[ankitjains]

Hello Friends,

This is my first post on Team-BHP and I am really excited to be part of this wonderful community.

I have a concern and seek members' advice.

I was looking to purchase Renault Lodgy (8 seater) RxZ 110 version in Royal Orchid colour and during the last month (July) was negotiating the terms with Renault West Delhi dealer. The colour was not available and since I was not in a hurry, dealer suggested that he would place a fresh order with Renault which will take approx 15-20 days for delivery. I also had my Verna Fluidic 1.6 which I had to exchange. The negotiations went on for about 15 days and after three test drives we finally agreed at an exchange price for my old Verna and also the best discounts that dealer could offer on Lodgy.

That is when dealer started to act funny. He told that the colour that I needed is not available and that I should choose from the colours available with the dealership. Since my father wanted that particular colour I told them that I am happy waiting for it. To my surprise, dealer declined to take the booking. Also before declining the booking, he pressurised a lot for selling my Verna and that too at a price lower that I had quoted. It seemed that the dealership was more interested in purchasing my car rather than selling theirs.

Since the negotiation failed at this dealership, I went to another dealership nearby (Renault Mayapuri) and booked Royal Orchid Lodgy RxZ 110 on 09-Aug-15. I was told that the car will be available by month end and latest by 2nd/3rd of September. The process as explained to me by the dealership was that they will raise an indent with Renault on Monday (i.e. 10-Aug) and it will take 2-3 days for Renault to raise the bill on dealership and the dealership making the payment to Renault and finally Renault despatching the car. Since my father's birthday was on 20.Aug, I requested if the car could be made available by that day. They told that this would not be possible and I asked them to give their best shot. I was told that they will call me once the billing is raised by Renault to the dealer.

Next week I kept following up on the status of billing and despatch and every time dealer gave me some excuse or other. Next week on Monday (i.e. 17 Aug) I was told that they have arranged the car from another dealer in Ghaziabad and the car will be delivered on 20th. I requested for a PDI on 19th to which dealer reluctantly agreed. The car which was arranged was 5 months old and had a big scratch on front left fender and also the interiors were quite dirty. The ODO was at 106 KM which seemed ok since the car was driven from Ghaziabad to west Delhi. Due to the scratch and dirty interiors it looked like a Display car and I told dealer that I will wait for the fresh car arrival from Renault's factory. Dealer told that it would not be an issue and the car will be available by first week of September. Now again, every time I followed up on the status of despatch, dealer gave some weird response that Renault is not despatching the car for one reason or the other.

Finally after much follow-up, I got a call today morning that the Renault has not despatched the model I have booked and the have instead sent a different version (85 PS).

I am really amused at the behaviour of 2 dealership and I am now really confused if should actually go and check with some other dealer for this car.

Could it be possible that Renault is discontinuing this model (I know its a new model, but the kind of response from two dealers make me wonder if I this is going to be a good buy).

[hybridpetrol]

Originally Posted by ankitjains

I am really amused at the behaviour of 2 dealership and I am now really confused if should actually go and check with some other dealer for this car.

Walk away from Renault, I say! You have seen two dealers behaving in a funny way, and this is enough indication that they do not care about your preferences, but want your hard earned money ASAP. This explains why they are interested in your used car more than selling their car. Have you done market research on the price of your vehicle? (Other dealers, used car showrooms, OLX etc?)
We have not got any information about the company discontinuing this model, but as per the news about 20000 Dusters and Lodgys in stock (Dealers + factory).
The dealers are unable to clear their stocks that came in at the time of launch. They would have panicked at the lukewarm response for the new car and hence rather would push the model in their hand (irrespective of color, trim etc), instead of ordering fresh ones from the factory.
I have not seen any public advertisements from Renault to clear the stock either (On the contrary, Tata, for example has already gone on an aggressive sale, to clear out the Zest and Bolt stock).
We have not seen any good news from the company yet, and hence the prices are sure to go down. The resale value of these cars will take an even bigger hit later.
Have you considered any other cars of the similar price brackets?

[antz.bin]

Originally Posted by ankitjains

I am really amused at the behaviour of 2 dealership and I am now really confused if should actually go and check with some other dealer for this car.

Could it be possible that Renault is discontinuing this model (I know its a new model, but the kind of response from two dealers make me wonder if I this is going to be a good buy).

I actually read the entire thread and am going away with a feeling that Renault India would be much better off if they start selling their cars from Amazon or flipkart instead of the dealerships they have. At least such experiences can be avoided if they are selling online.

