[Mad Max]

Visiting the US now and I keep gawking at a bunch of Civics parked in our office garage. There are two specific colors - one a green (Think its called Energy pearl or something) and the other one is a bright red. The car looks awesome with a low-slung stance. I don't want to be a creep peering into parked vehicles in office but it's just a tad too tempting.

Definitely a winner if it comes to India.

(*disclaimer - if priced right?)

[Vitalstatistiks]

Originally Posted by varsin

We are up there with the best, so give us your best products Honda!

No, we are not. Not for Honda anyway. India is simply the fifth largest market for Honda (distant, if I may add). India is City's biggest market though, and it shows in Honda showing seriousness in that product. Just for one product though.

[CrAzY dRiVeR]

Originally Posted by Jeevith

'Lag' is lag even if nullified.

NA was lag all the way till VTec kicks in, whereas the new turbo will see lag only till around 2k rpm. Low and initial midrange was never a strength for the old Civic.

Dyno graphs show the 1.5 turbo producing around 100hp as low as around 3300 rpm, whereas the old NA 1.8 used to produce 100hp around 5500 rpm as per various dyno graphs.

Originally Posted by Vitalstatistiks

India is simply the fifth largest market for Honda (distant, if I may add).

India is the fourth largest market for Honda, as confirmed by Yoichiro Ueno. I believe USA, Japan and UK come before the Indian market in terms of volumes.

http://www.moneycontrol.com/news/bus...f_8530061.html

[deerhunter]

Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR

India is the fourth largest market for Honda, as confirmed by Yoichiro Ueno. I believe USA, Japan and UK come before the Indian market in terms of volumes.

It is China, not UK. If i remember right, Honda sold more than a million vehicles in China last year. Honda's UK sales is less than a lakh.

[R2D2]

I don't see myself paying 23-25L for a car with a 1.5 diesel or 1.6L petrol motor especially when the competition i.e. the Altis & Octavia are equipped with marginally bigger and more powerful engines. That diesel option may work in India though, given Toyota still manages to sell the Altis Diesel with a puny 1.4L/88 HP engine.

[mihirdesai]

Originally Posted by R2D2

I don't see myself paying 23-25L for a car with a 1.5 diesel or 1.6L petrol motor.

I think you have got the engines interchanged.

The petrol motor should be fun to drive with 174bhp on tap. The variant to watch would the manual petrol with the turbo kicking in at 1,500 rpm as reviews and videos on YouTube. Hopefully Honda prices it sensibly. Count me in as a prospective buyer if Honda prices it just above the dated looking Corolla.


The CVT variant would be the one with all the bells and whistles if the Honda City variants can be a pointer. However after test driving the City's CVT transmission I'm not sure it will be fun to drive though definitely more convinient.

I wrote to Honda but they are non committal about the launch date. Maybe the diesel needs more testing.

With the SUV's getting expensive and slotting above 25 lacs, there may just be the opening of the price bracket between 18-23 lacs for the Honda Civic.

As the official review of the City says fast manual, convenient CVT and an economical diesel. More of the same for the Civic is my guess

[R2D2]

Originally Posted by mihirdesai

I think you have got the engines interchanged.

Ah yes, that was a typo. A 170 BHP screamer would be fun to drive, the thing is, will Honda introduce this high output engine in this country.

It's unfortunate but cars with better mileage & lower running costs sell in higher numbers than cars with higher power. Witness Toyota selling more of the under powered diesel versions of the Altis than the petrol version.

With the SUV's getting expensive and slotting above 25 lacs, there may just be the opening of the price bracket between 18-23 lacs for the Honda Civic.

Yes, I think that's the price bracket the D1 segment will slot into - 18-23L OTR which covers all except the top end Octavia or the now discontinued Jetta.

[CarguyNish]

Originally Posted by mihirdesai

The petrol motor should be fun to drive with 174bhp on tap. The variant to watch would the manual petrol with the turbo kicking in at 1,500 rpm as reviews and videos on YouTube. Hopefully Honda prices it sensibly. Count me in as a prospective buyer if Honda prices it just above the dated looking Corolla.

That 1.5 Turbo Petrol has earned good reviews for being quick off the line along with good drivability. So, I expect this new engine to be the Performance Oriented Engine. Price will be higher I guess compared to Corolla & Elantra. With Honda, competitive pricing is out of equation.

The CVT variant would be the one with all the bells and whistles if the Honda City variants can be a pointer. However after test driving the City's CVT transmission I'm not sure it will be fun to drive though definitely more convinient.

