some dealers of a major Korean manufacturer are now charging something on account of installation charges even if you just buy the parts from them.

+1 Sir,
Also, these A.S.Service centres are notorious for 'Replacing' the parts instead of 'repairing' them. And when they replace, they try to replace the whole assembly instead of repairing a small part of it, some times.This simply adds the cost of spares.
The labour costs for repairing them would be cheaper compared to the part replacement costs, in some instances. Eg. The Alternator, Starter motor, RPS, Stg column, etc.
People with lesser knowledge about such assemblies are many times taken for a ride.

[GTO]

Great thread, Abhipuri. Here's a related discussion that you might be interested in reading.

Maruti never ever fails to impress.

I've been lucky enough to be able to source whatever spares I've wanted (Tata, Mahindra, Honda, Maruti, Mercedes) over the last couple of years. The only time I had to visit the authorised dealer for a part alone, was because no one else was able to source it (a rare sensor that even Auto Hangar had to import. 3 week wait).

Hyundai & Ford spares are apparently very hard to source over the counter.

Originally Posted by dhanushs

In a way, not allowing 'counter sales' makes sure that only hands with expertise work on your car. Which is good for you and the company (lesser warranty claims).

As a car owner, I have the fullest right to decide who is worthy of working on my car. I believe this is the law in many developed markets. In the States, you can even get your oil changes done outside, during warranty period, and not suffer any loss of coverage.

[2cents]

Originally Posted by sgiitk

I think the MRTPC has served notice on automotive vendors about the non-availability/supply of spares in the open market.

Originally Posted by abhipuru16

Sir, do you have any more info regarding this.

It came in the news a few months ago. Here's the TBhp thread

[abhipuru16]

Originally Posted by GTO

Great thread, AbhipurU .
The only time I had to visit the authorised dealer for a part alone, was because no one else was able to source it (a rare sensor that even Auto Hangar had to import. 3 week wait).

Hyundai & Ford spares are apparently very hard to source over the counter.



As a car owner, I have the fullest right to decide who is worthy of working on my car. I believe this is the law in many developed markets. In the States, you can even get your oil changes done outside, during warranty period, and not suffer any loss of coverage.

Thanks for the appreciation GTO, it really means a lot to be coming from you.
By the way, what's Auto Hangar?

Originally Posted by Maverick79

And when they replace, they try to replace the whole assembly instead of repairing a small part of it, some times.This simply adds the cost of spares.

People with lesser knowledge about such assemblies are many times taken for a ride.

Spot on!!
I was amazed to see the smallest and the minutest of parts listed in the Parts Catalogue of Zen at my MGP dealer.

Just today, I bought 50 Door Trim Clips for my Zen from the same MGP dealer. The rate was Rs. 0.87/clip . And I remember how I had to pay Rs. 5/clip outside.

Even little-little parts have been given a product number and can be ordered.
I think I might as well buy a Parts Catalogue for my Zen as somewhere in this thread someone mentioned that it is available for sale by Maruti and HM. It is a very good book to help you save a lot of money on buying spares.

[St. Anger]

Originally Posted by GTO

Great thread, Abhipuri.

Maruti never ever fails to impress.

Hyundai & Ford spares are apparently very hard to source over the counter.

As a car owner, I have the fullest right to decide who is worthy of working on my car.

Great thread there abhipuru and kudos on a brilliant restoration job on your Zen. You and GTO seem to be mirroring my thoughts. Maruti & Tata truly deserve a pat on their back for this. Unfortunately,i'm suffering due to the highhandedness of the Hyundai/Ford brigade.

Hyundai customer care tell me that they wont sell me their parts/workshop manual, even when i'm willing to purchase it off them. And this is for a 2002 Santro. Ford on the other hand tells me that i have to purchase the entire High mount lamp assembly for my Figo, instead of selling me just the fused bulb

Is there any way we can put an end to such illegal practices?

Cheers

[abhipuru16]

Originally Posted by St. Anger

Ford on the other hand tells me that i have to purchase the entire High mount lamp assembly for my Figo, instead of selling me just the fused bulb

That's downright atrocious, brother.
Did you try complaining at write2md@ford.com and custmail@ford.com?

Its something similar to what I am facing right now.

Here's what I sent them on their mail a week back-

Sir/Mam
In my Fiesta, one of the tweeters in the front left side has gone bad and needs to be replaced. The problem is that when I approached NCR Ford to inquire about the price and to place an order for ONE tweeter, they told me that I will have to buy 2 tweeters!!
But, I need only one tweeter right now, so, why should I buy two?
Please clear this confusion and provide me with the exact-

1. Price
2. Product Number

for ONE tweeter.
It is absurd that I would have to buy 2 tweeters if I need only one.
Regards

Surprisingly enough, they haven't replied in all these 7 days.
And, I sent them the same mail yesterday and today, let's see what they do.

