[DriveOnceMore]

Originally Posted by MetalBuff

Fellas, a contrasting view is always appreciated so,a from my end.

The above opinions do make sense but, for a person like myself who sold his current ride and thought that the Baleno is the next car for him, is a difficult state to be in? Why? I just can't go with my eyes blind folded into a purchase with the hope that MSIL has made a better car (with increased tensile strength) only to realize later (when the test results are published) that it isn't the case!

We see what we believe in, right? If the Grande i10, scored a zero so, did the Swift! And to me, both of them feel more or less at par. The Grande i10 maybe better by a whisker but, not enough for it to score a better score. If the better feeling ones score dismally in the tests, I have my doubts about how the fragile feeling ones would

Cheerio,
-Shivang Gandotra

You view makes sense but take into the account that India made Baleno will be sold in 100 countries including Japan - the hometown of the brand.
It also will land in the European market.
I agree that there will be differences in export-spec car and India spec one. Those differences might be on features or on gadgetry front like ESP etc. but structure wise I am very sure that all the cars will be same.

Considering the fun factor offered by Swift I think this lighter Baleno will surely have a lot more to offer.

[WRXXX]

Originally Posted by Motard_Blr

Baleno is the most expensive car compared to the i20 and the Jazz especially when it is the least safe of the three. How can Maruti charge 16% more per kg than the i20?!

.

This is now turning into comedy
Just the same way as all those carbon fiber cars can charge Crores??

[abhik897]

Originally Posted by MetalBuff

Sure its a features galore but, the build quality is definitely something a lot of people will not take kindly to, for the reason that it feels way too light. If people think of other Marutis as tin boxes, then be prepared to get shell shocked with the Baleno. It's like MS raised the game in the tin car category. Please note that I am not getting into the debate of how strong it actually is but, it does feel very very light and that dwindles the confidence that one places in a product by a significant amount.

All one needs to do is open the hood and gently knock on each component in there. That should give an idea of what certain people in here including me are talking about.



Agreed! Even more so on the Alpha minus models that have the projectors missing.



If only the underbody has been tweaked for weight reduction, I would assume the rest of the car to remain largely untouched but, the current difference is immediately apparent. Certainly, there's a lot more to this than meets the eye!





On another note, I think MS just laid the foundation for what will happen when Airbags are made standard. Provide safety equipment and lighten the build quality to the point that it feels unstable. The customer is stll the one to lose either way!

What really is surprising is that NO and I mean NO reviewer who had access to the car at the time of media drives has complained how about light the car feels a when a lot of us realized the same within moments of feeling the car. In fact, dug up and re-read some reviews which mention a solid body feel .


More will unfold when the official review comes up as that is more trusted than a bunch of bhpians endlessly lamenting about something. And rightly so!


P.S. - Before flaming me, please bear in mind that we (my family) have owned only Maruti vehicles so far. Also for an even and fair debate, it is absolutely imperative that the car has been checked out in person, me thinks!

Cheerio,
-Shivang Gandotra

I second shivang on the point that none of the reviews available in all forms today on the Baleno has pointed out that the build quality is compromised in any form. However , one thing which was consistent in all reviews was that the ride quality and handling is good in spite of the lighter build.

[vinit.merchant]

Originally Posted by MetalBuff

Fellas, a contrasting view is always appreciated so,a from my end.

The above opinions do make sense but, for a person like myself who sold his current ride and thought that the Baleno is the next car for him, is a difficult state to be in? Why? I just can't go with my eyes blind folded into a purchase with the hope that MSIL has made a better car (with increased tensile strength) only to realize later (when the test results are published) that it isn't the case!

Cheerio,
-Shivang Gandotra

You would be better off to wait for the team-bhp official review of Baleno. It wont have any indications of how safe the car is, but should cover almost all quality issues. Personally, I feel the life of a modern car is not more than 10 years.

