[amit]

I don't understand what Fiat smokes. What is the logic behind further detuning the Linea classic? Thanks to their gearbox even the 90bhp Linea felt sluggish and now they are going to downgrade it to 75bhp! They should have maintained the current engines including the TJet for the classic and launched the 2014 Linea with more powerful engines like the 120bhp 1.6MJD and tuned the TJet to deliver about 150bhp.

As for Grand Cherokee, I believe it has a V6 diesel engine. I am guessing it will be priced around the ML250 range of about 55-60 Lakhs while the Wrangler should be around 40 Lakhs. In any case, Wrangler is hardly going to have a market here, the Grand Cherokee can do well here but the Wrangler has no chance.

[lapis_lazuli]

Originally Posted by amit

They should have maintained the current engines including the TJet for the classic and launched the 2014 Linea with more powerful engines like the 120bhp 1.6MJD and tuned the TJet to deliver about 150bhp.

Can anyone let me know if the price of a car is also dependent on its power output, apart from cubic capacity, length, ground clearance etc?

On the other hand, 190Nm of torque, with 75HP, would not be bad for a luxury city taxi. Somebody mentioned Fiat is thinking in these lines, already. For the heavy luggage and passengers, the torque would do good, chugging away happily!

[julupani]

Originally Posted by amit

I don't understand what Fiat smokes. What is the logic behind further detuning the Linea classic? Thanks to their gearbox even the 90bhp Linea felt sluggish and now they are going to downgrade it to 75bhp! They should have maintained the current engines including the TJet for the classic and launched the 2014 Linea with more powerful engines like the 120bhp 1.6MJD and tuned the TJet to deliver about 150bhp.

I think you are a bit confused. The Linea Classic is not the new Linea. Its a detuned considerably cheaper Linea, with lot less equipment and hopefully a bit lighter as well. So you cant possibly expect them to provide a cheaper Linea with a lot more power. It would not be what a person buying a cheaper car wants.

Like someone mentioned, it is probably targeted at taxi buyers other than competing with the likes of the Etios, Dzire etc. Also the 75hp Linea wont really make it much more sluggish than the 90hp version. In fact most people who compared the 90hp Punto and 75hp Punto, say that the 75hp is better off in the city. Its only on the highway at comparatively high speeds that you really get to feel the advantage of the 90hp motor. So the 75hp motor should do more than fine in the Linea Classic.This is because the improvement in torque in the 90hp engine is not that much to make a big difference. Hope they can price the base variant of the diesel Linea Classic around the 6.5L mark.

As for the new Linea which will be launched in time, from what is being speculated, it will be powered only by the Tjet engine and the 1.6MJD engine. Both these engines are more than powerful enough for the Linea. It would be nice though if FIAT could bring in the MultiAir engines to India.

[amit]

Originally Posted by julupani

I think you are a bit confused.

I am not confused. I know that the Linea classic is the current Linea while the 2014 Linea is the new one. Like many things in life, perception matters in the auto world too. Both Linea & Punto have the perception of being slightly underpowered & sluggish car's hence launching the Linea Classic with a 75bhp engine will only make it more difficult for Fiat's dealer's to sell the car. Fiat may want to target taxi buyer's but the taxi market is a extremely tough market to sell to and Fiat has neither the image nor the reputation nor the ability to cater to this market.

Anway, what I was saying was sell the Linea classic with the current range of engines - 1.3L VGT 92bhp diesel & 114bhp TJet & launch the 2014 Linea with a 1.6MJD 120bhp unit and the 1.4L TJet with 150bhp.

In any case, the 1.6MJD is still a speculation and will remain so until Fiat confirms it. My fear is if Fiat is launching the Classic with 75bhp diesel then they may retain the 90bhp unit for the new Linea.

[julupani]

Originally Posted by amit

I am not confused. I know that the Linea classic is the current Linea while the 2014 Linea is the new one.

I think that is where your confusion lies. The Linea Classic is not the current Linea. Its a cheaper, simple and more basic Linea. So in my view shifting to the cheaper FGT engine is a good step. It doesnt lose much performance, while going a long way in reducing the price.

Originally Posted by amit

Anway, what I was saying was sell the Linea classic with the current range of engines - 1.3L VGT 92bhp diesel & 114bhp TJet & launch the 2014 Linea with a 1.6MJD 120bhp unit and the 1.4L TJet with 150bhp.

In any case, the 1.6MJD is still a speculation and will remain so until Fiat confirms it. My fear is if Fiat is launching the Classic with 75bhp diesel then they may retain the 90bhp unit for the new Linea.

The kind of market FIAT is looking at for the Linea Classic, the 114hp Tjet engine will be complete overkill. The 90hp engine would have been okay, but I think the price versus performance equation shifts the balance in favour of the 75hp engine.

As for the new Linea, I dont think FIAT are going to continue with the 90hp 1.3MJD. I think this time they are going to get it right and we will get the 1.6MJD. As for the petrol engine a 150hp 1.4L engine will be overkill for a manufacturer, especially in India. First of all to make that much power you need a big turbo, which means big lag. Lag may be okay in a performance oriented car like an Abarth, but in daily use it is frustrating. Also so much power from a small engine like that means a lot tighter service intervals and in a country where longer warranty periods are becoming common I doubt FIAT will be able to do that. Also so much power will kill the fuel efficiency, something which is very important in India. The present 114hp Tjet is a pretty good balance, though I would have preferred to see the 105hp 1.4MultiAir instead, with an optional 135hp MultiAir turbo for the performance seekers.

