[hondadude]

Originally Posted by adc

on comparing brochures [3.0 vs 2.2], length is reduced - 4810 vs 4650.

Good catch. I wonder if this will impact the legroom inside.

[himanshugoswami]

just talkedto my dealer on teh LX part. he tells me that the LX is being launched in 2.2 by end nov/early december. seems that they want to ensure that the ex and vx get off to a sales start since traditionally the LX outsells the EX and VX combined. also, there are left over stocks of the lx at various dealers since that continued to be in production till august whereas teh EX and VX were discountinued around July.

the 3.0 will continue in the new sumo (in a detuned form) and the new sumo MAY also come with a2.5 L version of the 3.0 Dicor- seems the sumo's chasis cannot handle the roque o fthe 3.0 dicor- Need to confirm this from my TM contact.

As regards the discounts, I am getting a cash discount of 45K,free upgrade to Michilen tubeless tyres and the ususal acc. like sunfilm, mats, mud flaps etc.

will get the stereo upgraded in about a months time since th OE stuff is pretty crap.

[cypher]

The fishnet on the floor (below the jump seats), seems to be new. Anyone knows what it is for?


EDIT: Found the answer to this question in the brochure - "Storage nets in the luggage compartment". Guess it is to keep small objects from moving around.

[extreme_torque]

Originally Posted by anandpadhye

The gas filled struts for the rear door - good idea (first seen on Suzuki Grand Vitara). Way to go. If execution is as good as the concept, it should reduce the rattle.

This feature was always there atleast on the Dicor's

[himanshugoswami]

Originally Posted by hondadude

Good catch. I wonder if this will impact the legroom inside.

4650 is the length without the spare wheel. with the spare, it is still 48xx.

please see the diagram at the bottom of the brochure.

[cypher]

As per the brochure - the New features listed for the 2.2 EX are:

1. Tubeless Tyres
2. Body Coloured Claddings
3. Engine Immobilizer with keyless entry
4. Follow me home head-lights
5. Express Down Feature for the Power Windows
6. Storage net in luggage compartment area
7. beige interiors, New instrument cluster, new central console finish, new gear shift knob


Just #1 & #2 are worth around Rs. 20K-25K. If Tatas price the 2.2 just 30K-35K higher than the 3.0, we're getting the new engine almost free.

[anandpadhye]

Originally Posted by extreme_torque

This feature was always there atleast on the Dicor's

Is it?...then it did not work AT ALL on the TD car I was given (3.0L).
So execution is making all the difference in case of Tata...

[Steeroid]

Originally Posted by anandpadhye

The gas filled struts for the rear door - good idea (first seen on Suzuki Grand Vitara). Way to go. If execution is as good as the concept, it should reduce the rattle.

? Gas filled struts have existed on the Safari since TCIC days, and on the Qualis too. Also on the Maruti Omni and the 800, if I'm not mistaken! Nothing special about them, and I dont see how tailgate rattle is affected by a strut that works when the door is opened.

Tailgate rattle on the Safari, if it occurs (very occassionally), is because the bolts holding the rear hatch come loose over a period of time. This, to me is because the spare wheel is attached to the rear door. Obviously there is a huge weight hanging outside that is pulling the door towards the outside. An easy solution could be to spot weld the bolts onto the door, but then you're in a huge spot if you need to change your locks or even repair them.

They have a sort of solution for this by way of a hard rubber stopper right under the door frame. This presumably stops the door from being pulled outwards and reduces the load on the locks. The height of this stopper is adjusted using a set of metal spacer plates - if not screwed on properly (or as in my case if the 'water service' chap decides to grease all hinges and joints and ends up greasing this rubber stopper too) the nuts holding this stopper can come loose, as a result of which the spacers jingle away inside the stopper.

[rajismine]

I still have some doubts on this vehicle, though I hope the issues are fixed now.

There were primarily two issues with this vehicle which I did confirm with Delphi/TVS Lucas here as they were developing the engine and going for frequent trainings.

1.) Cluth: The clutch was showing irregular wear and tear after every 5000 Kms run due to the speed/torque and others things.

2.) Engine head: I was told that there is a problem with the engine head after 1 lakh Kms. I engine may behave abnormal in some/many cars after
1 Lakh kms

I was also told by these delphi/lucas tvs guys that they were working on this issue like anything and should be fixed by the time they release it in India. though did not get any news after that

For 3L they told me that it is tried and tested technology and though the engine rating is 3lakh kms, internally in TATA, it is believed to run upto 5 Lakh kms making it far more reliable than the 2.2 as tha new engine someway is overworking giving out 140 bhp at 2.2 ltrs.

Lets see. But for sure both the problems did occur during the 2.2 endurance test

[himanshugoswami]

Originally Posted by rajismine

I still have some doubts on this vehicle, though I hope the issues are fixed now.

There were primarily two issues with this vehicle which I did confirm with Delphi/TVS Lucas here as they were developing the engine and going for frequent trainings.

