[rsidd]

Originally Posted by rohanjf

Are they aiming at common customers with all that chrome and small (fuel efficient) engines? They aren't. They can't, because they can never beat with Maruti or Hyundai, or even Tata.

This sort of attitude is slightly insane and I am happy Fiat doesn't share it with you! Why would they need to beat Maruti/Hyundai/Tata? If that is the only goal, what are VW, Renault, Nissan, GM etc doing in the market? None of them is going to beat Maruti/Hyundai either. Maybe all other manufacturers should pack up and go home too?

For all of this year, Fiat is one of 2 or 3 manufacturers which has shown consistent year-on-year growth, and the only one to do so without any new products. Now the new products are coming, the new dealerships are in place, lets see how they fare. The goal at this point is to improve numbers and mindshare and improve reputation, not to be a market leader!

There is a market for a nice-looking, solidly-built, reliable car with the current, perfectly solid engine options. Fiat is catering to that market and apparently has figured that, at this point, there isn't enough of a market for the higher-powered engines or the AMT. Their call and they're probably right in my opinion. The people who want a superhatch can wait for the Abarth.

[Rubbertramps]

Originally Posted by avingodb

The Indonesian variant retains the charm of the earlier generation exterior design with the updates on the inside. Just the adequate amount of facelift IMO.
.

The Indonesian version doesnt have much changes to the exterior. Even after having a considerable change to the exterior in the Indian version, the car is getting hammered here. Imagine the Indonesian version launched here. The only good thing is the AMT there. Had Fiat launced the AMT with the new interiors and the same old exteriors in India, it could have been a game changer !

[Ruchitya]

Rsidd I second you on that. We should be happy fiat isn't just catering to the masses by making flimsy looking cars which might look 'modern' for a few years and go out the next. Same with the gimmicky features they offer. Build quality, seating, and the ambience in out Linea exceeds the more popular sedans by a fair margin. Fiat seems to be on the right track, albeit slow in implementing there goals.

[avingodb]

Originally Posted by rsidd

identical to the Punto 2012 (Europe model).

Something which did not come to India at all.

Originally Posted by Rubbertramps

considerable change

What they have done in the name of considerable change is over the top in my opinion but lets not debate this further as such preferences are matters of personal taste. In fact, I think the upcoming avatar would have been more acceptable to the fans of traditional design had it been a progression from the European spec design instead of the India spec design.

Yes, why they would choose to exclude AMT baffles me as well.

[blacksport]

Originally Posted by deetjohn

That will be disaster. What ever said and done, Fiat as a brand has great affection and loyalty from a niche segment.

Fiat India just need to get their products aligned to this segment' needs. Like Yamaha did when they ditched the commuter segment and went after the enthusiasts. And I believe this is happening, but Fiat needs to make things happen faster and much earlier. They are too slow for their size and numbers.

On the other hand, I don't there are many Chrysler fans out there.

Fiat brand has a lot of negative image with the Indian public that would surpass any loyalty from a niche segment. It is better that they ditch the Fiat brand name and start afresh.

Datsun is a totally new brand selling a mediocre car, but they sell more than Fiat.

Having said that, it is better they start with a clean slate. Rather than putting the Chrysler logo on the Linea and Punto, they should start afresh with new models. Just like GM ditched Opel and started afresh with Chevrolet.

[extreme_torque]

Some more scoop images. And aren't those the best looking factory alloys ever fitted to a hatchback in India?
http://forum.autocarindia.com/index....20#entry163614

[deetjohn]

Originally Posted by blacksport

Fiat brand has a lot of negative image with the Indian public that would surpass any loyalty from a niche segment. It is better that they ditch the Fiat brand name and start afresh.

Datsun is a totally new brand selling a mediocre car, but they sell more than Fiat.

Having said that, it is better they start with a clean slate. Rather than putting the Chrysler logo on the Linea and Punto, they should start afresh with new models. Just like GM ditched Opel and started afresh with Chevrolet.

Datsun sells more since 'GO' is a new launch and its the A+ segment. The sales volume got to be high there. So, let's give it some more time to find how that is going to pan out for Datsun. And wouldn't 'GO' sell the same way were it called a Nissan? I feel it would have sold a little more even.

I think Fiat shouldn't go after the general public. Rather they should warm up to the excellent fan following Fiat has. How? By launching products that this niche market wants. I know of instances where Fiat fans went for something else. And that's not because of brand name or service. Its because either the GP or Linea was not able to deliver on certain aspects.

Don't you think there will be many here to buy a Linea with the 1.6 MJD? And will they mind that Fiat badge on the car? I don't think so.