I know that buying a car online is bad on so many other levels but this one solution is solving their problems much faster. They would still need their local dealer to deliver the car to the customer but starting promotions and short term sales on their cars to clear inventory and boosting the numbers and gathering customer feedback can be handled much better online.

Anyways, the concept isn't exactly new either. Didn't the New Scorpio start its bookings on Snapdeal?

[thatsdileep]

Originally Posted by antz.bin

I actually read the entire thread and am going away with a feeling that Renault India would be much better off if they start selling their cars from Amazon or flipkart instead of the dealerships they have. At least such experiences can be avoided if they are selling online.

Well said! Renault-nissan is fairly a new brand in India and they still in the phase of trying to grab a piece of the market share. To start with the limited dealership/service stations do hamper their sales and adding such irresponsible and shady behavior of the existing dealership can kill their business. If Renault is not too interested in selling their products why even make new ads (the one in which Ranbir Kapoor is making an appearance on TV recently) and introduce new models (Kwid). With this attitude I have my doubts if the Kwid can even come close to being a competition to Eon or Alto. They already are loosing their ground in the SUV segment with the intro of Creta and SCross.

Renault-Nissan need to pull up their socks and get everything in order soon.

[ankitjains]

Originally Posted by hybridpetrol

We have not seen any good news from the company yet, and hence the prices are sure to go down. The resale value of these cars will take an even bigger hit later.
Have you considered any other cars of the similar price brackets?

I went to cancel the booking when dealer offered me to look at the StepWay edition (Royal Orchid 8 Seater) which was available in their stock and was displayed in the showroom (for at least 1.5-2 months). He has offered the vehicle at 13.6 L (including extended warranty) translating into a total discount of approx 69.5K on the dealer's list. This will cost me approx Rs. 28K more than RxZ 110 while the difference in list price is close to Rs. 46K. Did PDI today and found a few scratches which I believe is due to cleaning of vehicle from a not so soft cloth. They have offered to carry out Teflon Coating treatment to take care of them.

However, while looking at the under body, I noticed grease / oil on a portion of under body between front and rear door. I did check other cars with dealer (duster / lodgy) and they also have oil on similar places. I have enclosed the picture below. Is that normal?

[sathya_g_m]

Originally Posted by thatsdileep

Well said! Renault-nissan is fairly a new brand in India and they still in the phase of trying to grab a piece of the market share. To start with the limited dealership/service stations do hamper their sales and adding such irresponsible and shady behavior of the existing dealership can kill their business. If Renault is not too interested in selling their products why even make new ads (the one in which Ranbir Kapoor is making an appearance on TV recently) and introduce new models (Kwid). With this attitude I have my doubts if the Kwid can even come close to being a competition to Eon or Alto. They already are loosing their ground in the SUV segment with the intro of Creta and SCross.

Renault-Nissan need to pull up their socks and get everything in order soon.

With such a dealership attitude, they cannot sell Kwid for more than 2 months. Our budget car buyers are extremely careful interms of what to buy from whom. If they do such a shoddy job, even if they sell Kwid for less than 2 Lakhs, they just have to be selling it for couple of months and stare at empty showrooms.
Looks can bring people to show room, car has to offer the buyer something to keep him, dealer/ASS have to delight them with service and respect to make him bring more customer. There is a big reason on why Maruti and Hyundai arr doing well.

As GTO mentioned some where, pain is on one hand but balm is applied on the other hand.

[anilntny]

Renault-Nissan halt Rs5,000 crore investment in India. But, it is not just Renault-Nissan India, most of the major car makers have
started to invest more carefully.


News source -

http://www.livemint.com/Companies/Vr...ndia-repo.html

http://www.financialexpress.com/arti...-sales/126254/


To be honest, I am a very happy Renault customer. Service cost and spare parts, are cheaper than Maruti. I recently broke the right

hand side-view mirror glass. The dealer had the glass part in stock. The total cost of changing, including labor charge was just

Rs300.The whole process, took less than half an hour. I am sharing this, because when my swift had the same issue, it cost me more

than Rs2000, because they change the whole unit, even if you break the glass part alone.

[apachelongbow]

Originally Posted by renegade004

The 'suits' (primarily MBAs), as has been pointed out in an earlier comment, are often out of touch with the ground reality in terms of what the customers really want and rely on their own suppositions. This could very well have been the case here as they might have over-estimated growth in demand and jacked up production accordingly, ultimately leading to a stock pile of unsold vehicles because of which they have now had to downsize.

