[docaxe]

Originally Posted by supremeBaleno

Indeed it is not perfect. But it sure seems to be the best of the available options overall, as per the target market segment.

The point you are missing is, what you so easily dismissed as 'the herd' is a group of knowledgeable customers, who analysed different choices and came to a decision. Just because their choice does not agree with yours or because they chose not to buy a Hyundai like you would, does not make them a herd. While we might pride ourselves on being informed, let us not assume that others are not doing their home-work too or worse, not capable of doing it.

Ditto...I still find swift zdi the best amongst all the diesel hatches ..I find Hyundai models too fragile and the lack the sturdy drive..I think my wait for the swift is justified at least amongst the HERD

[deetjohn]

The extended warranty has also gone up. I am told it has been increased for all Maruti Diesel vehicles.

It is now 7060 for 4 Years & 80K KM and 3620 for the 3rd year & 60K KM. IIRC, it used to be 4995 for 4Y 80K.

[anachronix]

Originally Posted by supremeBaleno

Different parts to this. I would not pay 8L for a diesel-hatch, but people here look at the 25Rs fuel-price differential and just plump for diesel. Many 1st time car buyers in my company have blindly gone for diesel cars, though they have no data to substantiate their usage and most probably wont use it enough to break even.

To add to that, they go for a Maruti to be on the safer side and well if that doesnt work then they go to a Hyundai. Thats what I have usually seen!

Another thing is the tax structure. What you pay 8L for in Blore would be ~7.5L in TN and even lesser in KL.

It should be close to 7.8L in TN! Thats a lot of money for a hatch from MSIL where they enjoy a good amount of localisation compared to the other manufacturers except Tata. My friend recently bought a Manza with ABS in MJD avatar for 7.65 OTR! Talk about VFM here

Finally VFM is based on not just price, but based on available choices and how they stack up. So given the huge demand, people must be finding the Swift VFM compared to other choices. How else to explain the 1lakh booking for what we think is overpriced ?

VFM is ALWAYS based on price and what a product offers for that price compared to its competitor's products. There is no 2 ways about VFM. The New Swift is riding on the MSIL reputation and also the cult that follows Swift only in India. The New Swift is a much better product than the old one, however there are lot of weak areas which are even more concerning and critical.

On the pricing, I am sure you will find a lot of people who think the ZDi is overpriced here in Teambhp. The Swift crossed the 1 Lakh booking mark even before the prices were announced.

Now this is something people need to make a hue & cry about, instead of something like a price-hike which any company is free to do and all companies (not just car mfrs) do whenever the setting is right. And such things are where extra value is provided by tbhp to the layman. A layman would assume the brakes are OK or maybe he is doing something wrong, but our review says they brakes in L & V versions are pathetic and dangerous. So, I would think maybe we need to focus on getting MSIL to fix this, which could cost lives, than worry about a 10K hike.

Sadly, people dont really care

[supremeBaleno]

Originally Posted by deetjohn

The extended warranty has also gone up.

The extended warranty is a big dealer hoax to make extra money and I never go for it for 2 reasons. One, this is not a Tata where things could go wrong and you need the shield of warranty to get free replacement. Second, the devil is in the details - while selling the warranty the dealer will push you to go for it saying, "Sir, everything is covered, so if something goes wrong you are safe. All for just a few thousands". But if something actually goes wrong, they would say,"Saar that is not covered". On the second point, I think TASS is better than MASS because from what I read on the forum, the TASS honours the normal and extended warranty without rejecting valid claims, unlike MASS.

Originally Posted by anachronix

To add to that, they go for a Maruti to be on the safer side and well if that doesnt work then they go to a Hyundai. Thats what I have usually seen!

In our orgn, they all went for Puntos - after looking at Brio/Swift/Ritz. Hyundai wasn't even an option.

Originally Posted by anachronix

The New Swift is riding on the MSIL reputation and also the cult that follows Swift only in India. The New Swift is a much better product than the old one, however there are lot of weak areas which are even more concerning and critical.

The cult part, yes. But if the MSIL reputation is a reason, why isnt the Ritz/A_Star/Estilo/SX4 doing similar numbers. A good product (overall) will sell and the demand would be more if the alternatives don't come close in overall appeal.

The new Swift is indeed good and in the Z versions, I do not see any critical issues (braking in L/V versions is a critical issue). Yeah, someone would say boot, but if that is so important, go for a sedan. Among the cars we own, the one I most hate to drive is the SwiftZxi-1.3P. The boot is OK with me, the seating is OK, there are no rattles, the handling is good. But the old Esteem engine just sucks on normal drivability - I don't want to be changing gears all the time. For the rare revv-through-each-gear type of driving it is fun, but then how many times do we get roads to drive like that. The later versions (K12 and DDiS) were not only more FTD, but also more FE. And with the latest version, it has become more appealing with the handling also taken care of - beating the Punto too on that front. The new looks are IMO bad - too i20-ish - prefer the old looks.

Regarding pricing, it would be dictated by the market demand. If demand drops and people cancel bookings, MSIL would have to drop prices. Every manufacturer does this. Honda sold at a premium for years till they had buyers. Then they dropped prices on City & Jazz when they found no takers. Enabled you to pick one up at a bargain, right ?

