[khoj]

Golf is built on a platform that is at least one size bigger than the Vento.

Originally Posted by Maky

Thanks mikon. I have a question, In comparison to a Polo how much bigger was it? or if you're unable to tell then, How much smaller than your vento?

Here's one from tg:

[shankar.balan]

Ooh! I love this car. Wish they would bring it in quickly.
Trouble is that it will be expensive and then everyone will crib like the blazes.
But, it certainly will not be as expensive as the Fiat 500, VW Beetle and the Mini Cooper so I guess that is a blessing.

[the_skyliner]

That's some news!
I am waiting so eagerly for Golf to be launched in India. I think it will be priced in the range of Jetta.

[CrAzY dRiVeR]

Except for the front, it looks really boring from other angles - even in red. Hate to even think how boring it would look in colours like silver and white. VW seems to have lost the family design philosophy here.

Scirocco would have made a much better case for itself.

But, then again - they might be testing some engine/transmission combination for the next-gen Jetta. I would be really really surprised if they launch the Golf as a hot hatch.

[StarScream]

Originally Posted by the_skyliner

That's some news!
I am waiting so eagerly for Golf to be launched in India. I think it will be priced in the range of Jetta.

But isn't the Jetta a Golf with a boot? If so, it can't really be priced on par with its bigger sibling.

Originally Posted by shankar.balan

Ooh! I love this car. Wish they would bring it in quickly.
Trouble is that it will be expensive and then everyone will crib like the blazes.
But, it certainly will not be as expensive as the Fiat 500, VW Beetle and the Mini Cooper so I guess that is a blessing.

Originally Posted by nitinbose

@ Shankar and the_skyliner: Considering the Polo TSI to be around 10L on road, I strongly feel this would be around 15L on road. There were times in the past when I used to look at the swift and say that's the ideal size of a compact city car and it should ideally have all the luxury features as found in BMW/Audi (I only knew those as luxury cars, back then). Voila! Here's one such car.

I think things have changed in our market enough to have this as a low volume, niche product. If BMW can launch the 1-Series and Mercedes the A-Class (and the latter is apparently sold out) then clearly there's a market. VW is responsible for this change to some extent with the Polo GT versions.

I think the Golf can slot in between the Vento and Jetta. It is an iconic VW product and the brand will benefit from its halo even as they work on cheaper cars.

[KINI]

Originally Posted by StarScream

But isn't the Jetta a Golf with a boot? If so, it can't really be priced on par with its bigger sibling.

The Jetta is based on the previous generation Golf. The current generation Golf is based on the MQB platform.

I think the Golf can slot in between the Vento and Jetta. It is an iconic VW product and the brand will benefit from its halo even as they work on cheaper cars.

The Golf is based on a newer platform, hence it will be much more expensive to produce. VW will never slot it below the Jetta. If it is slotted above the Jetta it has to contend with the Merc A-Class. Even the 1 Series BMW has struggled to compete against the A-Class in terms of sales.

[StarScream]

Originally Posted by KINI

The Jetta is based on the previous generation Golf. The current generation Golf is based on the MQB platform.

The Golf is based on a newer platform, hence it will be much more expensive to produce. VW will never slot it below the Jetta. If it is slotted above the Jetta it has to contend with the Merc A-Class. Even the 1 Series BMW has struggled to compete against the A-Class in terms of sales.

You missed my point, which is that the Jetta has always been a booted version of the Golf i.e. the Jetta sits above the Golf in their line up.
http://www.volkswagen.co.uk/new/range

The MQB was created as a platform to save costs. So to say that the new generation of a particular car will be more expensive than its larger siblings is to assume that a manufacturer will recoup costs of developing the new platform from one model alone and not over the life of the platform and across models. By that logic, the Octavia should be much more expensive than the current Jetta. But that isn't the case is it? Also, what happens when the next Jetta built on MQB appears?

The Golf will not be competition for the A-Class by a long shot. I agree that anywhere near or above the Jetta - there is no market. 12-14 lakhs - there is a market.

[volkman10]

Originally Posted by ecosport rules

Personally I did not like the looks.

I know looks are subjective, but you are the first I have come across not liking the looks of Golf!


Cheers!

