[mail4ajo]

Hope this motivates the hatch makers to offer AT options. Every country has better AT options than us. An AT option in the Jazz will be great if the price is right.

[RavenAvi]

Originally Posted by fuel_addict

Brio diesel and now Brio AT - what's with Honda's fascination for the Brio? I would love to see these two options (diesel + AT) in the Jazz instead which is more of an all rounder. A 1.5L AT Jazz and a diesel Jazz will do wonders for Honda.

Brio has been consistently doing well, and will continue to do so. Hence Honda India's focus is more on the Brio.

On the other hand, even with the adjustment in prices and making it more affordable, the Jazz hasn't exactly picked up in sales and hasn't set the charts on fire just yet. That's why they are mum on the Jazz's future. I really hope they keep the Jazz in their portfolio - it's still one heck of an option in the premium hatch segment.

Originally Posted by arup.misra

Did you experience lack of low end torque especially in 2nd gear?

Steering is definitely lighter than even the City. You throw it around corners and she'll gladly comply all day. Great car for city B2B traffic.

I couldn't test the torque because I was driving inside the compound in which all sorts of cars were piled in, even the serviced Hondas! The moment I drove to the front of the dealership, I got a minute to stretch it's legs and that's when I touched 40 on D. There was enough pep on offer to pull the car cleanly to 40, that's what I observed. Linear, continuous, perfect acceleration.

Steering is pretty light, but weighs up slightly with speeds. That's what I like about all Hondas, specially in my City. The Brio AT is no different.

Originally Posted by CARDEEP

Hmm... drives much better than Hyundai i10, the mileage will definitely be better than i10 or A-Star despite engine size weight as Hondas have been more fuel efficient as compared to Hyundai & Maruti till date IMO.

The Brio AT should definitely be more FE-friendly than the i10 AT, IMO. And combine that with more spaciousness and a superbly peppy engine which performs well too, and we have a clear winner here.

Originally Posted by sgiitk

Looks like some are already with the dealers to get the State RTO clearance. I never know that the car has to be certified in each state.

Bang on, sir! The cars have been sent to the dealerships to get RTO-approved before the launch, and they will serve as showroom displays once the launch date nears. Possibly double up as an (early) TD car as well.

Originally Posted by rr_zen

Thanks for sharing. If this is true then looks like Honda has got its act right, this time around. I am looking at an AT for my wife for the last few years and the only options were A-Star and i-10. With the entry of the Brio, no doubt that this is what I will go in for whenever I get ready to buy it. Am sure the Brio AT is for sure a game changer in the auto hatch segment.

I suggest waiting for a little bit till the Brio AT launch and test-driving it before making a decision. You won't be disappointed, trust me. In fact, I have a strong feeling you and your better half are going to be very, very pleasantly surprised.

And yes, it is destined to be a game changer in it's segment, provided they don't bungle up the pre-determined pricing.

Originally Posted by StarScream

You know, the lack of a gear indicator in the instrument console is the thing I miss the most in my Santro AT. If the Brio had it, it was a definite buy but the fact that it doesn't, makes me lose interest. Sometimes, its the really small and insignificant stuff that matters the most.

It's not a deal breaker for me. I rarely glance at the speedo when driving my car (my full and sole focus is on the road), and the only times I glance down is to check my speeds & RPMs and to see if I am not over-speeding. And we all pretty much have a good idea about when to change gears and which gears are optimum for which speeds, so it does not bother me too much not to have a gear indicator. Why, without the gear indicator in my 2012 City, I am constantly getting 13.5 kpl inside city and 19.7 on highways!

Originally Posted by swiftnfurious

Brio has been doing well while Jazz is a proven dud! It makes sense to invest more into a better selling product which coincidentally is a mass vehicle here! I don't see the ROI justifying any investment on Jazz anymore. What they probably should do is to bring in the next gen Jazz ASAP and try and price is superbly, bring the diesel / AT options right from the beginning!

While Brio sedan is confirmed, the MPV will be based on Jazz & NOT Brio.

