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Old 24th April 2018, 14:08   #676
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Default re: Building a hybrid project car?

I would be lying if I were to say a project of this sorts has never crossed my mind. In fact someday I wish to do something very similar. But from whatever little experience I have from fiddling about and my employment, I know this will be a really painful, time consuming and financially challenging build. Not going to even mention the hordes of technical challenges one might face. But above all of that, I understand why you want to do this.

First things first, you have to chalk out what exactly you want from the project, in fine detail. Then you can start thinking about components, how to source them and finally integrating them to the entire system.

Quote:
Originally Posted by blackwasp View Post
Now, since your car is a RWD, why not consider attaching the motor to the prop-shaft so it supports the engine and you don't have to deal with complex ways to attach it to the front wheels? e.g. you would have to consider the fact that front wheel are used for direction control of the car as well. Something on the lines of an electric assist bike? You can pedal most of the times, but use the help of the motor while climbing flyovers etc.
As blackwasp was mentioning, this is perhaps the easiest way to integrate an electric drive to the powertrain.

But the more pressing questions would be what capacity is your battery pack, where your planning to mount it, the control system and algorithms (clearly you'll need a way to talk to your ICE as well, for a seamless drive).

Regards,
Arvind
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Old 27th April 2018, 15:00   #677
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Default Re: Building a hybrid project car?

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Originally Posted by blackwasp View Post
Wow. Great idea and best of luck for it. Long ago, when we had the Punto 1.2, I was contemplating on the same lines as you are planning to do. Back then, I had come across news of a $3000 kit which made your existing car a plug in hybrid (link). The premises was that a front wheel drive car has its rear wheels free. One can easily (ok, with considerable effort) attach a power source (electric motors). With a small battery pack in the boot, it would be possible to give a range of 25-50 km just on electricity. I thought, why not use the engine as well as the motor to give better power to the car?

However, then we upgraded to the Abarth, so the project went on a back burner. However some of the problems I came across in my research -
1. Only engine or only electric is ok, but how to control both of them in tandem?
2. Braking - generally the re-gen braking can be used for recharging the batteries, but will need some algorithm to decide when to use re-gen and stock brakes.
3. Additional weight could change the handling characteristics.

Now, since your car is a RWD, why not consider attaching the motor to the prop-shaft so it supports the engine and you don't have to deal with complex ways to attach it to the front wheels? e.g. you would have to consider the fact that front wheel are used for direction control of the car as well. Something on the lines of an electric assist bike? You can pedal most of the times, but use the help of the motor while climbing flyovers etc.

Or better yet consider a setup like the diesel-electric locos. The main power units will be electric motors instead of the regular engine, connected via the gearbox to the rear wheels, but have a small onboard engine to replenish the small batteries which would be tuned to run at its peak efficiency.
Though a single electric motor-generator connected to the rear differential would be lighter than one on each front wheel, I thought it'd be better to have the front wheels get the electric power as there's considerable weight transfer to the front of the car during normal braking situations - the higher the speed from which you brake, the more the weight shifts to the front axle, so the efficiency of energy recovery would be considerably higher. Also, as I want the car to be fun to drive on a track, it'd have the advantage that fwd cars have over rwd while coming out of corners, that being the torque on the front wheels would prevent the car from oversteering on acceleration. The rwd characteristics due to the engine would come in handy while entering a corner, as the lack of understeer under power would help the car follow more aggressive racing lines. Then again, this idea is merely on paper right now and detailed technical information on the NE line is hard to come by online, at least (eg. weight distribution, suspension geometries, drawings of individual components and their sub-assemblies etc.), so this idea's execution and feasibility will depend on a plethora of factors.
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Old 12th November 2018, 16:02   #678
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Default Alternator upgrade for 118 NE

With the installation of electric fans for radiator and higher wattage headlamp bulbs the demand for current went up. And the stock SA15 alternator rated for 40A was not able to take it any more in bumper to bumper traffic in the evening hours. The search began and landed at an I10 alternator for a fair deal. However it appeared like I had to prepare a new bracket to align the pulley position. After doing a few iterations with various geometry of brackets I still didn't gain the confidence over my bracket design. So I had given up and taken some rest from this project.
After a break, again I started hunting for the perfect alternator. But this time took my alternator bracket and some rough measurements from the vehicle. Finally picked up this Lucas TVS SIA130 12V 90A alternator. Commonly used in Indica / Indigo CRail BS4 engines. The machine appeared good and the seller (an alternator, starter motor repairing guy) just checked the machine at his test rig. I took the plunge and came home with the alternator, feeling lighter by 4200₹.
Got the pulley changed at another ₹150. Had to remove about 4mm of meat from the existing alternator bracket. As the lower bracket of alternator is wider than the mounting bracket a small spacer (20mm long) had to be machined to accommodate the space at the rear side. And finally got a new slotted bracket (for Rs120/-) for belt tension setting due to orientation change. With all mechanically set, time to address the electricals.