1.) Cluth: The clutch was showing irregular wear and tear after every 5000 Kms run due to the speed/torque and others things.

2.) Engine head: I was told that there is a problem with the engine head after 1 lakh Kms. I engine may behave abnormal in some/many cars after
1 Lakh kms

I was also told by these delphi/lucas tvs guys that they were working on this issue like anything and should be fixed by the time they release it in India. though did not get any news after that

For 3L they told me that it is tried and tested technology and though the engine rating is 3lakh kms, internally in TATA, it is believed to run upto 5 Lakh kms making it far more reliable than the 2.2 as tha new engine someway is overworking giving out 140 bhp at 2.2 ltrs.

Lets see. But for sure both the problems did occur during the 2.2 endurance test

and this mirrors my various posts leading up to the 2.2 launch based on what my friend at ERC told me. So far, he has been spot on on all his info, inc. the expected price increase.

but, i dont think it is a case of the 2.2 overworking to pump out all those horses- it is more a case of optimisation of wngine capabilities. In teh 3.0 however, the damn thing is UNDER working!! hence, that resultsin a very stress free operation for the engine. plus as the yanks say- "there is no replacement for displacement!"

Look at it this way- I could easily have gone for the 2.2 EX, now that it is being launched tomorrow, but I am still going by my friend's advice and buying the 3.0. (the fact that the 3.0 works out about 1 L cheaper after discounts has NOT influenced my decision). After all, this is a guy closely involved in the product development, and I would tend to trust him more than some "oh so knowledgable" experts we have crawling out of the woodwork.

[JUDA]

Originally Posted by rajismine

I still have some doubts on this vehicle, though I hope the issues are fixed now.

There were primarily two issues with this vehicle which I did confirm with Delphi/TVS Lucas here as they were developing the engine and going for frequent trainings.

1.) Cluth: The clutch was showing irregular wear and tear after every 5000 Kms run due to the speed/torque and others things.

2.) Engine head: I was told that there is a problem with the engine head after 1 lakh Kms. I engine may behave abnormal in some/many cars after
1 Lakh kms

I was also told by these delphi/lucas tvs guys that they were working on this issue like anything and should be fixed by the time they release it in India. though did not get any news after that

For 3L they told me that it is tried and tested technology and though the engine rating is 3lakh kms, internally in TATA, it is believed to run upto 5 Lakh kms making it far more reliable than the 2.2 as tha new engine someway is overworking giving out 140 bhp at 2.2 ltrs.

Lets see. But for sure both the problems did occur during the 2.2 endurance test

Well, there are 2 questions - Why would tata or Delphi make this huge mistake of releasing an engine when it is their USP for the new Safari. I don't think they would want to take such a risk especially with the kind of reputation TATAs have been tagged for the passed decade. Also, if you see the competition Scorpio eagle which also supports the move from the basic 3L to 2.2L, if they didn't intent to compete with Scorpio on this they would have waited for the X2 platform and then launched 2.2engine with the X2 saving one launch cost.

[Samurai]

Originally Posted by Rahulk76

LSD was always there in 3 ltr 4x4 family. I read it in the mannual. 4x4 owners can conclude on this

I don't remember LSD ever being mentioned by any Safari 4x4 owners here. Can someone confirm.

[anandpadhye]

Originally Posted by himanshugoswami

and this mirrors my various posts leading up to the 2.2 launch based on what my friend at ERC told me. So far, he has been spot on on all his info, inc. the expected price increase.

but, i dont think it is a case of the 2.2 overworking to pump out all those horses- it is more a case of optimisation of wngine capabilities. In teh 3.0 however, the damn thing is UNDER working!! hence, that resultsin a very stress free operation for the engine. plus as the yanks say- "there is no replacement for displacement!"

Look at it this way- I could easily have gone for the 2.2 EX, now that it is being launched tomorrow, but I am still going by my friend's advice and buying the 3.0. (the fact that the 3.0 works out about 1 L cheaper after discounts has NOT influenced my decision). After all, this is a guy closely involved in the product development, and I would tend to trust him more than some "oh so knowledgable" experts we have crawling out of the woodwork.

So hurry up. You have time to buy the 3.0 only till the stocks last.

It's so funny - till some time back it was "wait, wait for a better engine" and now all of a sudden it's "run, run before the better engine vanishes!"

[Su-47]

Originally Posted by himanshugoswami

the 3.0 will continue in the new sumo (in a detuned form) and the new sumo MAY also come with a2.5 L version of the 3.0 Dicor- seems the sumo's chasis cannot handle the roque o fthe 3.0 dicor- Need to confirm this from my TM contact.

Thanks man! That gives me some hope. The thought of call centre cabs zipping around with a 115bhp engine (on the ORR) made me so uncomfortable.

[himanshugoswami]

Originally Posted by Su-47

Thanks man! That gives me some hope. The thought of call centre cabs zipping around with a 115bhp engine (on the ORR) made me so uncomfortable.

Even when u drive a truck yourself!!!! Think of the poor guys driving sedans then