PS::
I am quite happy that though late, Honda has started picking the pulse of Indian market. Just wish they bring in an AT in their diesel Brio too! That would be a first in India in the segment and can give them enough advantage!

Exactly the point I was making above.

The next-gen Jazz should be priced competitively as well, now that Honda is localising it generously (about 87%) to keep down costs involved. It might get a simultaneous petrol/diesel launch, but not before 2014.

Yes the MPV is based on the Fit (Jazz) platform. That will make it 3 cars sharing the same platform - the Jazz, the MPV & the City.

A Brio Diesel AT?! Ah, if only wishes had wings!

Maybe, who knows, someday. Never say never.

[StarScream]

Originally Posted by RavenAvi

It's not a deal breaker for me. I rarely glance at the speedo when driving my car (my full and sole focus is on the road), and the only times I glance down is to check my speeds & RPMs and to see if I am not over-speeding. And we all pretty much have a good idea about when to change gears and which gears are optimum for which speeds, so it does not bother me too much not to have a gear indicator. Why, without the gear indicator in my 2012 City, I am constantly getting 13.5 kpl inside city and 19.7 on highways!

)

It's got nothing to do with speed, right gears or FE. My gripe is a lot simpler. For example, if I'm parking my Santro in my basement, which is darker than the daylight I have just come from and my eyes are still adjusting, I can't tell if I've correctly selected reverse or one of the low ratios by mistake unless I switch on the lights and glance down at the gear lever. This is true for all low-light situations. A PDNR21 display in the dash would be so much more convenient (that is what I meant and not the gear number). Automatics shouldn't be sold without one.

[joslicx]

Originally Posted by StarScream

It's got nothing to do with speed, right gears or FE. My gripe is a lot simpler. For example, if I'm parking my Santro in my basement, which is darker than the daylight I have just come from and my eyes are still adjusting, I can't tell if I've correctly selected reverse or one of the low ratios by mistake unless I switch on the lights and glance down at the gear lever. This is true for all low-light situations. A PDNR21 display in the dash would be so much more convenient (that is what I meant and not the gear number). Automatics shouldn't be sold without one.

I second this StarScream. At the time when I did TD of City AT, I really missed the gear indicator on the console (perhaps more because I had already test driven the Vento AT and it has got this feature and I find it quite useful. Sometimes for fun I just try to see how much I can rev before gears change RavenAvi it is quite useful feature in Automatics as in AT we are not totally in control of gears (perhaps thats why you dont miss it in your Pegasus as it is manual and you always know where you are). It is useful to know what gear we are in.

I hope instead of the Eco indicator Honda gives a proper gear indicator in their next iterations.

[swiftnfurious]

Originally Posted by StarScream

....For example, if I'm parking my Santro in my basement, which is darker than the daylight I have just come from and my eyes are still adjusting, I can't tell if I've correctly selected reverse or one of the low ratios by mistake unless I switch on the lights and glance down at the gear lever....

Originally Posted by joslicx

...RavenAvi it is quite useful feature in Automatics as in AT we are not totally in control of gears (perhaps thats why you dont miss it in your Pegasus as it is manual and you always know where you are). It is useful to know what gear we are in....

Wouldn't the letter on the gear console light up when you shift gears? Atleast this is how it used to be on the Civic in the middle east [apart from the lighting on the speedo]. So I expected the lighting on the letters next to the gear lever to be standard on all cars!

[StarScream]

Originally Posted by swiftnfurious

Wouldn't the letter on the gear console light up when you shift gears? Atleast this is how it used to be on the Civic in the middle east [apart from the lighting on the speedo]. So I expected the lighting on the letters next to the gear lever to be standard on all cars!

No, in the Santro AT the letters only light up if the headlights/twilight lights are on. That is what I meant when I said when I enter my basement parking even in daylight I need to switch on the headlights and look down at the lever to see my selection.

[sgiitk]

Originally Posted by mail4ajo

An AT option in the Jazz will be great if the price is right.

