[Amartya]

Originally Posted by msk_kapoor

I am really confused when lots of people refer to design proportions. As a mechanical engineer, when i say proportions i always refer to some baseline design guidelines to say a car is out of proportion. Can you folks enlighten me of where you come to the conclusion that cars are out of proportion? What is it you guys are checking this with.

If this is your personal thoughts please excuse me, but please refrain from using terms like proportions where quantitative reference takes precedence and this might confuse newbies.
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On the contrary, I would say that Mechanical Engineers cannot usurp the term "proportions". Styling or beauty is inherently visceral and subjective, but there's a ton of research (I've listed just 2 such papers below if you are interested) that shows that human beings have an innate sense of symmetry and proportions. If we made a car that was wider than it was longer, would you be okay with us saying that the proportions were odd?

Mahindra's design tend to be polarizing on an automobile enthusiast's forum, but most end up selling by the bucketloads. It's just that the Quanto was an odd beast from the beginning, and this refresh hasn't done anything to stymie those criticisms that were rooted in the car's styling.

References
(1) Innate and learned components of human visual preference: Rentschler et. al
(2) The neural basis for shape preferences: Amir et al.

[shashanka]

Originally Posted by msk_kapoor

I always thought that the WheelBase to TrackWidth depends on the usage and for the intended purpose of the vehicle. Can you let me know how the WB to TW is totally skewed in Nuvosport? This is just for my learning purpose as a curious person.
I am really confused when lots of people refer to design proportions. As a mechanical engineer, when i say proportions i always refer to some baseline design guidelines to say a car is out of proportion. Can you folks enlighten me of where you come to the conclusion that cars are out of proportion? What is it you guys are checking this with.
If this is your personal thoughts please excuse me, but please refrain from using terms like proportions where quantitative reference takes precedence and this might confuse newbies. But when it comes to subjective things like design,names and colours we can go all over the place
And personally i dont like Nuvosport design from pictures (I own KUV100 and love that design and am a fan of Mahindra designs in general). But unless i see this car in person i cannot comment on the car for sure. Will visit the showroom soon to see whether this is getting displayed.

Just so, msk! I confess that I too have often wondered at the lavish use of jargon /terminology which leaves an ordinary engineer like me always fogged. I remember decades ago, when the Porsche 914 & 928 were released on an unsuspecting public, the press (British mostly, since the Indian motoring press was nascent at the time) was more than happy to welcome them! While I, perhaps seeing the emperor's new clothes, found them to be just peculiar & odd shapes - an opinion later endorsed by saner & more prosaic souls! I suspect that the reverse maybe occurring here.

Originally Posted by romeomidhun

Hope you are part of the mahindra design team and are trying to get inputs for the next design.
Jokes apart; we are talking about the proportions for an easy-to-eye vehicle. Theoretically you can build a vehicle at any proportion of length, width and height. But will it make a good and easy-to-eye design? Ofcourse no. I guess a basic minimum aesthetic sense will tell you how awkward the proportions of vehicles like xylo, quanto and this nuvosport are. Am I saying xuv awkward? No. Scorpio? No. Tuv? No. The common feeling here in this forum is as simple as that.

Theoretically, yes - in Utopia one can do anything, come to think of it! But like you said (easy-to-eye, basic min. aesthetic sense, common feeling) these are deeply subjective reactions - and from what I see in the thread at the moment, opinion seems to be split more or less evenly (alright, let's say 60:40 against!) so I'd say lets wait and see it in the flesh! Remember the initial reactions (ghastly to offensive!) to the pre-launch photos of the TUV in this forum itself, and how opinions changed (favourably) once people started seeing it in the metal.

Originally Posted by Amartya

On the contrary, I would say that Mechanical Engineers cannot usurp the term "proportions". Styling or beauty is inherently visceral and subjective, but there's a ton of research (I've listed just 2 such papers below if you are interested) that shows that human beings have an innate sense of symmetry and proportions. If we made a car that was wider than it was longer, would you be okay with us saying that the proportions were odd?
Mahindra's design tend to be polarizing on an automobile enthusiast's forum, but most end up selling by the bucketloads. It's just that the Quanto was an odd beast from the beginning, and this refresh hasn't done anything to stymie those criticisms that were rooted in the car's styling.
References
(1) Innate and learned components of human visual preference: Rentschler et. al
(2) The neural basis for shape preferences: Amir et al.

Ah yes, research papers - I told my daughter when she was doing her Ph.D (bio-molecular science, UCF, Orlando) that there was a bloke who had actually published a dissertation on " the importance of bird-song in Shakespeare's plays" - no, I'm not joking, seriously . The point, as I've said elsewhere, is that visual inputs are processed as per our individual prejudices and bias. So why not wait a while and check the feedback after we see a few of them on the roads.

[Yeldo]

Why go philosophical and technical in a forum where there are people from all walks of life?

Research papers? Dissertations? For a Xylo facelift?

Do words like 'aesthetic', 'symmetry' and 'proportionate' need to be taken in terms of engineering alone?

What are we discussing here? The Mahindra NuvoSport. How it looks to you, he and I. As withe every car in the world, some like it, some hate it, some find themselves in between.

Mahindra cars have so many (sometimes conflicting) design elements - please don't go technical with this- and that sometimes confuse people. Hence some might call it "not easy on the eye", and that is not about illuminance, luminous emittance or luminous flux.

Short nose, tall body and chopped off rear quarter make people call a vehicle "disproportionate". To invoke a mathematical context here would be an overstretch. When we say the Quanto is "disproportionate", we simply mean that the relationship between elements of its design is skewed to our eyes.

It is true that Mahindra designs polarize opinion on this forum more than many other designs. And to define those feelings in terms of technical jargon, well, I don't know.