Also keep in mind the following

These are new launches and Suzuki would not want them to sell only for 2-3 years by when the new crash test rules will start applying to old cars. So these must have been designed keeping those in mind (Since Maruti is not an NGO, they would always plan long term)

[WRXXX]

Originally Posted by vinit.merchant

You would be better off to wait for the team-bhp official review of Baleno. It wont have any indications of how safe the car is, but should cover almost all quality issues. Personally, I feel the life of a modern car is not more than 10 years.

I think for all those of us who are unsure of Baleno's integrity/crash worthiness we have to wait till a Crash test is done for Made "for" India Baleno, there is absolutely no other way. For everyone else it is about either jump in and try OR wait for an year and hear from others and buy. In fact we are blessed to have a forums like these that uplifts ones understanding of various aspects of the new cars in an instant. But for those who absolutely in need of cars immediately any new car would be a gamble IMHO.

[kpzen]

Originally Posted by MetalBuff

True story! But, when the quality seems to go down a level lower, it hurts, haha. If a current Maruti product owner feels the difference, must mean something

Cheerio,
-Shivang Gandotra

Dear Shivang,

Would you accept the new Baleno with Esteem/Zen kind of interiors and features ?
Would you accept german build quality and top of the line features in Baleno with a price tag of 12lacs ?

"They don't make cars as they used to "

Hence, no point comparing the new cars with your old car. You won't get anywhere.
I bought the Getz CRDi 110bhp diesel in 2008 for 5.8 lacs on road, its still fast enough and doesn't rattle. Now if I start comparing while buying a car I would have to buy something that's 2 times expensive than the Getz.

MSIL has done their homework well, and in this industry they are second to none when it comes to parts costing. Ciaz projector headlamps cost is less than 5k, Swift MAF sensor costs only 3k, Hyundai MAF sensor is north of 12k, German cars with bottle crushing build quality would most likely be more than 20k.
Buying a car in India is easier than owning one.

Hyundai's build quality is much better than MSIL cars and they are definitely the best of both worlds.
Also, to my knowledge, Hyundai has a great advantage of having the engine source(read KIA) within their family which may be having a good impact on final pricing of the product.
You win some, You lose some.
No car is perfect out there.

[invidious]

I face a bit of a conundrum now.

I've been offered the top spec Xcent AT for 8.25 OTR Bombay registration. The top spec manual Baleno is working out to 8.37 OTR Bombay Registration. So now - it is a bit of a quandary. The car is for my Dad. I am thoroughly at a loss on which to to choose. Exchange price for my old Swift - is working out to be

1. 1.20 L according to Hyundai - hence OTR Price for Hyundai AT Option Pack is a 7.05
2. 1.40 L according to Suzuki - hence final OTR Petrol Baleno Alpha is 6.97
3. 1.40 L according to Suzuli - hence final ORT Petrol Delta CVT is 6.61
So which to choose?

[sourabhzen]

Originally Posted by invidious

I face a bit of a conundrum now.

I've been offered the top spec Xcent AT for 8.25 OTR Bombay registration. The top spec manual Baleno is working out to 8.37 OTR Bombay Registration. So now - it is a bit of a quandary. The car is for my Dad. I am thoroughly at a loss on which to to choose. Exchange price for my old Swift - is working out to be

1. 1.20 L according to Hyundai - hence OTR Price for Hyundai AT Option Pack is a 7.05
2. 1.40 L according to Suzuki - hence final OTR Petrol Baleno Alpha is 6.97
3. 1.40 L according to Suzuli - hence final ORT Petrol Delta CVT is 6.61
So which to choose?

The difference is not significant. You should choose whatever your heart says and whatever impresses you most after the test drives.

[MetalBuff]

Originally Posted by DriveOnceMore

You view makes sense but take into the account that India made Baleno will be sold in 100 countries including Japan - the hometown of the brand.
It also will land in the European market.
I agree that there will be differences in export-spec car and India spec one. Those differences might be on features or on gadgetry front like ESP etc. but structure wise I am very sure that all the cars will be same.