[Driving_Nomad]

IMO, it is high time that FIAT and FORD up their market share in the B and B+ segment. They are definitely selling cars which are more VFM than the Marutis.
I also think that this price hike is not going to deter staunch customers of Maruti (people who can wait for 6 and odd months to get one delivered) from buying one!

[CrAzY dRiVeR]

Originally Posted by deetjohn

The extended warranty has also gone up. I am told it has been increased for all Maruti Diesel vehicles.

It is now 7060 for 4 Years & 80K KM and 3620 for the 3rd year & 60K KM. IIRC, it used to be 4995 for 4Y 80K.

It was 4995.

So the increase in on-road price is near 15k? Will be interesting to see if the strategy will backfire for Maruti. My dealer informed that he hasn't received new ZDi prices yet.

@anachronix: It was just 7.06L in trivandrum, and 7.45L in Chennai. Bangalore OTR prices are atrocious!

[A350XWB]

After going through all the pages in the thread, I think this discussion has gone way off the topic.
In my opinion, a company can raise the price of a car and it's their own decision. They can charge a premium on the hot selling models until there are takers for the same. Nothing wrong in doing so and the buyer cannot crib until he is ready to look at alternatives. If you want to buy a Swift, take it at the price decided by Maruti or look at other options.
Second thing I noticed in the posts is that some people are furiously defending the Swift, even by giving lame reasons. If you own a FIAT, Hyundai, Tata, Ford etc, you can comment on how satisfied you are, with their cars. Let the owners speak for themselves. For the record, I'm a satisfied customer who owns a Santro and a Figo. No problems with the cars or the A.S.S for me. I've seen a general trend where people who have some technical knowledge (people who know their cars) are the ones who seriously look at alternatives and others look at Maruti. (It's not a bad thing at all, because I salute the trust the company could instill in the minds of people). I know atleast two people who owns a Swift and till recently, didn't know how to open the hood (and I'm not talking about laymen over here). But there is a downside for this. I've usually seen that the expectation of a Maruti owner is much lower than people owning other brands.
When I was looking for a diesel hatch, I went for the Figo for the following reasons.
Better driveability
Better safety equipment for the price
Better rear seat
Better boot space
Better handling and ride
And believe it or not, better build with fewer rattles.
I can only laugh at comments like "Figo, full of niggles"

[wickedchauhan]

Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR

Bangalore OTR prices are atrocious!

Well you see Bangaloreans pay highest fuel prices too and with good reason, you see we have

- better traffic than any other city, ditto for the wide roads
- great infrastructure generously provided by the govt.
- govt. is paying through its nose to remove the green cover surrounding the city (remove green cover = more development)
- well behaved autowallhas (govt. spends considerable money on training these guys which in turns helps in making the city people friendly)
- so on and so forth

So net-net, the taxes are justified, no?

[diesel_power]

Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR

It was 4995.

So the increase in on-road price is near 15k? Will be interesting to see if the strategy will backfire for Maruti. My dealer informed that he hasn't received new ZDi prices yet.

@anachronix: It was just 7.06L in trivandrum, and 7.45L in Chennai. Bangalore OTR prices are atrocious!

I haven't gone in for the extended warranty (never felt its necessity).

The cost increase had affected many, but I would like to remind you guys, when Maruti had launched the Swift, they had clearly mentioned that the prices were "INTRODUCTORY". Now it just seems they have a HIT product and so, the introductory offer is over .

I would still say that the prices are very much on the higher side. But the car is awesome (except for the brakes on L and V variants).

Its a topic to think about, we assume that, if its a Maruti, it has to be cheap (read:less expensive), as compared to the competitors. But why so? They have good range of products, the best A.S.S network in the country. When it comes to the niggling issues, even the competitors have them.

I am not taking sides, or supporting Maruti, just want to clear the doubt in my mind.

[sunnyworld]

Originally Posted by diesel_power

I haven't gone in for the extended warranty (never felt its necessity).

The cost increase had affected many, but I would like to remind you guys, when Maruti had launched the Swift, they had clearly mentioned that the prices were "INTRODUCTORY". Now it just seems they have a HIT product and so, the introductory offer is over .

I would still say that the prices are very much on the higher side. But the car is awesome (except for the brakes on L and V variants).

Its a topic to think about, we assume that, if its a Maruti, it has to be cheap (read:less expensive), as compared to the competitors. But why so? They have good range of products, the best A.S.S network in the country. When it comes to the niggling issues, even the competitors have them.

I am not taking sides, or supporting Maruti, just want to clear the doubt in my mind.

Majority of people will buy L[DX]I or V[DX]I models and to provide poor brakes on them is ridiculous on so many levels. To make matters worse, Maruti even withdrew the V[DX]I Abs option.

At Bangalore prices, Figo top end makes so much more sense than a VDI.

[supremeBaleno]

Originally Posted by A350XWB

Second thing I noticed in the posts is that some people are furiously defending the Swift, even by giving lame reasons.