[issigonis]

>>>

In our VFM & badge obsessed market, I don't see the Golf being introduced soon. For, its costs will preclude it from getting in the < 10 l range; and that is the outer limit where most Indian buyers will draw the line at buying a hatchback.

The only possibility that is conceivable is the launch of the Golf GTI, at a notch below the 3 Series, as a hot hatch, for the niche buyer of sporty hatches. There again, the miniscule numbers will imply that the major objective of such a launch will be to create a buzz around a halo model of sorts.

On second thoughts that also does not make much sense, does it?

With VW focussed on reaching the figure of 3 million units in PRC( manufactured pa), I don't think VW will change their current strategy of tinkering their existing models with minor updates/ refreshes till the Indian market shows undeniable signs of a sustainable growth given the anaemic state presently.

VW is very advanced in its core strategy of designing & rolling out platforms which will be used by almost all of its brands - particularly Skoda, VW & Audi- with the requisite tweaking of power-torque, suspension and bells & whistles basis the brand. This directly leads to significant cost rationalisation in designing & manufacturing. The MQB platform is an example.

Regards

[nitinbose]

Indeed the Indian market looks for a more VFM product, however, there are a few people (like team-bhpians ), who would look for the actual car specs, comforts, safety etc., who would opt to buy such cars. I have also heard rumors on VW bringing Golf to India, but there aren't any concrete messages.

@StarScream: You have rightly pointed out there. However, the number of BMW-1 and A-class sales are very less I guess - I haven't seen any on the roads so far. Again, the market is such that they say, "Oh, still its a BMW/Merc, whereas this is a VW, a cheap car" - (that's some people's notion).

If VW launches the Golf, and prices it correctly, there could be a good chance of selling it, though in less numbers, perhaps for a niche segment.

[Tats07]

Originally Posted by StarScream

The MQB was created as a platform to save costs. So to say that the new generation of a particular car will be more expensive than its larger siblings is to assume that a manufacturer will recoup costs of developing the new platform from one model alone and not over the life of the platform and across models. By that logic, the Octavia should be much more expensive than the current Jetta. But that isn't the case is it? Also, what happens when the next Jetta built on MQB appears?

The Golf will not be competition for the A-Class by a long shot. I agree that anywhere near or above the Jetta - there is no market. 12-14 lakhs - there is a market.

But Octavia is more expensive than current generation Jetta, the base TSI of Octavia has a higher ex-showroom than TSI Jetta. And that is probably because the platform is MQB, and even the Octavia 1.4 TSI engine is different from the 1.4 TSI in Jetta. Yes, the MQB Jetta, if launched, is likely to command a premium over Octavia, given VW's strategy to place VW branded vehicles at the upper end compared to Skoda vehicles.

Golf in UK, even in its most basic model, costs GBP 16,775, which straight away translates to 17 Lakhs+ in INR. It is a premium hatchback even there. With some localization/cost cutting (engine de-tuning doesn't make sense for Golf, since there'll be hardly any differentiation from Polo GT in that case), I don't see the ex-showroom falling any lower than 15 Lakhs. Which translates to a OTR of 19.xx Lakhs approx in cities like Bangalore. Somehow, I feel it will compete with A Class/1 Series as a more VFM option if one doesn't get hung up with the badge. At that price point, it will surely offer no less driving pleasure than an A class, and maybe even 1 series.

Of course, all the pricing arguments for Golf hold only if it's a CKD. For a CBU, we know what can happen - it will take the Beetle route.

[W.A.G.7]

Nice catch and a nice looking car, but doesn't it look like already the Volkswagen products available in India? I feel, that's the problem with them, there are too many similar looking products in their portfolio. Personally speaking, I feel this car is meant to be enjoyed on open road with less traffic. Which is unfortunately not the case in India

[zenren]

Originally Posted by nitinbose

However, the number of BMW-1 and A-class sales are very less I guess - I haven't seen any on the roads so far. Again, the market is such that they say, "Oh, still its a BMW/Merc, whereas this is a VW, a cheap car" - (that's some people's notion).