[amit]

Originally Posted by julupani

I think that is where your confusion lies. The Linea Classic is not the current Linea. Its a cheaper, simple and more basic Linea.

I do understand that but the basic car remains the same hence I said that the Linea classic is the current Linea while I referred to the refreshed one as the new or 2014 Linea.

[JohnyBoy]

Originally Posted by julupani

...Just because the Linea and the Punto did not set the sales charts on fire, does not mean that they were meant only for FIAT loyalists. Just like the Polo and Vento, the Linea and Punto were always mass market vehicles. Just that they were unsuccessful ones...

Completely agree with you. Punto and Linea are not niche products. Like you said Fiat is less successful in sales numbers. And people (read Fiat enthusiasts like Biraj and me) treated this as 'premium' and felt special. Now we feel bad hearing the possibility of Lineas in Meru fleet.

Please allow us to feel 'special' for some more time

[djay99]

When i went to book a Linea T-Jet last month, i was being told by sales executive that fiat is launching new linea only after 6 months. He was sure that current T-Jet model will be sold for another 6 to 8 months.
Now its not even a month since i booked and a stripped down variant is almost launched.

Dealer will be getting my car by this week end and i am thinking whether to continue or cancel my booking. I may feel like owning a discontinued linea with a powerful heart and few more features than a regular classic.

I am sure Fiat will offer more discounts next month as they want to get rid of existing Linea T-jet stocks. What do you experts suggest?

[CRV2010]

Originally Posted by djay99

When i went to book a Linea T-Jet last month, i was being told by sales executive that fiat is launching new linea only after 6 months. He was sure that current T-Jet model will be sold for another 6 to 8 months.
Now its not even a month since i booked and a stripped down variant is almost launched.

Dealer will be getting my car by this week end and i am thinking whether to continue or cancel my booking. I may feel like owning a discontinued linea with a powerful heart and few more features than a regular classic.

I am sure Fiat will offer more discounts next month as they want to get rid of existing Linea T-jet stocks. What do you experts suggest?

I am sure T-jet too will be offered in the new avatar as the Fiat is trying to clear off all the existing stocks by giving hefty discounts. I would rather suggest you to wait for another 1-2 months before plunging money into out going model.

[selfdrive]

I found a little birdie.
the birdie told me that the new Linea will be launched in a never seen before (edit: in India) colour. Matt black.

No guarantees, but then I am not selling anything!

[prithwi-81]

Cross Punto? That would be fun!
Yes, they do have a lot of cars that they could launch here. I wonder how long they are going to go ahead with only 2 cars. They do need an entry level hatch in B1 segment. Most likely to revive/ refresh the Uno. They can definitely be accused of not trying too hard.

Dont learn so much from VAG too. I would prefer Fiat dont become as arrogant as VAG. yes 2 hot hatches launched, but the platform is the same.

Yes VAG is arrogant(not that I'm a fan of it), but they have a brilliant product in the GTs to be arrogant about especially with the GTs (TSI and TDI) flying off the dealerships faster than they can seem to make it. When was the last time Fiat India could say the same.. oh yea.. in the 90s with the Palio GTXs.

Fiat has nearly 8 products on the same platform(punto and linea) with the plethora of undepowered and increasingly unattractive engine options (not to mention sharing its diesel powerplant with Tata/Maruti etc who actually do a better job of tuning it). Its funny how they cant seem to plonk a the T-Jet into the Punto along with the Linea brakes, use plastic fenders/bodywork like the BMW Xs and call it a day. Pretty simple formula for a smashing hot hatch which IMHO will sell extremely well. Instead they concentrate on cheap econoboxing the linea which will drive off its loyal customers.

[lapis_lazuli]

slightly: But interesting news article here...


http://www.forbes.com/sites/joannmul...-chrysler-ipo/

[noopster]

Mod Note: Linea Classic launch discussion moved to a new thread. please continue that specific discussion there, while this thread can be used for general discussion on the Fiat new launches topic.

[selfdrive]

Originally Posted by prithwi-81

Yes VAG is arrogant(not that I'm a fan of it), but they have a brilliant product in the GTs to be arrogant about especially with the GTs (TSI and TDI) flying off the dealerships faster than they can seem to make it.

Not quite flying off the shelves yet, but definitely better than the Fiats for sure. Another couple of months could see discounts on the GTs too. Time will tell. Even if it is for now, that is no reason for arrogance. It usually comes before a fall. Ask Honda.

Originally Posted by prithwi-81

Pretty simple formula for a smashing hot hatch which IMHO will sell extremely well. Instead they concentrate on cheap econoboxing the linea which will drive off its loyal customers.

Maybe after the Palio they thought it makes more sense to focus on a different set of customers to bring the volumes. Enthusiasts only buy so much. But in that case, the Panda would have been a better bet. For loyalists, the Bravo would have been great!

[nskumar]

Linea facelift should have gone this way especially the rear design.
Rear looks more modern and gels with the original design.
Front design not in sync with the original design.

Credit: cananea (Carlos Canana) on deviantART