[devsoftech]

Here's my take on Essar automobiles (MGP store, Bangalore) - I headed there to get some plastic parts and a parts catalogue for my SX4. I was given step-motherly treatment (as it is not B2B and just a walkin), and they were pretending that MASS dealers are god. It actually helps to have a catalogue handy, as they will not cooperate at busy times, just hand over the parts list and make the payment. Whatever is in their inventory takes 30-60 mins to get from warehouse, else you need to wait fr 4-5 days (couriered by maruti). but the best experience is, you get cheapest 50 paise rubber gasket to 2 lakhs+ chassis over the counter. just name it and get it. since then, i'm headed off the essar for whatever small my needs be. after my ICE install, some plastic locks were not fitting snugly, there were so cheap I just replaced all of them, and my car does not rattle. thanks to over counter sales.

[devsoftech]

Originally Posted by St. Anger

Ford on the other hand tells me that i have to purchase the entire High mount lamp assembly for my Figo, instead of selling me just the fused bulb

(full) High mount assembly in SX4 is one part number, and though you can replace the bulb (its generic), technically they also will not have a part number for the bulb. So ford guys have to be right in that sense.
All lubricants, oils, Bulbs and tyres (consumables) usually do not have part numbers from manufacturers.
on the contrary even the smallest screw/nut and paint have part numbers.

Also, some part numbers come in bundles, so you will always get multiple pieces (for example tweeters). That's an OEM supply. Same holds true for MGA but because of high volume of sales, they do not resist if you end up buying lesser.

[St. Anger]

Abhipuru,
When the Service Advisor told me about the bulb, i just smiled and let things be. I found the bulb for Rs.10/- at a small shop just a few lanes away and changed it on my own. I didn't feel like writing to Ford 'coz i don't really expect a reply for such a tiny issue (from Ford's point of view). This is validated from their non-reply to your query as well.


Devsoftech,
Isn't it weird that the company has a parts number for each small nut and bolt that goes into the car, but does not do the same with a light bulb. Especially when bulbs could get replaced more frequently than nuts and bolts! Whatever the take, just don't ask me to replace the entire lamp assembly for a small bulb. That's just being callous and irresponsible towards the customer as well as the environment.

But it sure is nice of MSIL to process your order once you have the parts manual. I wonder though, if the whole B2B vs individual customer is a dealer level issue instead of it being company policy.

Just my two cents

[bullboy]

Selling MGA accessories over counters increases the popularity of Maruti as a brand.People will not like to go to SC and wait for long hours to get a small part changed and that too paying a higher amount as labor. This in my opinion will open up a fake parts market.It is impossible for a person living in remote area to drive around 100kms to get a small part for his car.
Still the key for maruti is availability of parts easily.

[devsoftech]

Originally Posted by St. Anger

Isn't it weird that the company has a parts number for each small nut and bolt that goes into the car, but does not do the same with a light bulb. Especially when bulbs could get replaced more frequently than nuts and bolts! Whatever the take, just don't ask me to replace the entire lamp assembly for a small bulb. That's just being callous and irresponsible towards the customer as well as the environment.

But it sure is nice of MSIL to process your order once you have the parts manual. I wonder though, if the whole B2B vs individual customer is a dealer level issue instead of it being company policy.

Just my two cents

It is reasonable to have an OEM for what makes up a car, but bulbs-tyres-oils - customer must have a non OEM choice. For bulbs we as consumers have choices on Osram, Philips, Lucas, Dela so on - So whom should the manufacturer pick as OEM and supply by assigning a part number - involves lot of politics and lobbying if the manufacturer promotes a brand 'X' as OEM for consumables. Same goes for oils/fluids.
For engine oil filters - there are two OEMs with two part numbers for almost every maruti - so which one do I pick ? which is better ?

So consumables are left best in the hands of consumer as long as there are standard connectors and dimensions. Now talk of some bulb that does not fit universally - that is some injustice to customer - which I doubt will happen even remotely. All vehicles are required to have standard connectors governed by SAE (SAE International)

[Mallya_2010]

Assuming a honest setup lets look at it in a different way.Dealerships and Authorized service centers are in the end business establishments.They have to make a profit ( though how much that profit should be is a matter for discussion). They have to keep staff/labour all the time on their payroll.