The connecting ring terminal was replaced with a 8mm one from 6mm. Crimped and soldered the new terminal. Next task was to identify the WL terminal and excitation pins. Unfortunately I had no info on the electrical side. Decided to dare and start the engine. Hooked up the multimeter and was happy to see more than 13V at idle. Revved the engine up and the voltage read till 14.6. Turned on all electrical loads. Still the voltage was 12.5V at idle. Had a wide smile and packed up for the day.

Took the car to an auto electrician in my neighborhood to identify the WL pin. He monkeyed around for some 5 mins and replied that the regulator needs replacement. My face turned pale and asked him how much it was going cost. He quoted Rs 1350/-. Luckily he advised me to reach out at the same place where I bought the machine so that the regulator might get replaced for free. Came home, but didn't rest there. Just to confirm if my meter lamp or wires were at fault, I tried to connect the warning lamp wire from the meter to body ground. The light didn't come up. Without giving up, cleaned up the terminals and tried again. The light came up. Man, my face turned red at the reply from the electrician. Googled for pin diagram for Indica BS4 alternator with TML part number and got the details and identified the WL pin. With this I cleaned up the wiring and concluded the alternator upgrade project.
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Last edited by ilangop : 12th November 2018 at 16:09. Reason: Spell check
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Old 15th December 2018, 09:49   #679
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Default Re: The Premier 118 NE thread

The original Pfeda rear bumper on my vehicle has cracked and needs replacement. Can anyone guide me on where should these be available?

Used bumpers would be OK. I would like to change both front and rear to the metal ones that were introduced in later models.
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Old 9th January 2019, 16:42   #680
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Default Re: The Premier 118 NE thread

Started the 118 after ~6 years. Now then, it does start but does run well as engine is not happy revving. Need to replace the carb, & brake pads which are jammed.

As spares for the current carb are not available the mechie suggests we replace it with a Maruthi 800 carb and the 118 carb's jets, or is there better way/carb that ought to be used?

Can anyone suggest where if/where I can get the following:
1) replacement Carb ( is NOV '96 model) which one would the most optimal to use?
2) break shoes
3) door rubber seals

Any help will be great. The plan is to get it running get the FC done.
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Old 11th January 2019, 12:10   #681
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Default Re: The Premier 118 NE thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by gendarmee View Post
As spares for the current carb are not available the mechie suggests we replace it with a Maruthi 800 carb and the 118 carb's jets, or is there better way/carb that ought to be used?

Can anyone suggest where if/where I can get the following:
1) replacement Carb ( is NOV '96 model) which one would the most optimal to use?
2) break shoes
3) door rubber seals

Any help will be great. The plan is to get it running get the FC done.
Hello Gendarmee

You can ask for Keyster replacement kit for the Hitachi DCG-306 carburetor which was OE until i believe 93/94. Did you check with Shetty Motors (T 022-23821390)?
You can also find kits over the Internet http://www.chicagocarburetor.com/car...searchtype=oem

I would suggest to try to revive the Hitachi as it is anyday better then Mikuni. I have a spare Mikuni which i used for some 4-5 years untill i found a brand new Hitachi again.
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Old 11th January 2019, 20:11   #682
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Default Re: The Premier 118 NE thread

Hello Mr. Vaidya,

Thank you for the prompt reply.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KkVaidya View Post
Did you check with Shetty Motors (T 022-23821390)
Called them after seeing the number here. They confirmed that none of the 3 spares are currently available.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KkVaidya View Post
I would suggest to try to revive the Hitachi as it is any day better then Mikuni. I have a spare Mikuni which i used for some 4-5 years until i found a brand new Hitachi again.
The inverse sounds like a good idea. I'll get the the car running & FC done. Replace the carb once spares/suitable replacement is found. Also, it needs to be driven 3 Kms to change the parking spot ASAP.
At present we found gaskets/seals for the carb replaced the diaphragm. However, lever which is actuated by the diaphragm is not functioning correctly. A floored throttle marginally moves this lever, effectively reducing the petrol spray. The rubbers on the bits with vacuum advance and AC vacuum line have developed leaks. It idles brilliantly through.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KkVaidya View Post
You can also find kits over the Internet http://www.chicagocarburetor.com/car...searchtype=oem
Can either the Honda or Subaru one be ordered? I can have a friend carry it down next month.
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Old 12th January 2019, 15:22   #683
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Default Re: The Premier 118 NE thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by gendarmee View Post

Can either the Honda or Subaru one be ordered? I can have a friend carry it down next month.
Yes the Hitachi DCG-306 was used in different engines. Just make sure it is the DCG306. The DCH306 is different as it had automatic choke. 118NE uses the DCG306 which has a manual choke.
Getting parts from USA is helpful. My relatives always carry parts brought by me and shipped to their address in USA
Pl. also check with Tushar Auto (079-25624054) for the spares.
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Old 15th January 2019, 16:46   #684
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Default Re: The Premier 118 NE thread

