[agbenny]

Originally Posted by fiat_tarun

Ford would be super glad if everyone predicted this kind of pricing !

This is a sub 4m vehicle at the end of the day and is not a luxury car to command such premium pricing. Anything above 10L won't work. The top end has to be under 10L.

Like most people have predicted, it should be around the 7-10 L range.

Yes, I too wish if its around 7. But, the list of features, the whole new/unique looks for this segment, and the SUV loving India would give them confidence to price high. This is what I believe.

Also, how they priced new Fiesta can't allow me to think a lower price tag for this car.

[AlokSriva]

Originally Posted by bageherath

I have 2006 Fiesta TDCi done 1 lakh KM .... I have only changed engine and ..

If you have changed the engine within 1L kms, you are disappointing a lot of folks here, including yours truly.

Come on, I was only pulling your leg! Of course, we all know it was a typo in your post

My 1.6 ZXi Fiesta has done about 80k kms without any fuss whatsoever - that it is a petrol engine is another material fact

[swiftnfurious]

Originally Posted by agbenny

Anyone made Ecosport price guess?
My guess is between 10L-13L.

Originally Posted by fiat_tarun

Ford would be super glad if everyone predicted this kind of pricing !

This is a sub 4m vehicle at the end of the day and is not a luxury car to command such premium pricing. Anything above 10L won't work. The top end has to be under 10L.

Like most people have predicted, it should be around the 7-10 L range.

I guess the above guesstimate was an OTR. To be frank, I expect a range of 7-10L ex showroom price. For a change, I wanna pitch it higher so, if they actually manage to give it cheaper, I will be extremely delighted.

[fiat_tarun]

Originally Posted by agbenny

Yes, I too wish if its around 7. But, the list of features, the whole new/unique looks for this segment, and the SUV loving India would give them confidence to price high. This is what I believe.

Also, how they priced new Fiesta can't allow me to think a lower price tag for this car.

Actually Ford themselves admit to have got the pricing completely wrong with the New Fiesta and are leaving no stone unturned with the Ecosport. This is by far Ford's biggest launch for India.

The biggest difference is the localisation levels between the Ecosport and the new fiesta. They know they have to price it lower than the Duster to succeed.

Originally Posted by swiftnfurious

I guess the above guesstimate was an OTR. To be frank, I expect a range of 7-10L ex showroom price. For a change, I wanna pitch it higher so, if they actually manage to give it cheaper, I will be extremely delighted.

Even an OTR starting at 10L would be way off target. Anyway, I'm sure Ford know what they are doing and should get it right !

[ampere]

Originally Posted by agbenny

Anyone made Ecosport price guess?
My guess is between 10L-13L.

That is exactly what these 166 pages of discussions are all about !
Off course leaving the engine as another aspect !

Sorry for OT. And also sorry if it comes as rude to you.
Just did not want to leave the fun out of it.

[swiftnfurious]

Originally Posted by fiat_tarun

...Even an OTR starting at 10L would be way off target. Anyway, I'm sure Ford know what they are doing and should get it right !

For a 7-10L ex showroom, the OTR can NOT start at 10L. Since the Road Taxes are so drastically different, it's better we do NOT talk in those terms, for our own happiness. But I think the OTR in most places, for a diesel base should start at 9L max.

Frankly, I am really looking forward to the price announcement. Going by all the pointers by the Ford officials, this could be like an XUV price announcement. I seriously want this pricing to be absolutely spot on forcing some of the manufacturers to correct their prices in no time. And also the coming entrants to be priced sensibly from day 1.

We, as customers, deserve products at sensible prices, like rest of the world!!!

[urajkumar]

After repeated flip flops (booked duster, cancelled duster & now again thinking of booking it looking at the delay of ecosport) and my various posts in this thread displaying my frustration on lack of updates on the eco-sport, my curiosity got the better of me today and i drove down to the nearest ford dealer (Not mentioning the branch) for more dope.

After the interaction i believe what i heard sounds true & I am sharing it with all of you. The reason is the sales executive i met sounded quite knowledgeable & aware of many details. Also he was a very friendly guy (not mentioning his name) and we got talking for more than 45 minutes where he said many things.

Launch
1) It was initially planned to be launched by Feb (Bookings was to open by Jan end) but later postponed since they are heavily localizing and want to get the price right
2) The TN CM visit to the plan was to co-inside with the launch but might not happen together now
3) Ford TN plant does not have capacity to handle the expected huge volumes and till the Gujarat plant is functional they want to go slow on opening the bookings. They dont want to lose bookings due to long wait time.
4) They are expecting the pre-bookings to open by Feb end and deliveries to start by April only. If i am not wrong Brazil also opened pre-bookings for Ford Eco-sport before commencing deliveries of the vehicle.
5) Another important reason (I think this sounds authentic) is that they want to wait for the budget to be presented before announcing the price since it might make or break the success of eco-sport (already the step wise de-regularization of Diesel would be a shot of adrenalin to success of the ecoboost engine). Hence they want to announce it only after knowing the way forward. If Diesel hike stays, who knows they might even bring down the difference between Diesel and Petrol (literally means increasing the petrol version cost) versions.