Another case in point where the 'suits' didn't know their prospective customers well enough was when they tried to sell the Nano as a cheap alternative for two-wheeler owners looking to upgrade to a car. It now seems that such a customer segment simply was not looking for a product like the Nano and preferred products such as the Maruti Alto and Hyundai Eon instead.

Perhaps the 'suits' should rely a lot more on market research based on surveys that have prospective and existing customers as respondents. They should also listen to feedback from their own dealers who consistently deal with prospective and existing customers.

Very easy to sit on a forum and blame some 'suits' as you put it. I am sure the suits wouldn't have wantonly ensured that they get their projections wrong to ensure some thousands of temporary labour are retrenched.

We are discussing two big world renowned brands here, I am sure they know what they are doing, and its certianly not some speculative lalagiri as you seem to make it to be.

And about the Nano please get your facts right. The Mba types didn't pitch the Nano as an alternative to a scooter or a one lakh car, Mr Ratan Tata is solely responsible for that emotional output and off the cuff pricing which permanently branded the car as a cheap bike upgrade.

[Safari_Beast]

Originally Posted by anilntny

Renault-Nissan halt Rs5,000 crore investment in India. But, it is not just Renault-Nissan India, most of the major car makers have
started to invest more carefully.


News source -

http://www.livemint.com/Companies/Vr...ndia-repo.html

http://www.financialexpress.com/arti...-sales/126254/


To be honest, I am a very happy Renault customer. Service cost and spare parts, are cheaper than Maruti. I recently broke the right

hand side-view mirror glass. The dealer had the glass part in stock. The total cost of changing, including labor charge was just

Rs300.The whole process, took less than half an hour. I am sharing this, because when my swift had the same issue, it cost me more

than Rs2000, because they change the whole unit, even if you break the glass part alone.

Hello
Swift glass and its components are sold individually by maruti and the glass you mentioned costs less then Rs 500.

[renegade004]

Originally Posted by apachelongbow

Very easy to sit on a forum and blame some 'suits' as you put it. I am sure the suits wouldn't have wantonly ensured that they get their projections wrong to ensure some thousands of temporary labour are retrenched.

We are discussing two big world renowned brands here, I am sure they know what they are doing, and its certianly not some speculative lalagiri as you seem to make it to be.

And about the Nano please get your facts right. The Mba types didn't pitch the Nano as an alternative to a scooter or a one lakh car, Mr Ratan Tata is solely responsible for that emotional output and off the cuff pricing which permanently branded the car as a cheap bike upgrade.

With all due respect, sir, I don't think those occupying the middle and higher echelons of management at Tata Motors can be absolved of all responsibility for the way the Nano was marketed initially if Tata Motors is indeed the professionally run company it is made out to be, unlike a 'lala' company where the 'lala' makes all decisions and every one else simply says "Yes sir."

As for Renault-Nissan, such drastic measures would not have been called for if they had their fingers on the pulse of the market, so to say.

[apachelongbow]

Originally Posted by renegade004

With all due respect, sir, I don't think those occupying the middle and higher echelons of management at Tata Motors can be absolved of all responsibility for the way the Nano was marketed initially if Tata Motors is indeed the professionally run company it is made out to be, unlike a 'lala' company where the 'lala' makes all decisions and every one else simply says "Yes sir."

As for Renault-Nissan, such drastic measures would not have been called for if they had their fingers on the pulse of the market, so to say.

No issues sir, this is a forum and we can have differing views
However I still insist it is Mr. Tata himself who queered the pitch for the Nano. The price point was never revealed, its only Mr. Tata who became emotional when speaking with the press and spoke about the Rs 1 lac price point, he later tried to retract his statement and then decided that Tata will launch the Nano at Rs 1 lac no matter what, he quoted "a promise is a promise" if I remember correctly. This is what positioned the car as a cheap car instead of a smart car from the very beginning. Once your CEO/owner says or commits something I dare any employee to go against that decision no matter how foolish business wise it is. You can't blame the Tata management for the Nano debacle, its because of the stalwart himself.

Regarding Renault and Nissan it is premature to blame the management team for retrenching 3000 temporary employees. If sales are down employees get fired, period. Please look at how Infosys, Wipro and Tcs have kicked out thousands of middle level managers out on the pretext of poor appraisals.

[Rajeevraj]

Could not find a better thread to post this. Mods, please move if needed.

Renault India opens its 190th dealership in India in Telangana. This will bring Renault's total presence in Southern India to 52 sales and 37 Service outlets.