Was able drive it for the 3 kms to the new parking spot. Needed a good run up for even a marginal slope.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KkVaidya View Post
Pl. also check with Tushar Auto (079-25624054) for the spares.
Tried, over two days. No answer on the phone.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KkVaidya View Post
118NE uses the DCG306 which has a manual choke. Getting parts from USA is helpful. My relatives always carry parts brought by me and shipped to their address in USA
chicagocarburetor is apparently closed for a few weeks. However, I was able to find a FBA offer for 15532B on Amazon. Ordered the same, and, as a safe measure, another one from eBay. Should have them by end of month. Making relatives carry parts (weird stuff from their PoV) for the first time.
Will decide about the mikuni if these parts do not improve the idling/run.
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Old 23rd January 2019, 14:19   #685
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Default Re: The Premier 118 NE thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by gendarmee View Post
Started the 118 after ~6 years. Now then, it does start but does run well as engine is not happy revving. Need to replace the carb, & brake pads which are jammed.
I was just going through the threads when i chanced upon this post by our dear Behram Dhabhar. I don't know how to link a post

"Today morning, I start the car and it starts with a single crank without any fuss. However, when I accelerate, it switches off. Yet, its starts at a single crank. The first few minutes today morning was horrible. It was very difficult to get it moving. Had to start the car 2-3 times and accelerate real hard to warm it up. Once I got it moving, for about 2-3 kms, it was very sluggish. After which, slowly it started running fine. Any inputs on why this is happening?

Dear Karthik - the carburettor has 5 different circuits which come into operation as required. In your case, the transition from idling to main seems to be blocked. Also, if the venturis are clogged (you will be amazed at the amount of dust which will come out), this thing will happen. Remove the carburettor, dismantle the throttle plate and thoroughly get it cleaned from a person who understands what he is doing and wants to work properly. This tribe is getting rare so be careful. Clean all the small cross holes in the throttle plate first with brake oil, then with petrol and finally with a carburettor cleaning spray, put all new packings including between the throttle plate and the main body, replace both venturis (use Esteem / Zen venturis only) and then see the difference. There are many things which a Mikuni carburettor can teach you, so look for the learning experience.

Best regards,

Behram Dhabhar"
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Old 25th February 2019, 00:13   #686
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Default 118 NE Fuel filter relocation

Finally stole some time to accomplish a long pending task of replacing and relocating the fuel filter. Owing to the difficulty in accessing the fuel filter in the 118NE I had postponed a fuel filter replacement for 10 years and 35k KMs.
The replacement filter used is of Maruti van. Also used 1meter of fuel hose and some new hose clamps. Will have to devise a clamp for the filter over the next weekend. Total cost, ₹ 60 for the filter, ₹80 for the hose. The hose clamps were already available with me from some previous purchases.
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Old 25th February 2019, 09:36   #687
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Default Re: The Premier 118 NE thread

I recently got these books from the owner of a erstwhile Premier authorized service centre. I will plan to get these books scanned and share the copies to whoever needs.
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Old 25th February 2019, 10:03   #688
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Default Re: The Premier 118 NE thread

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I recently got these books from the owner of a erstwhile Premier authorized service centre. I will plan to get these books scanned and share the copies to whoever needs.
Hi Arun,
That would be a great help to the Fiat community. Please put me in the queue for a scanned copy of these manuals. Have you got access the Padmini manuals too?

Last edited by ilangop : 25th February 2019 at 10:04.
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Old 25th March 2019, 09:08   #689
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Default Weird timing issue in my 118 NE

Hi all,
Yesterday I was spending some time trying to set the point and the timing as I felt that the idling was little rough and very mild engine shuddering. Also was playing around with the air screw of the carburetor using the vacuum gauge. I was tuning the air screw for maximum vacuum. Disconnected the vacuum supply to distributor and plugged in the vacuum gauge at the carburetor vacuum port for the distributor. After I was convinced with the air screw setting I removed the gauge and connected the hose to distributor. All of a sudden the engine was again idling rough and shuddering.
But once the vacuum hose is disconnected the engine is steady again. I check the vacuum hose and diaphragm for any leaks. I sucked out air through my mouth, both the hose and the diaphragm seem to hold the vacuum for a while. I am little clueless here. Is this time to hunt for a new distributor? Experts please advice.

Regards,
Ilango
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Old 3rd September 2019, 21:48   #690
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Default Re: The Premier 118 NE thread

Found an old picture of my dad's Premier 118 NE. According to him, this picture was snapped during a Bombay-Poona road trip way back in 1990
This 118 NE was the first car that he bought with his own money. It was bought used from a dealer in Bandra. Although, dad recollects some fond memories with the car, he never fails to say how crappy it was The Ac used pack up often and the quality of metal was pathetic. However, it had a good gearbox are his very words !
The car was sold in 1993 and replaced by a Brand New Maruti 800 DX which we had in the family until 2002.
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