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Old 30th May 2018, 15:45   #121
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Default Re: Car caught testing

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Originally Posted by emkay.india View Post
Hi Mods,

Found this car doing a (speed?) test in Chennai and managed few pics from my mobile, during a congestion, before he flew off.

Thanks.
Looks like a camouflaged version of the Black Swift going next to it.

Seriously don't understand how this will compete with the likes of Brezza and Ecosport.
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Old 1st June 2018, 13:53   #122
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Default re: The Mahindra XUV300, aka Ssangyong Tivoli. Edit: Launched @ 7.9 lakhs

Thanks to a Team-BHP Fan (who prefers to stay anonymous) for sharing his first impressions of the car. Heartfelt gratitude for sharing it with other enthusiasts via this Team-BHP page!

Quote:
A preview was organized by Mahindra’s authorized representatives to review their upcoming Compact SUV and I was invited to review it as a part of their market study before the launch of the final product. The entry was restricted only to a certain group of car owners & prospective buyers of compact SUVs. They had asked me to carry the original RC card of my car to validate my entry.

4 cars were displayed – Hyundai Creta, Mahindra’s Compact SUV, Maruti Vitara Brezza & the Ford EcoSport. The badges were covered and we referred to them using alphabets instead of the brand and model for the review. I was asked to review the car based on the Exterior, Interior and Features followed by a drive. The following are my first impressions of Mahindra's Compact SUV:

Exterior:

Front:
• The grill is like the current-gen XUV500.
• The front bumper and bonnet look like the Euro-spec SsangYong Tivoli. The test drive car was equipped with front parking sensors.
• The LED DRLs are very distinctive; it’s a two-piece unit extended from the headlamp till the front bumper (eyebrow with sidelock).
• The headlamps are integrated very well and have the usual elements (projector unit for low-beam and reflector for high-beam).

Side:
• The side profile cuts and creases are like the Tivoli with pronounced wheel arches (barring the rear-end).
• The car was equipped with new 17-inch diamond cut alloy wheels which were gelling with the side profile well.
• The C pillar is very thick and there is no quarter-glass.
• One can easily say it is a sub-4 meter SUV from the side.

Rear:
• The rear design is completely different from the Tivoli and looks fresh.
• The tail-lamps are futuristic and look very impressive with the LED elements (again, this design is completely new).
• The exterior proportions are spot-on. The overall styling and design are attractive and impressive, and the styling is not overdone (unlike any other Mahindra Car on the road).

Interior:
• Ingress and egress to both front and back seats are easy.
• The space and lumbar support are comparable to the Vitara Brezza.
• The front and side visibility from the driver's seat is good.
• The IRVM is an ECM unit and visibility is limited due to the small rear glass and thick C pillars.
• The review car was equipped with leather seats, push-button engine start / keyless entry, sunroof & 7 airbags (including knee, side & curtain airbags!!!).
• Interiors are made up of hard plastics, but the plastic quality is better than the Vitara Brezza.
• There is enough storage available to store water bottles and other knick-knacks in all the doors.
• There were too many buttons (chrome-tipped) on the center console; they were small and a little confusing to use.
• Twin-pod instrument cluster was clear and easy to read with an MID in the middle. The MID displays the angle of the steering wheel in ignition mode.
• The steering mounted controls and window switches felt premium.

The Drive:

The performance from the 1.5L diesel engine is good. This mill was producing 113 BHP, but I don’t remember the torque and rpm figures.

One will hear the usual diesel clatter from the outside but once you’re inside the cabin, the insulation is very good.

You get that "pushed into the seat" feel and the surge of power in the turbo range.

The drive was limited to 1.5 km and I could only judge the handling based on the short drive.

The suspension is soft and absorbs all the bumps.

Both the test car and display car were equipped with disc brakes on all four wheels. The brakes are progressive.

According to me, the product will be launched in a couple of months down the line.
The Mahindra XUV300, aka Ssangyong Tivoli. Edit: Launched @ 7.9 lakhs-rear-large.jpg

Last edited by GTO : 2nd June 2018 at 11:30.
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Old 1st June 2018, 14:27   #123
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Default re: The Mahindra XUV300, aka Ssangyong Tivoli. Edit: Launched @ 7.9 lakhs

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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Thanks to a Team-BHP Fan (who prefers to stay anonymous) for sharing his first impressions of the car. Heartfelt gratitude for sharing it with other enthusiasts via this Team-BHP page!


How long has it been since we first got a glimpse of this vehicle?? 3yrs, 4 yrs???? The final product better be worth this wait. Aside --- if it is likely to be launched in a couple of months, why ask for such a review by select prospective customers?? It's not like you can change anything now!!

Last edited by Samurai : 3rd June 2018 at 15:41. Reason: named removed
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Old 1st June 2018, 14:39   #124
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Default re: The Mahindra XUV300, aka Ssangyong Tivoli. Edit: Launched @ 7.9 lakhs

So there will be only one flavor of Tivoli(sub-4m) on offer ? Initial rumors talked about a 7 seater as well, but i assume the upcoming MPV will cater to those who are looking for additional seats.