Considering the fun factor offered by Swift I think this lighter Baleno will surely have a lot more to offer.

As much as I would want to believe this, I'll be pragmatic and say that it is unlikely that the Indian Swift has the same body shell as the ones that's retailed in the export markets. It is definitely watered down and the crash test results for the Indian Swift confirmed that. And honestly, for all what the Baleno is worth, there's absolutely no reason Maruti will make the same export quality shell available for the Indian consumers.

I agree totally on the fun to drive factor and that's a given as the mechanicals are from the Swift with a 100 kgs knocked off! That was one of the reasons why Baleno was right there at the top for me even when the prices weren't out.

Originally Posted by invidious

I face a bit of a conundrum now.

I've been offered the top spec Xcent AT for 8.25 OTR Bombay registration. The top spec manual Baleno is working out to 8.37 OTR Bombay Registration. So now - it is a bit of a quandary. The car is for my Dad. I am thoroughly at a loss on which to to choose. Exchange price for my old Swift - is working out to be

And here we go! Absolutely same jam for me and my parents ever since the prices for the Baleno were announced. Welcome to the party

Originally Posted by kpzen

Dear Shivang,

Would you accept the new Baleno with Esteem/Zen kind of interiors and features ?

Would you accept german build quality and top of the line features in Baleno with a price tag of 12lacs ?

"They don't make cars as they used to "

Hence, no point comparing the new cars with your old car. You won't get anywhere.

You win some, You lose some.

No car is perfect out there.

Sigh! Who are you, my man? Those questions have really shut me up and it is going to be a tough task finding answers to those! Sure, you have knocked some sense but, the baffled feeling will take a while to settle, phew!

Thanks a bunch for that short yet effective post! Will I still buy a Baleno or will I stretch my stretched budget even further and buy a Jazz..Only time will tell.

Cheerio,
-Shivang Gandotra

[hybridpetrol]

Digressing (from the current safety topic) a bit from here:
Looks like, feature-wise, Baleno Zeta, is comparable to Swift Zxi.
Prices: Swift - 6.24L, of course discounts will be there. Baleno - 6.31L. Both ex-showroom Delhi.

What do we get in Swift Zxi in addition?
2 tweeters in addition to 4 speakers, Rear fog lamp - these are missing in Baleno.
The additions in Baleno Zeta?
Telescopic Steering wheel, Rear parking sensors, Auto IRVM, Driver Armrest with Storage, Leathers in Steering wheel & Gear knob, 60:40 Split Rear seat, Cup holders in the rear, Chrome door handles, Auto headlamps, follow me home feature, and some more.

Assuming Discounts will be available for the Swift, I wanted to compare Baleno Delta (priced 5.71L) with Swift Zxi.
What do we get in Swift Zxi in addition?
Start/Stop Button, 2 tweeters in addition to 4 speakers, Front & Rear fog lamp, MFD - these are missing in Baleno Delta.
The additions in Baleno Delta?
Rear parking sensors, 60:40 Split Rear seat, Cup holders in the rear - Apart from this, Baleno is more or less same to Delta by features.

This is only feature-wise.
What Baleno gives in comparison to Swift in general?
A contemporary fresh-looking big hatchback with a large boot. Will attract looks, and give you some bragging rights on owning one, unlike Swift which everyone owns.
Points in favour of Swift?
Time tested vehicle, with great looks. Available easily. (No long wait-lists, and lot of sales points). Dealer level discounts and freebies will be available.

Just my opinion - If I were in market, though Baleno is weighing lesser, I would still choose Baleno Zeta over Swift Zxi, though would be pricier in comparison to the Swift at discount, due to the bigger car feel with newer features. There is no study till date (or I do not know that yet) comparing the accident data and the weight of the car.

[shibujp]

The co-relation between weight and safety is a concept ditched long back.

The current generation Swift was 51% stiffer than the old one without any increase in weight. Protecting the passenger cabin is what car maker's focus on. A Formula 1 driver walks away from a 250 kph shunt in a car that weights less than 650 kgs. Toyota's are light and never known for their stiffness - but next to indestructible and command insane resale prices.