As you rightly said, A class and 1 series go by their brand name. No one says "there goes another hatchback" when they see one. In case of Golf, they might say "there goes a bigger Polo"

Since VW already have the exorbitantly priced Beetle as a 'premium hatchback', Golf would not even be the costliest VW hatch in the country. If they overcut Beetle pricing, they need to offer some serious value add over the Merc A class.

[KINI]

Originally Posted by StarScream

You missed my point, which is that the Jetta has always been a booted version of the Golf i.e. the Jetta sits above the Golf in their line up.
http://www.volkswagen.co.uk/new/range

Comparing model of almost similar configuration(Jetta 140PS 2.0TDI is £21,265 and Golf 150PS 2.0TDI Bluemotion is £21,850), the Golf and Jetta are almost evenly priced. If VW were to bring the 150PS 2.0TDI Bluemotion Golf model it will cost atleast as much as the 2.0 TDI Jetta if not more. Unless VW decides to use the 1.6TDI that we already have here, there is no way they can price it at 12-14 Lakhs

The MQB was created as a platform to save costs. So to say that the new generation of a particular car will be more expensive than its larger siblings is to assume that a manufacturer will recoup costs of developing the new platform from one model alone and not over the life of the platform and across models. By that logic, the Octavia should be much more expensive than the current Jetta. But that isn't the case is it? Also, what happens when the next Jetta built on MQB appears?

Well, the top end Diesel Automatic variant of Octavia in India is costlier than the equivalent of Jetta by almost 50k Rupees. But the Octavia is better loaded. We also have to consider VW India's tendency to price VWs at a premium. So I'm not sure if we can get a clear picture from this example

[StarScream]

Originally Posted by Tats07

But Octavia is more expensive than current generation Jetta, the base TSI of Octavia has a higher ex-showroom than TSI Jetta. And that is probably because the platform is MQB, and even the Octavia 1.4 TSI engine is different from the 1.4 TSI in Jetta. Yes, the MQB Jetta, if launched, is likely to command a premium over Octavia, given VW's strategy to place VW branded vehicles at the upper end compared to Skoda vehicles.

Golf in UK, even in its most basic model, costs GBP 16,775, which straight away translates to 17 Lakhs+ in INR. It is a premium hatchback even there. With some localization/cost cutting (engine de-tuning doesn't make sense for Golf, since there'll be hardly any differentiation from Polo GT in that case), I don't see the ex-showroom falling any lower than 15 Lakhs. Which translates to a OTR of 19.xx Lakhs approx in cities like Bangalore. Somehow, I feel it will compete with A Class/1 Series as a more VFM option if one doesn't get hung up with the badge. At that price point, it will surely offer no less driving pleasure than an A class, and maybe even 1 series.

Of course, all the pricing arguments for Golf hold only if it's a CKD. For a CBU, we know what can happen - it will take the Beetle route.

I was making the point that the Octavia is not wildly priced over the Jetta, not that it is cheaper. MQB or not the difference is only Rs. 50k .

Its not entirely correct to look at U.K. retail prices. The Beetle for instance costs 15,715 pounds in the U.K. That translates into 16 lakhs but the car (being a CBU with 100% tax) doesn't cost 32 lakhs in India. It costs 24 OTR Delhi.

Just like the Octavia where Skoda has taken out parking assist and other features to hit the sub-20 lakh mark, I feel, if VW puts its mind to it they can do things to cut cost such as remove some features, share engines (1.4 TSI, 1.6 TDI) and transmissions (DQ200), and make the car locally to hit a price target.

Originally Posted by KINI

Comparing model of almost similar configuration(Jetta 140PS 2.0TDI is £21,265 and Golf 150PS 2.0TDI Bluemotion is £21,850), the Golf and Jetta are almost evenly priced. If VW were to bring the 150PS 2.0TDI Bluemotion Golf model it will cost atleast as much as the 2.0 TDI Jetta if not more. Unless VW decides to use the 1.6TDI that we already have here, there is no way they can price it at 12-14 Lakhs

But the Bluemotion is a top of the range Golf that gets road tax advantages because of its low CO2 emissions. For the sake of simplicity let's compare the base S variants of both: Golf S - 16,775 pounds; Jetta S - 18,075.

Either way my limited point is that there is a slim market for this car between the Vento and Jetta and that will diminish rapidly after the price crosses 15 lakhs.