I have a question to the spotter on the space inside, seating and the boot. Creta, Brezza have comparable rear seating while Creta also has 400ltr boot space. Ecospace is somewhere in between. Any observations ?

Last edited by Samurai : 3rd June 2018 at 15:42. Reason: name removed
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Old 1st June 2018, 14:51   #125
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Default re: The Mahindra XUV300, aka Ssangyong Tivoli. Edit: Launched @ 7.9 lakhs

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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Thanks to a Team-BHP Fan (who prefers to stay anonymous) for sharing his first impressions of the car. Heartfelt gratitude for sharing it with other enthusiasts via this Team-BHP page!
Any idea about the petrol engine's specs? Heard it will be a 1.2L turbo-charged engine.

Last edited by Samurai : 3rd June 2018 at 15:41. Reason: name removed
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Old 1st June 2018, 15:27   #126
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Default re: The Mahindra XUV300, aka Ssangyong Tivoli. Edit: Launched @ 7.9 lakhs

1.5L engine producing 113 BHP would make this a nice little power house. Assuming that it might weigh in the 1.3T range, then we are talking about a PE ratio of 87 BHP/T, which is much higher than the Nexon & WRV (both of which are at 84 BHP/T).

That said, what will really make a difference is the torque delivery. If its linear and well spread out, this will be a good car for city as well as highway drives. If this come mated to a 6 speed transmission like the nexon, then it really will make it a nice little mile muncher.
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Old 2nd June 2018, 00:22   #127
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Default re: The Mahindra XUV300, aka Ssangyong Tivoli. Edit: Launched @ 7.9 lakhs

Finally, they decided to launch.

It's been really long since they confused and sitting on it. Part of the reasons could be that took away their time in trying to fix up dead man Xylo in new avatar as Nuvo Sport. Too bad that their KUV really did not charm their targeted consumer segment (young crowds in mid 20s to early 30s). Seems they have realized not to spend more time in fixing up the deep buried KUV 100.

People accuse M&M on trying to launch old stuff here, I would like to remind them of Duster, which is a well-known, low cost Dacia platform in Europe. For handful of 100's this fact may be known. For the rest, the features & cost bracket will really make it worth to choose. I am sure this vehicle would really stand out in build quality compared to the TUV 300 & KUV 100.

Every vehicle has some or the other characteristic issue, Nexon is still atop of tall chassis, seeming, like someone forgot to press down the body completely from top, just in my opinion and I heard many saying the same. Same way, Brezza, only for the looks. Build quality is still poor for that prize bracket. EcoSport is different but is lengthier than Figo, Tall & Wide may be giving that feel in the road. Again, feeling need to be noted here. SUV's core character wiped out in creatively engineering this vehicle for looks. It's well known fact that Ford is tapping the SUV'sh boom with FWD. Reason they did that is their lowest SUV line-up “Escape” could not be really stripped of features to bring down on cost. Result is to have the SUV chassis but aggregates are from hatchback design (Engine, Trans-axle) and that’s where this new platform born.

When we are proud of using run-off-the mill products from Japan, Korea & Europe, why not give a chance to one of our own? People do expect quality for the money they pay. Absolutely, M&M learned a lesson on KUV. This time, I am glad there are positive points in this initial impressions. Let’s see if they are going to make a meaningful sales & marketing and service for this one. I wish them luck!
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Old 2nd June 2018, 11:00   #128
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Default re: The Mahindra XUV300, aka Ssangyong Tivoli. Edit: Launched @ 7.9 lakhs

Why didn't they display tata nexon along with other vehicles for comparison. As of now it is a hot selling product giving ford ecosport a tough competition.
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Old 2nd June 2018, 13:51   #129
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Default re: The Mahindra XUV300, aka Ssangyong Tivoli. Edit: Launched @ 7.9 lakhs

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When we are proud of using run-off-the mill products from Japan, Korea & Europe, why not give a chance to one of our own?
1. Its run-OF-the-mill, not run off.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Run-of-the-mill

2. The Tivoli IS a run-of-the-mill product from Korea. One that didn't make the cut against the Hyundais or Kias.

Not exactly one of our own, then.

According to Wiki, the only recognition it has received is also a rather questionable one. In Belgium, of all places:

"The Tivoli was chosen as the 2016 Family Car of the Year by VAB, the largest automobile association in Belgium, despite SsangYong being a relatively unknown brand selling only 619 cars in Belgium throughout 2014, representing a market share of 0.13%".


Its a vehicle that does not even find a mention in the international market. Of course here it will be called "based on the Tivoli, which is a bestselling vehicle in the international market", and "Family Car of the Year - Belgium" and people will buy it based on that hype.

After all we have bought many tens of thousands of this old Ssangyong, and continue to buy them even today:



In many respects this vehicle is not very different from the Sonalika Rhino, which was a chinese body shell with an 'Indian' powertrain that was heavily based on an old import.