The Baleno's promotional videos show how the body is constructed with steel of different tensile strengths used in different parts of the body so as to channel an impact away from the passenger structure. Even taking this at 50% face value it should be an indication on how safety has been a consideration.

What is important is that they have provided a product with incredible value that raises the bar. Important because as customers we stand to gain as other manufacturers strive to match or better it.

Drive on,
Shibu.

[MetalBuff]

Originally Posted by shibujp

The co-relation between weight and safety is a concept ditched long back.

The current generation Swift was 51% stiffer than the old one without any increase in weight. Protecting the passenger cabin is what car maker's focus on. A Formula 1 driver walks away from a 250 kph shunt in a car that weights less than 650 kgs. Toyota's are light and never known for their stiffness - but next to indestructible and command insane resale prices.

The Baleno's promotional videos show how the body is constructed with steel of different tensile strengths used in different parts of the body so as to channel an impact away from the passenger structure. Even taking this at 50% face value it should be an indication on how safety has been a consideration.

What is important is that they have provided a product with incredible value that raises the bar. Important because as customers we stand to gain as other manufacturers strive to match or better it.

Drive on,
Shibu.

Hey Shibu,

What you mentioned indeed makes sense. Like someone already posted before, MSIL is not an NGO and is here with the sole purpose of minting money so, let's not forget that. Additionally, the F-1 cars do place priority on saving a driver's life in an event of a collision. Maybe MSIL has suddenly woken up from a deep slumber and have started caring about lives but, that will take a while for the trust factor to be reinstated.

Moreo, with no stats available at our disposal, we are bound to pull out past instances(the Swift crash tests). The MSIL cars (in addition to others) failed miserably in those. Had there been an implied focus on ensuring occupants safety, the same cars would have fared decently in those situations. A zero!!! That's too much!

May I request you to please post a link to the Baleno's construction video for the benefit for all of us? Hope that helps us in a way.

I understand that I might get perceived as being a bit difficult but, the situation that a couple of us are in at the moment, I think that's a given. And who ever said, car shopping was an easy task !

Boy, do I love this forum or what? Pour in, fellas!

Cheerio,
-Shivang Gandotra

[carwatcher]

Hats off to your misplaced over-confidence.

You will be surprised (though I seriously wish to be proven wrong) when the more info starts coming out after sometime.

FYI not only Maruti, it is a well known fact that Hyundai and other manufacturers did compromised on structural integrity on India specific models of exactly the same car.

We can ONLY seriously hope or pray that this time Maruti hasn't done that for they are not NGOs.

At the same time we had a thread not very long ago dissecting in detail the statements made by its Chairman RC Bhargava, while the ABS, Airbags and other safety concerns seem to be taken care of, only the stuctural integrity part remains to be proven. At the same time, I realistically think no one should expect an overnight development compared to Swifts and Dzires at lower/similar price point.

Originally Posted by DriveOnceMore

structure wise I am very sure that all the cars will be same.

[Jeevith]

Originally Posted by dZired

This pricing has indeed made the Baleno a lucrative product. The Delta variant, with its loaded feature list, is the most VFM trim IMO. I just wish Maruti provides the projector headlamps as an optional extra.

They do actually. So I visited NEXA before the 26th of this month (i.e. Baleno launch date). He offered to have the Zeta S-Cross with the projector headlamps (otherwise available only on the Alpha). He didn't give a price though.

So later (after the Baleno launched), I asked if I could get the same option on the Baleno. To which he said he would check. But yea, if they're willing to do it on the S-Cross, why not the Baleno. All you have to do is ask I guess!

[romeomidhun]

Nexa guy confirms that the enquirers for the SCross have increased multi-fold once the Baleno came to the showroom. Whoever is coming to see the Baleno are checking SCross as well. He didn't give any data whether SCross bookings are going up/down because of Baleno.