[arunr]

When we bought our indica diesel around 2005 there was nothing much else within similar price range. However, over the years have come to love the robustness and space of the vehicle inspite of the niggles.
Even today if i were to get a replacement it would mostly be a vista or a manza, patriotism aside these (Tata / Mahindra) vehicles offer immense VFM

[TechNomad]

Very pertinent topic! I think i do. I would love to see a desi brand winning over foreign manufactured/assembled car. I would also like to think that my money will help desi car companies even if it isn't.

Although when I bought my car in 2011 my decision was based on the best value for money car, long term maintenance costs etc. - I am glad I could zero in on a desi car and quite happy so far about my decision.

[gomzi]

I owned a Tata Indigo CS TDi for ~5yrs and no patriotism did not play a part in the purchase.
It was simply more car for the $$$ spent. Small external footprint, very spacious inside and an OTR cost less than even the showroom price of a Swift VDi - absolute VFM at the time.

[karpusv]

M800 bought in 1997 as there weren't much choices at that price point.
Logan bought in 2007 purely from utilitarian and functional point of view.
Nano bought in 2012 as a replacement of the M800 from price point of view.

I never really felt that patriotism would pay back especially when buying goods/commodities. Can I help the wristwatches, shoes, clothes and gadgets I use?. My personal opinion though.

[noidea]

My first car was a Tata Indica DLS in 2003. I purchased that car because of at least 50% sense of patriotism. While I was researching the cars on my shortlist I saw a Black Indica with SWADESHI written in sweeping letters all across the rear window glass in White. It looked really good, really good!!

[CoolBlueBiker]

Jeremy is nostalgic thinking about the era when british cars were fabulous. But today, Neither Aston Martin or Jaguar/LR are british owned. The guys at top gear solace themselves by saying british cars are best, when rest of the world knows they are talking crap

Even market sensibilities across the globe yield towards better products irrespective of their make. I mean, how many americans in today's age drive american cars India is no different. As long as Indian manufacturers fail to provide competitive cars, we will look elsewhere.

[acidkill]

I think the idea of what construes to be an Indian car is often confused and so i would like to share my view on the same

In my opinion, for a car to be considered 'Indian' it must have the following characteristics
(In order of weight)

1. The promoter must be an Indian Citizen, or the ultimate promoting entity must be registered in India and 'by-in-large' held by Indian Citizens
2. Not only the know-how for the development of the car (definitely incl. engine and transmission), but the benefit of the knowledge gained from the product life cycle must be to the benefit of an Indian promoting company and to Indian owned ancillary companies
3. The majority shareholders and/or staff must be Indian Citizens

So i suppose that when you begin to apply these filters, you will find that many cars, even those manufactured in India, are not really 'Indian', while cars even manufactured abroad are 'Indian'

[tsk1979]

I call this misguided patriotism.
Hyundai builds small cars here and exports them.
Renualt builds the duster here and exports.

In case of something which comes in as CBU, I can understand that the buyer wants that his purchase should be Indian, but if a car is made in India, how does it matter whether its Tata or Renault, apart from the fact that the businessman getting rich from his purchase was born in India.

[masin4]

Originally Posted by tsk1979

apart from the fact that the businessman getting rich from his purchase was born in India.

when it comes to matters of Taxation etc however I am assuming Tsk1979 it is a case of the Business to wich the profits accrue.If it is Indian based company the Taxes accrued from the profit of sales earned abroad is accrued to India, and if the businessman gets rich hopefully pays his taxes properly and that also accrue's to the Indian exchequer.

[k_nitin_r]

Maruti is an Indian company too, though it is less than a quarter owned by Indian institutions now. Back in the early days, Suzuki had just a little over a quarter of the shares as its ownership stake. I don't really know what happened later, but I would guess the government had to divest because of fair market practices since Maruti gained a huge market share. Perhaps someone who knows why the government divested can share the tale.