Renault's network increased from 14 sales and service facilities in mid-2011 to 190 sales outlets and 151 after sales outlets, currently.

Source: ETAuto

[sadsack]

Originally posted by Apachelongbow"Very easy to sit on a forum and blame some 'suits' as you put it. I am sure the suits wouldn't have wantonly ensured that they get their projections wrong to ensure some thousands of temporary labour are retrenched.

We are discussing two big world renowned brands here, I am sure they know what they are doing, and its certianly not some speculative lalagiri as you seem to make it to be.

And about the Nano please get your facts right. The Mba types didn't pitch the Nano as an alternative to a scooter or a one lakh car, Mr Ratan Tata is solely responsible for that emotional output and off the cuff pricing which permanently branded the car as a cheap bike upgrade."

There is a good point in what Apachelongbow is saying. It is very easy to sit at home in front of computer and produce words of wisdom blaming all and sundry for the problems that car makers or for that matter makers of any product face. Datsun's Vincent Cobee spoke about how difficult it is to get product planning and mix right in a country like India where the demographics and psychographics vary like in no other country.

Please it is time that people do their research properly before they make their posts, otherwise they just end up posting unsubstantiated nonsense which will be picked up by others and furthered. Vincent Cobee it was who said the only way one can explain that in the fastest growing economy in the world (faster than China) the benefits of acceleration are all cornered by the leading brand and how no other brand really gets a proper chance to show its capabilities. You can find the interview on Autocarpro.in.

Cobee also says that India is the market that depends on "word of mouth" publicity. Believe me when I bought a Kawasaki Bajaj KB 100 everybody told me that I will suffer. I didn't. It ran beautifully for 6 years and would have for more if I had not decided to go buy another brand. When I bought a Nano for my wife people were horrified. The car is now 7 years old and runs without the slightest of problems. I also had an Indica Vista which I had for 5 years before selling it and bought myself a Brio. People objected to the Vista saying that it will break down on a daily basis. Not once did it break down. I think people should stop manufacturing these urban legends on the hearsay of some idiot mechanic or an equally uneducated person.

I request forum members to realise the responsibility that comes with each of the posts we make and so please think about what you are saying, its source and the veracity of a claim. Otherwise please realise that you are inadvertently becoming a part of unethical statements which can have damaging repercussions for a person or a corporation.

[Aroy]

Originally Posted by sadsack

Originally posted by Apachelongbow[i]Very easy to sit on a forum and blame some 'suits' as you put it. I am sure the suits wouldn't have wantonly ensured that they get their projections wrong to ensure some thousands of temporary labour are retrenched.

........

I request forum members to realise the responsibility that comes with each of the posts we make and so please think about what you are saying, its source and the veracity of a claim. Otherwise please realise that you are inadvertently becoming a part of unethical statements which can have damaging repercussions for a person or a corporation.

All of us can propound views, which may or not be based of facts/experience, but ultimately companies measure success by profits, which is tied to sale numbers. What really is mysterious is the way foreign companies who want to manufacture and sell in India get their projections. It has often been stated in marketing journals that what works in your sphere of influence may not do so in a different market. Still we see market projections which are evidently stratospheric even to normal public here, based on the past experience of their current market. I think what various posters have been saying is that what is apparent to common sense seems to be lacking in market analysis/projections.

[RSR]

Renault India manage to prove naysayers wrong, and how!

I think this is the appropriate thread to post this news. Not even a year ago, we had this downsizing going on at Renault-Nissan, and people were expressing all sorts of doubts on the company's ability to even survive in the Indian market, let alone achieve their 5% marketshare (by end-2017) target.

And then, they pulled out their trump card - the Renault Kwid!

Not only did they prove all the doubting Thomases wrong, they have smashed their way into the top 5 car manufacturers list in India in March 2016 (going by domestic sales volume).

Not just that, they have almost achieved the 5% target they set for 2017 end in March 2016 itself. This means they've advanced the target date for the 5% marketshare, and are gunning for more!

"We have got 4.9 percent market share in March and have sold 12,400 units in the month," Rafael Treguer, vice president, sales and marketing, said on the sidelines of the launch here of a new variant of Duster.

...

"In January to March quarter, we acquired 4.1 percent share of Indian passenger car market. We aim to achieve five percent market share by end of 2016," he said.

That's a revision of the earlier target to reach five percent market share by the end of 2017.

The company had just a two percent market share in 2015, he said.

Read more here.

Well done, Renault India!