This is not a thread about Swift as a car. It is about price hike for Swift and other models. So no need to defend or batter any car. While we as consumers would like the product to be the best and price the cheapest, that is not usually the case in reality. All manufacturers are free to price their product and we are free to buy it or not.

Originally Posted by A350XWB

I've seen a general trend where people who have some technical knowledge (people who know their cars) are the ones who seriously look at alternatives and others look at Maruti. I know atleast two people who owns a Swift and till recently, didn't know how to open the hood

Whoa !! Those are some serious generalisations you are making up. I know 2 guys (one owns a Getz and the other i10) who did not know where the bonnet-release was. Does that make them morons ? Not everyone is bothered about cars the way we are. For them it is just something that gets them from A to B in comfort. For any issues, they know that they can depend on nuts like us for help.

OT : I see you listed a series of reasons for buying Figo-D, top of which was better driveability. Compared to what ? I drove a Figo-D couple weeks ago which belonged to Ford DSFL programme and the drive was uninspiring. Maybe not as bad as the Polo-D, but almost there. So to each his own.

[ethanhunt123]

Originally Posted by A350XWB

I can only laugh at comments like "Figo, full of niggles"

Laugh while some other other Figo owners are crying

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...nshifting.html

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/street...e-problem.html



http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/test-d...ownership.html

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...ow-speeds.html

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/techni...problem-2.html

Not saying all Figo's are problematic, but quite a few on the forum seem to have niggles.

[anachronix]

Originally Posted by supremeBaleno

The cult part, yes. But if the MSIL reputation is a reason, why isnt the Ritz/A_Star/Estilo/SX4 doing similar numbers. A good product (overall) will sell and the demand would be more if the alternatives don't come close in overall appeal.

Well, do we really have to call them doing bad!? They are doing bad comparing them to the other products from MSIL portfolio. Otherwise, they are not market duds by anyway

The new Swift is indeed good and in the Z versions, I do not see any critical issues (braking in L/V versions is a critical issue). Yeah, someone would say boot, but if that is so important, go for a sedan. Among the cars we own, the one I most hate to drive is the SwiftZxi-1.3P. The boot is OK with me, the seating is OK, there are no rattles, the handling is good. But the old Esteem engine just sucks on normal drivability - I don't want to be changing gears all the time. For the rare revv-through-each-gear type of driving it is fun, but then how many times do we get roads to drive like that. The later versions (K12 and DDiS) were not only more FTD, but also more FE. And with the latest version, it has become more appealing with the handling also taken care of - beating the Punto too on that front. The new looks are IMO bad - too i20-ish - prefer the old looks.

Missed the smiling rear!? I liked the front and side profiling a lot!

Regarding pricing, it would be dictated by the market demand. If demand drops and people cancel bookings, MSIL would have to drop prices. Every manufacturer does this. Honda sold at a premium for years till they had buyers. Then they dropped prices on City & Jazz when they found no takers. Enabled you to pick one up at a bargain, right ?

Oh yeah, thats true! That was one heck of a bargain, I agree!

As long as there is demand for a product, the seller can demand a premium for his product. But, when MSIL was going through the strike and other ordeals for the past couple of months there were lot of people who were ready to wait having strong trust on the company. They feel cheated and the guy who is going to wait for another 6months or so will carry a lot of fear about the next price hike on the Swift in the name of input costs

[shashank.nk]

Back to topic, my dealer told me that the ZDI in blore is up from 7.8l to 7.9l, so effectively meaning the 10k hike is an on-road hike.

But few people who booked the Swift were saying its a ex-showroom hike. Can anyone confirm ?

[CrAzY dRiVeR]

Originally Posted by A350XWB

I've seen a general trend where people who have some technical knowledge (people who know their cars) are the ones who seriously look at alternatives and others look at Maruti.

And this applies to the members of this forum?

Swift is as much a popular car here, as it is with outside the forum - with people 'who cannot open the bonnet'. And thats because - as GTO stated in his review - Its one of the rare mass market cars that is actually fun to drive!

Originally Posted by A350XWB

When I was looking for a diesel hatch, I went for the Figo for the following reasons.
Better driveability
Better safety equipment for the price
Better rear seat
Better boot space
Better handling and ride
And believe it or not, better build with fewer rattles.
I can only laugh at comments like "Figo, full of niggles"

Good to know the car suits your requirements!

It would be mature if you understand others have requirements too, that may not match with yours. People (even layman or those 'who cannot open the bonnet') have requirements when they upgrade their cars.

To some, it may be better driveability - to others better fun.
To some better safety equipment - to others a tension free ownership experience.
To some better rear seat - to others better front seats.
To some it may even be a free umbrella. (No offence Sir Yeti. )

Its another general trend in this forum to think of ourselves as 'technical' people and to think of the masses as 'herd mentality'.

Originally Posted by sunnyworld

At Bangalore prices, Figo top end makes so much more sense than a VDI.

I really dont understand this logic!

At Bangalore OTR prices - Figo is a 7L car. Swift is an 8L car, i20 is a 9L car. Difference is still the same as in other states! How does it make Figo/ any other car more VFM than the other?