For me, I think Mahindra cars look better in the flesh than in the pictures.

I find the NuvoSport looking somewhat good from the front. The side profile ("profile" means as seen against a background, not angles or vertical sections) is odd. And the rear looks good.

I might be one of the very few people on this forum who finds the KUV100 good looking. Except for the rear door handles, I don't see a line out of place. I like the TUV300 except for its front grille. But when I see one in black colour, it doesn't look as odd as it is in white or silver.

Finesse and sophistication has never been Mahindra's strengths. People buy Mahindra vehicles for their utility, robustness and value. And Mahindra learns and improves with every new launch, every new facelift.

[scopriobharath]

I am just waiting for some reviews to find out what additional features it offers over TUV. If they are pricing it above TUV, what premium it commands?

[ambikr]

Mahindra has gone horribly wrong here. These features should have been added to TUV 300 instead of launching a new product. People sorely miss absence of the following features in TUV, some of which they have offered here. They should provide the following add on features in TUV and stop Nuvosport:
1. Automatic climate control
2. Rear A/C vent
3. Cruise control.
4. Touch screen
5. Rear parking camera
6. 100 BHP engine
7. Reclining rear seat.
8. Rain sensing wipers.
9. Projector headlamps.
10.Leather upholstery
11. Side cladding & Front cladding.
12. Dead pedal in AMT
13. More colour options.
Hope someone from Mahindra realizes this and take corrective actions. Meanwhile lets see how Nuvosport's sales picks up.

[romeomidhun]

How I wish the sporty front end of NuvoSport to replace the boring front end of TUV! Other than the front end, TUV has a kind of attraction, and Nuvosport's front is the only part of attraction.
(Excuse for the poor Photoshop job.)

[shashanka]

Originally Posted by ambikr

Mahindra has gone horribly wrong here. These features should have been added to TUV 300 instead of launching a new product. People sorely miss absence of the following features in TUV, some of which they have offered here. They should provide the following add on features in TUV and stop Nuvosport:
1. Automatic climate control
2. Rear A/C vent
3. Cruise control.
4. Touch screen
5. Rear parking camera
6. 100 BHP engine
7. Reclining rear seat.
8. Rain sensing wipers.
9. Projector headlamps.
10.Leather upholstery
11. Side cladding & Front cladding.
12. Dead pedal in AMT
13. More colour options.
Hope someone from Mahindra realizes this and take corrective actions. Meanwhile lets see how Nuvosport's sales picks up.

That's a nice comprehensive list & M&M should at least think of adding them as options. In fact I can think of only adding the AWD/4WD option - to help tempt the small-but-growing off-roading community.

[vamsi.kona]

We have to remember that Dzire still sells 15k or more units per month despite majority of Bhpian's felling that it isn't good looking design. The only thing that can make or break Nuvo is the pricing perception by its target customers.

The front end looks decent enough to pull some people to the showrooms at least.

[rajeshsundaram]

As a Xylo owner, I like the Nuvosport's front fascia. Adds a lot of character (compared to the original design). Had this been done to Quanto in the beginning, M&M might have got some good numbers.

On the whole, the Nuvosport is what Quanto should have been. But this is late. Hope M&M has learned the lesson. Will the Nuvosport become a success? I doubt. There are a lot better options at this price point.

[apachelongbow]

Aesthetics is a function of good design. A engineer cannot design, not that he/she cannot, rather they are not trained for design/aesthetics. An engineer can produce efficient/strong/reliable designs, which need not be good looking. It is the job of a designer to produce vow inducing designs and the job of an engineer to translate that into reality, if necessary to temper that design into the realm of possibility or efficient production. Ideally in automobile companies the designers and engineers must be at loggerheads to produce the best possible vehicle. Also interesting to read is something called a golden ratio. It is a mathematical equation and any object (human/non human) which fits close to the golden ratio is termed as aesthetically pleasing to the human eye. One can read more about the golden ratio in wikipedia. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_ratio
Regarding the Quanto or Nuvosport the product is very ugly to look at, there is no doubt to that. Also restricting the length alone to under 4 meters without any reduction in the height or width has made it an oddball box to view.

[chittybang]

Since when is the word proportion so confusing? Its fair to say everyone among us understand it. We may not be able to give a definition or write an essay on it but we get it. In my opinion this product is just confusing. Why have a TUV and a nuvosport? Also The major visual issue with the Quanto was the abrupt chopped off end. That still exists in the iteration. Now Like someone mentioned it would have been better to just use this front end and features on the TUV.
Mahindra's designs are polarizing and in this instance i don;t find it appealing. More power to those who love it

[Karthik Chandra]

Mahindra has managed to dispatch 1298 Nuvospsort off the factory shelf

[volkman10]

Originally Posted by Karthik Chandra

Mahindra has managed to dispatch 1298 Nuvospsort off the factory shelf

These are dispatches to dealers for the demo/ test drive. The true numbers will be seen past April 2016 sales numbers!

[shashanka]

Originally Posted by romeomidhun

How I wish the sporty front end of NuvoSport to replace the boring front end of TUV! Other than the front end, TUV has a kind of attraction, and Nuvosport's front is the only part of attraction.
(Excuse for the poor Photoshop job.)

I agree - the NS sporty front end on the TUV would certainly add to its appeal. To be honest though, I like the TUV's front end as is too - even though M&M has clearly plagiarized the Jeep Cherokee. Nice Photoshop job, by the way!

[msk_kapoor]

Been to Mahindra showroom in chennai to check Nuvosport in flesh. The front looks good and much better than pictures. But the eyebrow type DRL is looking slightly odd. Dealer mentioned they have already got 27 bookings in nuvosport. Just when i was there another customer walked in to book the vehicle. Seeing this i wont be surprised even this sells in decent numbers for Mahindra.