[ScorpMan]

Originally Posted by Mad Max

One thing is impressive though - Maruti's ability to setup 80+ Nexa showrooms in such a short span. Many other manufacturers have done far less in even double the time. Something that others can learn from this.

A majority of these 80+ Nexa's have been allotted to the existing dealers. Much easier than appointing a new dealer.

[invidious]

Originally Posted by McLaren Roxx

Your point being?

Without an actual NCAP rating available & a 1000 different ways in which an accident can occur,this would become an unending discussion.

Let's focus on stuff that we actually know or can test at the moment - like where is the official review anyways? It's been a while now!

I am merely stating an anecdote. I am not jumping the gun and calling the product safe or unsafe - though I do hope it is safe considering I have booked one.

[McLaren Rulez]

Given that the Baleno is on sale in European markets soon, does anyone know if there are going to be NCAP tests soon?

Even a Euro-NCAP test helps because one can compare the European Baleno vs the European Swift and get a reasonable idea of how the Indian version performs vs the Indian Swift.

[WRXXX]

Originally Posted by McLaren Rulez

Given that the Baleno is on sale in European markets soon, does anyone know if there are going to be NCAP tests soon?

Even a Euro-NCAP test helps because one can compare the European Baleno vs the European Swift and get a reasonable idea of how the Indian version performs vs the Indian Swift.

I am very sorry to say that such conclusions would be false.
European Swift got 5 star rating,
And left the Indian version at zero star.

We need to question the double standards Indian manufacturers employ for paying almost the same money for a less equipped versions and get very low safety rating as well. And our government as well. For collecting high taxes but not providing a good safety standards in India.

[dipen]

While there are no formal tests and similar, one needs to also understand that Maruti as a developer is not a cutting edge manufacturer. Its goal and model is to provide reliable and cost effective products with acceptable safety and luxury levels where acceptable is a very subjective thing from person to person.

There is a certain amount of physics that still applies to cars. Maruti's aim for lower kerb weight is to win every FE battle in India. A reduction of 150-200 kgs against the competition would surely provide it at least 10 % more ARAI numbers.

Lotus cars which is known for making low weight cars with D+ segment level power numbers despite all the weight reduction focus still weighs near 850-950 kgs across most its products. Maruti surely does not employ that kind of body panel and strength and rigidity quality in its mass market product. So there is surely some compromise. Do note the Lotus is much smaller in size as well.

Maruti talks about high tensile steel but the entire car is not made from that, only a certain fraction of the body, beam, chassis would comprise of the same. Maruti is talking about the same so that not too many people start questioning the safety and have provided full safety on all variants.

Talking about high tensile steel, Hyundai was actually among the first offer it in India in the Getz form. But it failed to even market it as no one cared at the time and the car departed progressively making way for the Swift to rule. Not sure if it even used any such steel in the I20s later. Guess not.

Also high tensile steel is a generic term without any certified grade. So its questionable. Unless Maruti whose aim to target 50% market share decides to go bold and publish safety results, its still a wait and watch like everyone is suggesting.

[Blacktop]

Originally Posted by Dr.Abhi

I was under the impression that maruti is targeting safety and quality concious customers through Nexa who are willing to pay. But selling structurally compromised cars like Baleno with so called more features for the sake of premiumness is too disgusting and very difficult to digest.

http://www.rushlane.com/maruti-suzuk...-12174220.html

Looks like it is really poor structurally. Maruti was never one to build structurally solid cars, flimsiness being their characteristic but this one seems to have hit a new low. A real unfortunate incident for a family out on a trip with the new car.

[autobahnjpr]

Look closely. That is not baleno but honda city.

The car in the link is baleno. Apologies. I just looked at the picture in one of earlier posts.

[Rohitj92]

Originally Posted by Blacktop

http://www.rushlane.com/maruti-suzuk...-12174220.html



Looks like it is really poor structurally. Maruti was never one to build structurally solid cars, flimsiness being their characteristic but this one seems to have hit a new low. A real unfortunate incident for a family out on a trip with the new car.

So, your point is, if the family was out in a Polo, they would have been safe ?

[Blacktop]

Originally Posted by Rohitj92

So, your point is, if the family was out in a Polo, they would have been safe ?

Thus begins another pointless debate on Polo vs Baleno, Punto vs Celerio, Euro car vs Asain car? NO.

The objective is not to figure out the safest car for the departed family. That would not be sensible. The crash image gives an idea of the kind of stuff that goes into the Baleno. Period. If you feel such stuff makes for a good enough car for you, then Cheerio! My point is the same as that of many other people in the forum: That the Baleno is a super-flimsy car for the price it sells at. It should have been more sturdy/solid. Yes, the Polo and Punto are far sturdier and better built but that is NOT the point.


Note to Mods: Please remove my earlier post. Somebody had already posted a link to the news report that I had missed out.

P.S: I have nothing against Maruti. I drive a Swift and an Esteem.