USP
1) He says he has seen it and it looks brilliant in the flesh. Says it will sell just for the way it looks
2) Also confirms that rear space of eco-sport would be brilliant but luggage space might take a beating. He reasons that the new fiesta failure was due to poor rear space and wrong pricing which ford wants to get right this time.
3) It will get 3 engines but is almost sure that AT version will get launched later and not initially (Just like Fiesta AT was launched later)
4) Lots of inquiries on the Eco-boost engine and with recent diesel policy he says interest levels have only doubled

Pricing
1) Clearly says 3 engines would come (1 liter ecoboost, 1.5 liter petrol & 1.5 liter diesel) but eco-boost will cost more than 1.5 liter petrol since it is an imported engine. The 1.5 liter engine is locally made and cheaper. Hence in-spite of excise duty cut for ecoboost, it is the 1.5 liter petrol which would be cheaper of the 2. He says mostly the ecoboost and diesel would be priced closer to each other
2) He didn't have a price range to offer since he says Ford officials are tight lipped about it. However they are localizing heavily and waiting for the budget news before announcing the price list.

So a wait till april for me looks like a long wait but the prospect of driving a new fresh and young design is making me think again. The Duster and arrogant pricing attitude of Renault only means it will always remain my second choice.

Curiosity killed the cat? Nah it only confused me further.

[swiftnfurious]

Originally Posted by urajkumar

...1) It was initially planned to be launched by Feb (Bookings was to open by Jan end) but later postponed since they are heavily localizing and want to get the price right...

4) They are expecting the pre-bookings to open by Feb end and deliveries to start by April only...

5) Another important reason (I think this sounds authentic) is that they want to wait for the budget to be presented before announcing the price

...

PROBLEMS, PROBLEMS & PROBLEMS !

1. How long will they keep localising?? The localisation news is ON for quite sometime now & still going ON!

2. What are they localising?? The SA told you that Ecoboost is imported & 1.5L is already localised!

3. Pre-launch bookings without price announcement?? And price announcement after 1.5 months of launch??!

4. Will the Gujarat plant be operational by April 2013?! If not, why delay the deliveries till then?!

5. How much of a price difference can the budget bring in? Especially at a time they have decided to de-regulate the diesel prices!

[ampere]

Originally Posted by urajkumar

Curiosity killed the cat? Nah it only confused me further.

Thanks for the update. In fact after I heard the feb launch got stalled to post April, waiting for budget was some thing which even I had suspected.

Also the fact that eco boost and diesel would be priced similar was again something which I was kind of expecting. But the 1.5L
petrol offering took me by surprise. I thought it was the Ecoboost which was planned to be manufactured in India (Gujarat).
Looks like its not so. its a fully imported entity as per what you mention.

[urajkumar]

Originally Posted by swiftnfurious

PROBLEMS, PROBLEMS & PROBLEMS !
1. How long will they keep localising?? The localisation news is ON for quite sometime now & still going ON!
2. What are they localising?? The SA told you that Ecoboost is imported & 1.5L is already localised!
3. Pre-launch bookings without price announcement?? And price announcement after 1.5 months of launch??!
4. Will the Gujarat plant be operational by April 2013?! If not, why delay the deliveries till then?!
5. How much of a price difference can the budget bring in? Especially at a time they have decided to de-regulate the diesel prices!

Well i was skeptical too but somehow it seems believable to me after speaking to the SE. My wild guesses to your questions are
1) All manufactures continue to do this since no car is 100% localized i think (except may be the ever green Amby )
2) 1.5 liter is made here but i think many parts are imported still which is why the new fiesta pricing was a disaster. If they got volumes in Fiesta they would have increased local content but sadly we know it didnt happen
3) Well i guess they want to formalize what the dealers would anyway do. May be they dont want to lose prospective customers to Duster.
4) Gujarat plant is to be operational by 2014 only but of course a slow start would give them more time to promise deliveries. Also this plant has the engine assembly and so ecoboost could get cheaper from 2014.
5) In india never say never, the budget could always throw a spanner into anyones plan and with the heavy fuel subsidy bill it could result in additional taxes for automobiles. Hence the caution which i feel is right.

Originally Posted by ampere

Thanks for the update. In fact after I heard the feb launch got stalled to post April, waiting for budget was some thing which even I had suspected.