Now i am guessing that the main source of income is from the margins of the parts and the labour charges.These along with numbers must be factored by the respective owners in their profit calculations.And the numbers must dwindle outside of warranty/free service as many may opt for third party garages. If it becomes mandatory to sell spares OTC or in the open market , then all dealers/*** must recalculate .Hence costs may be reduced viz. labour may be laid off etc. or profit enhanced by loading the cost at some other point viz. dealer margins etc. And reputed *** may insist that you buy spares from them (at MRP) if you need an in-house service. Using an example given by another T-BHPian , the newborn may not come back to the hospital for life but hospitals do insist that medicines be purchased from the in house pharmacy.Of course one is free to choose another hospital but will that happen?
And lastly one more poser.If a part is purchased in the open market and fitted who answers for any issues that may arise later ? The service centre or the spare part shop ?

[dhanushs]

Originally Posted by GTO

As a car owner, I have the fullest right to decide who is worthy of working on my car. I believe this is the law in many developed markets. In the States, you can even get your oil changes done outside, during warranty period, and not suffer any loss of coverage.

Very True, and that should be the way. However, from what I have seen, most of the average (A-to-B) car user, almost always is penny-wise pound foolish.

Freedom of changing parts from anywhere, and he will take it to the cheapest place (which almost always means the most un-reliable place) in town.

From my experience, I have encountered a roadside mech, who recently gained popularity for being VFM. And, I decided to try him out for a water in fuel issue that I had. He removed my fuel filter, and guess what??.. He tried to blow compressed air inside it, to clear off impurities!! The filtering element would have been destroyed.. . And, he says, this method was very effective. For all the cars he has done this, and next time when they come, there aint no impurities in the Filter. (Obviously, as there is no filtering element, all impurities are inside the engine)

Now, he charges just 150bucks to remove and reinstall the fuel tank. Even if he had genuine parts, would you give your car for his expertise to deal with?. Well, enthusiasts might not, but then, from what I see, many average users give.. just because he is cheap.

What I meant is, some companies do not just give out parts, but they make sure there is a labour sheet attached to it, which means, the part has been changed from the Authorized place. This makes sure the work done on the car is right, and not some juggad work from roadside mech.

This is certainly very much frustrating for enthusiasts, serious car owners. http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...ml#post2339033. But, considering the mass population using cheap alternatives to repair the car, this might help, atleast during the warranty period.

[libranof1987]

I'm not sure of this so will ask - amongst Toyota, Hyundai, Honda etc., how many have ALL the spares required in ALL their vehicles (except the CBU) ones manufactured in India? Is it the same with Maruti?

If any of these manufacturers still have parts imported from abroad (which I have a feeling is the case), there could be issues with patenting, copyright or similar.

Providing spares OTC would make spurious spares an easier reality.

And as Mallya rightly pointerd out, if someone purchases genuine parts from outside and gets them fitted from a really shoddy mechanic which in turn makes the whole job a whole mess, who would be responsible? The company would wash their hands off saying the mechanic messed up.

Although I feel parts should be available OTC, there should be strict regulations to govern their sale and use. I think the manufacturers who don't provide spares OTC are just playing it extremely safe (and earning quick bucks in the process).

[anjan_c2007]

Among others (Maruti is on top), Mahindra and Mahindra and Tata Motors too have ample amount of spares available with their authorised spare dealers.Thats quite good with DIY guys like me.Imagine having to replace either a simple fuel filter or an air filter or wiper blade or something as rudimentary and for this small job, handing over your four wheeler to the authorised sales and service people is silly.
Even the older generation cars from all nearly nationalities had all the spares available everywhere, be it genuine ones or the cheaper alternatives. Hence, we still find old Dodge Kingsway or Hillman Minx spares with old time spare dealers sometimes. Its very rare to have such spares come by today, because most dealers have sold these spares in bulk or have stacked them in some forlorn godown like places, as these are no longer in great demand. But my point is that in the earlier days Morris, Austin,Pontiac, Chevrolet, Ford, Dodge,Plymouth, Desoto and many other make cars had their spares available almost with most spare part dealers.
The times have changed.The car makers have realised that selling a car earns them wealth. They have learnt that by selling a car, they have sowed the right seed to generate wealth. The hapless customer shall cometh back, as he has nowhere else to go. The plant when grown, shall bear fruits (of wealth and more and more wealth) for the dealers and the company. Service and repairs generate the maximum wealth ! And if its an accident repair, its gold.
So thats a big racket the big companies are running and are taking their customers alongwith, willingly or unwillingly for a ride. There is no check on their monopolistic attitude.
Except Maruti no other company (not even Mahindra and Tata) provides their Workshop Manuals on sale to customers and others interested.They fear that their LOYAL dealers will lose everything they earn. Other smaller workshops (not the crap ones but better rated ones) will overwhelm the monopolistic, hidebound and money making dealers.
Not all dealers are like that, but thats the way things are ! Touchwood! My M&M dealer is a class apart but we can count such dealers adapting comparatively fair practices on our fingertips.They form a small minority.