I still choose Maruti because of the mix of patriotism and quality. Based on the forum complaints, it seems Maruti does a better job of the final post-manufacture quality checks when compared to Tata and Mahindra, which seem to have gained a Boeing 787-like reputation.

[torquecurve]

Been an outright TATA fan for ages. But then, they deliver on what they promise.

Indica - More Car per Car - Compare it to the cars of its class when it was launched, at the price and (even till about 2005 till Getz came on the scene, though priced higher) and the ruggedness of the car (making it the favourite of the taxi market) it made more sense.

Indigo (CS, XL) - The humongous boot with the excellent legroom (compare it to the esteem) and nice seating (comfortable), easy ingress/egress (compared to the low slung cars) and general crusining ability along with the ruggedness it offers still makes it an excellent VFM product. In fact, the new CS looks pretty decent (better than the kicked in the back DZire - no offense to Dzire owners).

The Vista (my Car!) - Total VFM package. The Beat 3 Pot Diesel sells more expensive than this car! Even the Petrol Vista (mine) costs a lot less to buy and run. Extremely spacious and versatile (60:40 Flip seats and all), I have even moved a fridge and cooler inside the car. Rugged and can take a lot of beating.

The Manza - Is more spacious than cars in a class above it. Extremely comfortable, silent (I use a Manza Safire90), good highway cruiser, nice to drive in the city. Doesnt break the bank to buy and run!

The Safari - Dicor and Storme - Can hold their own even against 'new' designs.

The Aria - If it wasnt compared to the Innova first up, It would have sold more (and overpriced a bit)

The NANO - Been using it and it is an excellent city runabout. Very peppy engine, good space, comfortable, nice AC, dirt cheap to run (20kmpl real life FE that I get).


From the Mahindra Stables - the Bolero - The 'fill it, shut it, rip it' kind of SUV/MUV.
The XUV5OO - Looks nice (once it grows on you), Monocoque construction, nice engine, feature packed with more features than cars a couple of segments up.
The Scorpio - Again a mean looking SUV with nice space and a good engine.


Also the TATA (and to an Extent the Mahindras) feel a lot more safer than flimsy Korean/Jap vehicles. Again, this is my opinion. But if you see a car from the MS stables which gives excellent FE, just feel the doors and look at the thin tyres. Then look at a comparative TATA/M&M vehicle and you will see thicker metal and wider tyres. And yes, these come with crumple zones as well.

The only thing these companies lack is the feeling that we as Indians tag to anything that is Indian - That it is not as good as imported stuff/ foreign maal.
The day we loook beyond this 'snob' factor of owning a 'foreign maal' vehicle, these cars suddenly make more sense and appeal to the heart as well.

[Dr.Suraj]

What a wonderful topic!!!


I think my enthusiasm or rooting for Tata / Mahindra cars is quite well known.

And I have been quite vocal about how a lot of foreign manufacturers are just fleecing the Indian public based on herd mentality and NOT really offering VFM products per se.

This 'competition' has led to 1 good thing:

Both Tata & Mahindra have pulled up their socks and now we are getting QUALITY products from them and even improving every day as we speak.

So as a consumer it is a total win win sensation.

Definitely DESI brands - easier to maintain, easier to get spares, more suited and moulded for our conditions, people are more answerable and LONG TERM ownership costs are significantly less.

In response to this main question:

If people can buy any car just because it's 'German',
then why can people buy a car just because it's 'Indian' ?

Team BHP - Redlining the INDIAN automotive scene...


And the INDIAN auto industry has grown LEAPS and BOUNDS.

Tata which began humbly in 1998 with the indigenious Indica ...
Has really grown and matured over the last 14 years (small time) in this industry where a LOT is procured from INHOUSE talent. Home grown. Own efforts. Indigenious.
So much that it bought a sick (company wise) British marquee and turned it's forutnes around!

Mahindra too - the jeep guys - made such a compelling product in the XUV.

So - even as an UNBIASED decision there is NO REASON to overlook these guys in todays times.
They deserve the second glance. Second chance too.