And is GM doing any better after ditching Opel for Chevy? They lost the plot when they failed to launch exciting products. Somehow, they failed to add to the buzz created by Cruze without constant updates and launching Shanghai GM' products was a big no.

So, more than brand, I feel the products matter. And that's where Fiat needs to put more effort in. A change of brand is not going to hide all your problems. There will be initial excitement where the marketing can pull a facade. But it will all show up again in the long run. So, spend time and effort on products!

[rohanjf]

Originally Posted by rsidd

This sort of attitude is slightly insane and I am happy Fiat doesn't share it with you! Why would they need to beat Maruti/Hyundai/Tata?

I think my examples of Maruti/Hyundai/Tata was a little too much. However, deetjohn has written exactly what I was thinking:

Originally Posted by deetjohn

I think Fiat shouldn't go after the general public. Rather they should warm up to the excellent fan following Fiat has. How? By launching products that this niche market wants. I know of instances where Fiat fans went for something else. And that's not because of brand name or service. Its because either the GP or Linea was not able to deliver on certain aspects.

I, for one, am desperate to replace my 6 year old Palio MJD. I want a driver's car, but with all safety features. The only thing that comes close is Polo GT TSi (because I want automatic too, but with an option of manual override).

Sometimes I regret buy Palio only because Fiat has failed to launch a similarly-sized successor, but which caters to changing needs.

Those who are enthusiasts can wait for Abarth, you mentioned. Not all enthusiasts are rich. What about that huge gap between Punto top-end and Abarth?

I guess right products will time. But the problem is, it is taking too much time and by then the competition would have gone one step further.

[rsidd]

Originally Posted by rohanjf

I, for one, am desperate to replace my 6 year old Palio MJD. I want a driver's car, but with all safety features. The only thing that comes close is Polo GT TSi (because I want automatic too, but with an option of manual override).

I think Fiat has decided not to bring in anything below Punto, so there will be no Palio successor. They want lower volumes, higher quality, higher margins. Also, they don't seem interested in automatic or AMT. The automatic market in India is quite small, and while Celerio AMT has attracted interest, it remains to be seen how permanent the interest is... and testing a whole new transmission system for a low-volume car like the Punto, when a very well-tested manual transmission already exists, may not seem worthwhile to them.

[sinharishi]

Originally Posted by sinharishi

The interior pictures of the camouflaged Punto posted earlier on this thread had beige + black combo. Plus, the car also had abarth like alloys.

Is this 75 HP Emotion?

Source: Teamfiat

[k_ajay]

Originally Posted by sinharishi

Is this 75 HP Emotion?

Source: Teamfiat

Yes, this is the 75hp Emotion variant. That lovely looking alloys, as I found out, is 15" and only comes on 75hp variant.

[nim_peter]

I don't know why Indian market doesn't have multiple engine options. An example is Ford Focus in UK, they have around 15 models, petrols, Diesels and STs. Maybe FIAT can try it, everyone will be happy. They can add 2 more variants to their current lineup, a 1.6MJD Dynamic and a 1.6MJD Emotion. Regular customers can go for the 1.3 and the ones who can afford and need better performance can go for a 1.6.

[rsidd]

Originally Posted by nim_peter

I don't know why Indian market doesn't have multiple engine options. An example is Ford Focus in UK, they have around 15 models, petrols, Diesels and STs. Maybe FIAT can try it, everyone will be happy.

Ford sells more than 200,000 cars a year in the UK. Fiat doesn't sell a tenth that number in India. Offering 15 engine options for monthly sales of less than 1000 would be an inventory nightmare...

[nim_peter]

Originally Posted by rsidd

Ford sells more than 200,000 cars a year in the UK. Fiat doesn't sell a tenth that number in India. Offering 15 engine options for monthly sales of less than 1000 would be an inventory nightmare...

True I'm not talking 15 models, Focus is just an example. If they have such an option, then we have the Linea classic for the mileage conscious and Taxis. Then we can have 1.4 FIRE and 1.3 doing duty in new linea. Going a step further, they can have another lineup of 1.4Tjet(performance) and 1.6MJD(performance+mileage), Linea GT or something like that . The sales is already low, so it is not a huge risk they will be taking and it should be cheaper than introducing new cars. I think Verna has 2 engine options for petrol and for Diesel, 1.4 ltr and 1.6ltr. And surprisingly I see most Vernas on road are 1.6 CRDI.

[Palio_2005]

Just received a message from Fiat they they are offering upto a lac off on old Punto. Looks like attractive exchange offer.