Around 2009/10 Honda had announced a 1.5 Jazz (i.e. City engine) which was believed to be a precursor to a Jazz AT. Then they backed out. It is possible thy reckon that the Jazz may be somewhat underpowered by putting an AT on the 1.2.

I will love to see an AT Jazz (either CVT or City/Civic five speed). Who knows with SIEL out of the way this may even happen.

Do you agree that it is unusual for a Honda product to attract so much discussion.

[acroback]

Guys, does current City come with those uber cool paddle shifters ?
Sorry I have no clue about automatics

[iliketurtles]

Originally Posted by acroback

Guys, does current City come with those uber cool paddle shifters ?
Sorry I have no clue about automatics

Yes, the City AT does indeed come with paddle shifters

[anujatwork]

Originally Posted by pgsagar

I would stand on my toes all day long for a diesel AT hatch. I even started a thread couple of years back as to why there is no diesel AT hatch. I waited and waited and waited and picked up the smallest petrol AT hatch, A-Star for want of a diesel hatch. For a petrol AT, A-Star returns phenomenol mileage, 14+ in city and 18+ on highway. Still, a diesel would be like manna from heaven. Don't carmakers read these threads? What is with these guys?

It's simply too expensive to develop an AT specially for the Indian market to plant into a diesel variant here. If they had one in their factories any where around the world, it would have been here by now!

[sgiitk]

Originally Posted by iliketurtles

Yes, the City AT does indeed come with paddle shifters

The AT units in the Civic and the City are the same.

[pgsagar]

Originally Posted by anujatwork

It's simply too expensive to develop an AT specially for the Indian market to plant into a diesel variant here. If they had one in their factories any where around the world, it would have been here by now!

We have Chevy Beat Diesel. And Chevy, being American brand, must be having an AT box for all sizes. And let them first launch one and see if it would be a failure rather than assuming that it would be a failure. Time has come for AT cars in our maddening tarffic. Many will buy if AT is provided on diesel hatch. But people won't take to streets holding 'dharnas' demanding AT cars. Thay will buy if they have one. Manufacturers have to make that happen.

[rana_kirti]

ok, so are there any small/hatch AT cars available in the European/American/Asian market which have a 1.2/1.3/1.4 Diesel engine ?

if yes, then can't it be brought to india ?

[Harbir]

Honda's focus on the Brio and neglect of the Jazz actually makes perfect sense. The Jazz, fitted with the 1.5Litre engine, is regarded as one of the best small cars in the world. The level of engineering, refinement, and quality are of a very high level. But with a 1.2 litre engine, the Jazz is out of its optimum space, offering performance that can be had at much cheaper prices.

The jazz, even with the 1.2 engine, offers a very high standard of engineering for its price, but the engine's lack of grunt overwhelms that impression for most people, and no question that Honda's profit margins on the jazz are razor thin, if not actually negative.

With the Brio, honda gets to sell a car thats much cheaper to make than the jazz, that yields bigger per unit profits despite its lower price, and will generate much bigger volumes because of the lower price.

The Jazz is a bit of a misfit in the India market. This is not a market that considers it worthwhile paying premium prices for small cars on the recognition of their sophistication.

That means we have to be satisfied with the cheap and cheerful brio instead of the suave, polished jazz.

I would not bet against honda ceasing Jazz sales in India altogether were it not for Honda Japan's declaration that the Jazz is the model they are relying on to underpin its range in every important market. They'll keep it in the market.

I am going to guess that they are not discontinuing the jazz because they expect it to be a very hot seller with the diesel engine and they are content to sell a few hundred petrol units till the diesel arrives. If they were to kill the jazz now and then try to reintroduce it with a diesel, apart from the cost of ending and restarting production, the jazz would because tainted as a model that failed in the market and has been brought back for a second try.

[CRtorquefan]

I smell Brio S-AT to be priced at Rs.5.5 lacs(ex-showroom) to lure some of the Diesel hatchback buyers as well.
Ease of driving & clutch-less fatigue-free driving be its USP/Marketing gimmick to bring the Honda's hold on Indian auto market.