All the more - because they are ... INDIAN.
We should be proud of them and not frown on them.

Just my opinion ... and thus my vote.

[Dr.Suraj]

Originally Posted by torquecurve

Been an outright TATA fan for ages. But then, they deliver on what they promise.

Indica - More Car per Car - Compare it to the cars of its class when it was launched, at the price and (even till about 2005 till Getz came on the scene, though priced higher) and the ruggedness of the car (making it the favourite of the taxi market) it made more sense.

Indigo (CS, XL) - The humongous boot with the excellent legroom (compare it to the esteem) and nice seating (comfortable), easy ingress/egress (compared to the low slung cars) and general crusining ability along with the ruggedness it offers still makes it an excellent VFM product. In fact, the new CS looks pretty decent (better than the kicked in the back DZire - no offense to Dzire owners).

The Vista (my Car!) - Total VFM package. The Beat 3 Pot Diesel sells more expensive than this car! Even the Petrol Vista (mine) costs a lot less to buy and run. Extremely spacious and versatile (60:40 Flip seats and all), I have even moved a fridge and cooler inside the car. Rugged and can take a lot of beating.

The Manza - Is more spacious than cars in a class above it. Extremely comfortable, silent (I use a Manza Safire90), good highway cruiser, nice to drive in the city. Doesnt break the bank to buy and run!

The Safari - Dicor and Storme - Can hold their own even against 'new' designs.

The Aria - If it wasnt compared to the Innova first up, It would have sold more (and overpriced a bit)

The NANO - Been using it and it is an excellent city runabout. Very peppy engine, good space, comfortable, nice AC, dirt cheap to run (20kmpl real life FE that I get).


From the Mahindra Stables - the Bolero - The 'fill it, shut it, rip it' kind of SUV/MUV.
The XUV5OO - Looks nice (once it grows on you), Monocoque construction, nice engine, feature packed with more features than cars a couple of segments up.
The Scorpio - Again a mean looking SUV with nice space and a good engine.


Also the TATA (and to an Extent the Mahindras) feel a lot more safer than flimsy Korean/Jap vehicles. Again, this is my opinion. But if you see a car from the MS stables which gives excellent FE, just feel the doors and look at the thin tyres. Then look at a comparative TATA/M&M vehicle and you will see thicker metal and wider tyres. And yes, these come with crumple zones as well.

The only thing these companies lack is the feeling that we as Indians tag to anything that is Indian - That it is not as good as imported stuff/ foreign maal.
The day we loook beyond this 'snob' factor of owning a 'foreign maal' vehicle, these cars suddenly make more sense and appeal to the heart as well.

I totally agree to every word!

I too had an Indica

and currently have a Manza and a Nano !!!

What perfect combo.

Luxurious powerful frugal diesel for the highways and family.
Sweet, cute, efficient, peppy teeny wonder for the congested city!

[srh]

It is all about the product & pricing. If I get 95% product for 85% price, I am obviously willing to take it. I see no reason that I should be paying a premium just for a badge or because the product has low localisation leading to insane pricing.

Secondly IMHO, desi companies primarily focus on the Indian market while designing their vehicles. Thus they are better suited to our requirements in terms of spaciousness, ability to negotiate our pot holed roads, quality of our service centers, quality of fuel/ consumables etc. I am sure quite a few people are willing to overlook two distinct concerns which come up on this forum - boat like ride (people normally do not drive that fast or take corners that fast) & quality of plastics (being brought up on Amby's, M800's, Alto's their benchmarks on these would be low :-) )

However times are changing, as the pampered millennial generation is coming of buying age you are seeing that the desired product attributes by the Indian consumer are changing. They are asking for more style, more luxury and better performance & thats where Tata's performance is taking a knock, Mahindra is still able to hold on to its customers due to sharper positioning

[Batfreak]

I thin most of the people would be buying these cars due to the India spec tuning, cheap after sales costs and the nationwide presence.
But then, probably, your mind pushes you towards the fact "Desi" factor.