Last edited by Steeroid : 2nd June 2018 at 14:04.
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Old 2nd June 2018, 14:08   #130
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Default re: The Mahindra XUV300, aka Ssangyong Tivoli. Edit: Launched @ 7.9 lakhs

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Originally Posted by Steeroid View Post
and people will buy it based on that hype.
Assuming the average Indian buyer extremely naive, are we? I do not have data to back this up but I'd assume an average 10 lac rupee car buyer to be fairly well informed to not buy into 'international origin' product marketing campaigns. An extremely smooth sales executive may manage to close a deal on this pitch but I am pretty sure that would be an extremely rare occurrence.
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Old 2nd June 2018, 14:12   #131
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Default re: The Mahindra XUV300, aka Ssangyong Tivoli. Edit: Launched @ 7.9 lakhs

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Originally Posted by manson View Post
Assuming the average Indian buyer extremely naive, are we?
WE aren't. I am.

And by your own admission, you're assuming to the contrary too. So we're even.

Its a market that can get easily carried away by hype of most kinds. More than an assumption, it is a considered opinion from having watched the market for a reasonably long period.

Last edited by Steeroid : 2nd June 2018 at 14:19.
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Old 2nd June 2018, 14:18   #132
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Default re: The Mahindra XUV300, aka Ssangyong Tivoli. Edit: Launched @ 7.9 lakhs

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Originally Posted by Steeroid View Post
Its a market that can get easily carried away by hype of most kinds.
Any recent car model that you remember selling in significant numbers based on unjustified hype? IMHO, the current market with its access to information is highly empowered to buy into any unjustified hooplah.
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Old 3rd June 2018, 10:15   #133
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Default re: The Mahindra XUV300, aka Ssangyong Tivoli. Edit: Launched @ 7.9 lakhs

I would tend to agree with manson. The Indian buyer - specially in the mid-range price segment - has very well-developed VFM antennae, and is unlikely to be swayed by hype. A recent example was the Renault Kaptur/Capture, which was a text-book example of a DOA launch - thanks partly to the sharp observations of readers here, who wasted no time in tearing it to shreds for the grossly misleading ad. it was launched with!
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Old 3rd June 2018, 12:34   #134
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Default re: The Mahindra XUV300, aka Ssangyong Tivoli. Edit: Launched @ 7.9 lakhs

113 HP at 12-15 l with a meaty torque figure is something I do look forward to... Given a not so weird exterior and a a good interior may make the Tivoli a hot seller. Add to the top end the 7 airbags and the safety kit, it will make a good potential to replacing aeging premium hatchbacks.
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Old 4th June 2018, 00:26   #135
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Default re: The Mahindra XUV300, aka Ssangyong Tivoli. Edit: Launched @ 7.9 lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steeroid View Post
1. Its run-OF-the-mill, not run off.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Run-of-the-mill
Thanks for the correction

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steeroid View Post

2. The Tivoli IS a run-of-the-mill product from Korea. One that didn't make the cut against the Hyundais or Kias.

Not exactly one of our own, then.
IMHO, (1) M&M has been evaluating different types of powertrain for this vehicle. Not bringing the same what it has from SsangYong. (2) They are trying to evaluate and plonk a TGDI engine rather than simply putting another mHawk derived Diesel unit. Rest of the changes can be ignored under cosmetics.

TGDI engine is totally new from scratch. How many OEMs in India, other than TATA, who is doing specific engine for India? I think & believe these efforts certainly call for a support from the market. It's not easy to fine tune a vehicle with all road loads & vibrations etc. That's where M&M is believing this platform would give them a good break. In these perspectives, this is not simply a plug & play or detuned powertrain for India. I would definitely consider, success or failure of this one is on Mahindra India!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steeroid View Post
According to Wiki, the only recognition it has received is also a rather questionable one. In Belgium, of all places:

"The Tivoli was chosen as the 2016 Family Car of the Year by VAB, the largest automobile association in Belgium, despite SsangYong being a relatively unknown brand selling only 619 cars in Belgium throughout 2014, representing a market share of 0.13%".

Its a vehicle that does not even find a mention in the international market. Of course here it will be called "based on the Tivoli, which is a bestselling vehicle in the international market", and "Family Car of the Year - Belgium" and people will buy it based on that hype.

After all we have bought many tens of thousands of this old Ssangyong, and continue to buy them even today:
SsangYong is little, very little known brand, it does not mean that the vehicles they make are so bad. On the contrary, well known brands & vehicles failed miserably in the market due to various reasons. Why current generation Ford Figo failed to take off in India while the previous one at least had some decent numbers in it's own right. My thought is not to judge the car by merely their numbers & presence in International markets. Why GM failed in India? There're always of Tons of reasons that could go wrong in Automotive world even though a great car has been made!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steeroid View Post
In many respects this vehicle is not very different from the Sonalika Rhino, which was a chinese body shell with an 'Indian' powertrain that was heavily based on an old import.
I beg to differ and we can agree to disagree here. It downright unfair & injustice to the engineering & development efforts.

First of all, Korean highways demand at least meaningful structure & compliant vehicles where 100 kmph is the max limit and 50 kmph is minimum other than urban & rural areas. The fact that SsangYong is selling & being there in the market makes the vehicle worthwhile to customize for India. Talking about powertrain, M&M is pushing real hard to improve their prowess, these are behind the screen things which generally we do not mind or appreciate. Korean cars far better than Chinese.
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