[searacer932]

Oh dear! That was a terrible strategy. May the family RIP.

MSIL have a very poor safety record in India. Didn't their L/V variants of Swift P/D not have poor braking capability and that point was superbly picked up in Team BHP review. And I also believe their Alto and Swift performed poorly in the safety testing. Mr. Bhargava also made a comment, which was poor in taste, about safety.

So, knowing MSIL record on safety and also their attitude to safety the 'safer' assumption to make would be a pessimistic one and think that the Baleno may not be a safe car rather than making an optimistic assumption and thinking it's a safe car.

I do wish that MSIL have not compromised anything on braking or even on the structural aspects but I am not so sure considering their previous 'premium' car i.e Swift performed so miserably in safety parameters!

[WRXXX]

Originally Posted by Blacktop

Thus begins another pointless debate on Polo vs Baleno, Punto vs Celerio, Euro car vs Asain car? NO.

The objective is not to figure out the safest car for the departed family. That would not be sensible. The crash image gives an idea of the kind of stuff that goes into the Baleno. Period. If you feel such stuff makes for a good enough car for you, then Cheerio! My point is the same as that of many other people in the forum: That the Baleno is a super-flimsy car for the price it sells at. It should have been more sturdy/solid. Yes, the Polo and Punto are far sturdier and better built but that is NOT the point.


Note to Mods: Please remove my earlier post. Somebody had already posted a link to the news report that I had missed out.

P.S: I have nothing against Maruti. I drive a Swift and an Esteem.

I am sorry, yet another point to make it pointless. Previous comment was trying to say you wouldn't know what would have happened to POLO or Punto or S-class if a similar crash happens. And looking at a crashed and smashed vehicle alone you can't judge how the car is built, it also depends on how bad was the crash that caused this mangling. While it does say something if the cars of different manufacturers are subject to same crash and that's what crash tests do. But we all know real world is different. Don't get me wrong I am not campaigning for Maruti or anyone here, I am trying to be objective. I can show many images from the net with expensive cars going through similar fate if it was a serious crash involving heavy vehicles.

Most importantly if anyone would be saved in other vehicles or Baleno if the occupants didn't even wear things like seat belts if the car rolled over multiple times. I agree if structure collapsed much before then seat belts or airbags don't help.

Actually fresh out of showroom a Ford escort in 90s being turned into a metal ball after colliding with a truck is still fresh in my mind. So in India most of the manufacturers try to push unsafe vehicles in to the market just by economics. Because safe vehicles are hard to build and costs money. Why worry when you can do with less? Now how many of us are willing to wait till safety norms arrive in the country to book a car ???

Indian roads are hazardous. if anything that saves you here before any safety equipment is alertness and experience and then comes the unfortunate situation of facing the crash and hope your 5 star rated car protects your family, that is after you have convinced the family to buckle up that is. Not wearing seat belt or helmet strap is the common violation throughout the country.

[Rajeevraj]

Originally Posted by Blacktop

Looks like it is really poor structurally. Maruti was never one to build structurally solid cars, flimsiness being their characteristic but this one seems to have hit a new low. A real unfortunate incident for a family out on a trip with the new car.

Originally Posted by WRXXX

And looking at a crashed and smashed vehicle alone you can't judge how the car is built, it also depends on how bad was the crash that caused this mangling. While it does say something if the cars of different manufacturers are subject to same crash and that's what crash tests do. .

There are some posts discussing this in the 'Accidents Thread'

http://www.team-bhp.com/forum/street...ml#post3852238

One key point is that the state of the car (which is like a crumpled ball) is potentially due to the fact that it had to be cut open to extract the victims.

I don't think there is sufficient information available to gauge the severity of the accident itself and whose all fault it was to what extent (The truck, the car, the drivers).

Not trying to defend the car or its structure. Just calling out the fact that the car would not have ended up like this just due to impact.

[AtheK]

On this entire safety note, could it be wrong to think that Maruti has given all these security features right from the base variant, not because they wanted to bring in a revolution, but because of the fact that it is a necessity to counter the other cost cutting/achieving high FE measures put in place.

[WRXXX]

Originally Posted by AtheK

On this entire safety note, could it be wrong to think that Maruti has given all these security features right from the base variant, not because they wanted to bring in a revolution, but because of the fact that it is a necessity to counter the other cost cutting/achieving high FE measures put in place.

I don't know. But a fair assumption is NCAP ratings previously were derived from selecting the base most variant of the car for test. I think that's the reason. And that's one of the reason apart from a lesser cost cutting POLo would have gotten better rating as even base model had safety gear.

[hershlulla]

Asked the durability and reliability question today at a Nexa dealership, and how the vehicle is so light if it is in fact larger than a Swift. Reason given was owing to a 'new design chassis'. Don't see how that alone can shave off 100+ kg. The large gap between front bumper and engine on the inside is also a bit unnerving. Easy for cats and small dogs to climb into if you live in a residential area with strays. Thought to consider, perhaps?