Also the fact that eco boost and diesel would be priced similar was again something which I was kind of expecting. But the 1.5L
petrol offering took me by surprise. I thought it was the Ecoboost which was planned to be manufactured in India (Gujarat).
Looks like its not so. its a fully imported entity as per what you mention.

I think they plan to import till the Gujarat plant is functional and hence the delay in launch so that they import as less as possible.

[agambhandari]

The Gujarat plant is not expected to be functional till the start of 2014.
This has been confirmed many a times in auto magazines.
Even if they start out with Chennai only, i think it would be difficult to transfer the manufacture of a car to a different location altogether. They wont have two plants building the same cars.
So, guess the GJ plant doesnt have much to do with the EcoSport at the moment.

Also, if they price the EcoBoost and diesel closely, the EcoBoost would be dead on launch.
Diesel is still the cheaper fuel.

[swiftnfurious]

Thanks for the details buddy!

Originally Posted by urajkumar

...Also this plant has the engine assembly and so ecoboost could get cheaper from 2014.

...I think they plan to import till the Gujarat plant is functional and hence the delay in launch so that they import as less as possible.

1. But this move just offsets all advantages they have on pricing. From what I know, when the engine is imported, there is a huge % tax.

2. Ford cannot sell the product on discounted prices (foreseeing the localisation benefits in future) as per the rules - which may NOT result in the BEST prices they can offer.

3. Ford cannot reduce the prices much after fully localising the Ecoboost engine. Yes, they can put a leash on the inflation & raw material price hikes which manufacturers do in due course of time, but the initial advantage is lost!

Well, my excitement is low, let's see what Ford has got up their sleeves!

Edit:: I seriously hope they localise Ecoboost before launch itself, contrary to all reports!

[fiat_tarun]

It does make sense for Ford to wait for the Budget before announcing pricing. The Budget for 2013-14 will be presented on Feb. 28th, so that isn't too far away.

The fact that the Ecoboost will be more expensive that the 1.5L engine was discussed sometime earlier on this thread. Actually if you think about it, that could be the only reason the 1.5L is also being offered as an option (another reason could be to offer the AT option) ! The Ecoboost is part of Ford's FOX engine family and will be manufactured at their Gujarat plant

Originally Posted by swiftnfurious

For a 7-10L ex showroom, the OTR can NOT start at 10L. Since the Road Taxes are so drastically different, it's better we do NOT talk in those terms, for our own happiness. But I think the OTR in most places, for a diesel base should start at 9L max.

Exactly what I had said, since some else had suggested the 10 - 13L pricing. An OTR of 10L would mean an ex-showroom price of ~8.7L (considering a 15% tax) which would be way too high for an entry level variant.

[condor]

THanks, @urajkumar.
My take on what the Sales person told you: most of it was just sales talk. Localization is not something that is done ad-hoc, / spur of the moment / impulsive. Either they plan it well in advance, or plan for it by giving it sufficient time. It is not possible that Ford says launch delayed by 2 months because they have now decided to increase localization.

CM's visit delaying launch ? blah !

Capacity is again something that is planned well in advance.

Originally Posted by urajkumar

Launch
1) It was initially planned to be launched by Feb (Bookings was to open by Jan end) but later postponed since they are heavily localizing and want to get the price right
2) The TN CM visit to the plan was to co-inside with the launch but might not happen together now
3) Ford TN plant does not have capacity to handle the expected huge volumes and till the Gujarat plant is functional they want to go slow on opening the bookings. They dont want to lose bookings due to long wait time.

Originally Posted by urajkumar

5) Another important reason (I think this sounds authentic) is that they want to wait for the budget to be presented before announcing the price

Most likely reason, most acceptable of what he told you

Regarding the new Fiesta

Originally Posted by urajkumar

USP: 2) .. He reasons that the new fiesta failure was due to poor rear space and wrong pricing which ford wants to get right this time.

Bang on target ! A lovely car with the trademark Ford handling, spoilt by rear seat space ( and some part of comfort). Boot was way too big. They could have pushed the rear seat back into the boot, to increase seat space/comfort, and reduced the boot space a little.

[kopakabana]

Originally Posted by condor

THanks, @urajkumar.
My take on what the Sales person told you: most of it was just sales talk.

+1. We should never rely on the sales person's words. We've heard many in the past and all of them had different things to say. All it shows is that he was well trained .

However, the announcement of price after the union budget does make sense. Who knows, it can make the Ecoboost a success in an otherwise diesel oriented market. And i think Ford will not price the ecoboost at par with diesel variant. The Pricing should be more or less as per Swiftnfurious's post sometime back. Here's the link.
http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/indian...ml#post3005323