Even here, the reviews mention that Honda's CVT gearbox are the best ones out there. The gearbox delivers good combination between Efficiency & Performance. So, I expect CVT to be the main Gearbox for Petrol Version.

I wrote to Honda but they are non committal about the launch date. Maybe the diesel needs more testing.

Honda won't reveal the dates I guess, at best they may forward your interest to the concerned dealer in your city. Maybe we should wait for scoop from Honda Birdies.

As the official review of the City says fast manual, convenient CVT and an economical diesel. More of the same for the Civic is my guess

Yes, expect the same on the Civic.

Originally Posted by R2D2

It's unfortunate but cars with better mileage & lower running costs sell in higher numbers than cars with higher power. Witness Toyota selling more of the under powered diesel versions of the Altis than the petrol version.

Yes, I think that's the price bracket the D1 segment will slot into - 18-23L OTR which covers all except the top end Octavia or the now discontinued Jetta.

Are you sure Corolla sells higher in Diesel Version compared to Petrol ? I guess it's opposite. I see more Petrol Corolla's then Diesel one's.

If they launch it in that 15-20 lakhs range, it will bring in numbers that Honda needs. Overall, a very good car worth waiting for.

[RavenAvi]

Originally Posted by CarguyNish

Honda won't reveal the dates I guess, at best they may forward your interest to the concerned dealer in your city. Maybe we should wait for scoop from Honda Birdies.

Honda will concentrate solely on fast-tracking the Civic's introduction in India by 2017-end, once they are done with the WR-V's launch. It is expected to come with both fuel options, with a 1.6L i-DTEC under it's hood for the first time in our country.

Pricing and launch could happen in the first quarter of CY2018.

[CrAzY dRiVeR]

Originally Posted by RavenAvi

Pricing and launch could happen in the first quarter of CY2018.

Perhaps we might get the mid life facelift version then! Which is really good because all the issues, specially the electronics, could be sorted by then.

The car was introduced by 2015 I believe, so a facelift is due by then.

[R2D2]

Originally Posted by CarguyNish

Are you sure Corolla sells higher in Diesel Version compared to Petrol ? I guess it's opposite. I see more Petrol Corolla's then Diesel one's.

Other than TBHP reports that I follow, I have actually seen more new diesel Altises than petrol at least in my city. Most of the diesel purchases are by taxi fleet owners and by many from the semi urban areas around Pune who need to travel distances. Urban individuals would prefer the petrol.

If they launch it in that 15-20 lakhs range, it will bring in numbers that Honda needs. Overall, a very good car worth waiting for.

If the engine predictions hold true, I'd expect the ex-showroom prices to be around 19L for the diesel and 20L for turbo petrol both in a MT version with a middle of the rung trim selection. Of course Honda might choose to price the diesel higher as oil burners sell well in this country. Any AT versions will naturally cost more.

As an ex-Honda car owner I feel they need to connect better with their customers in order to charge a premium and be less fickle with their model ranges. Toyota has done far, far better in this regard.

[Jeevith]

Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR

NA was lag all the way till VTec kicks in, whereas the new turbo will see lag only till around 2k rpm. Low and initial midrange was never a strength for the old Civic.

Dyno graphs show the 1.5 turbo producing around 100hp as low as around 3300 rpm, whereas the old NA 1.8 used to produce 100hp around 5500 rpm as per various dyno graphs.

I take your point on the low mid-range. I haven't driven the civic, and I'm really curious about the lower end torque more than the mid-range or the top end for that matter. Do share your inputs.

(I used to drive a 1.8 Optra earlier and hence the fascination with big NAs).

My point being, that considering that most of the driving is done in traffic, does the mid-range or the top end torque really matter!?

I'm sure blowers are extreamly fun to drive on the highways. I have a 1.3 S-Cross, which I agree is more to fun than my 1.4 Petrol Ciaz. But in the city, the ease of the Ciaz trumps the lag of the S-Cross on any given day.

[CrAzY dRiVeR]

Originally Posted by Jeevith

I have a 1.3 S-Cross, which I agree is more to fun than my 1.4 Petrol Ciaz. But in the city, the ease of the Ciaz trumps the lag of the S-Cross on any given day.

Good point, but its more to do with the way the 1.3 multijet is tuned. The turbo diesels in cars like the Nissan Micra, Ford Figo (old) etc offer fantastic drive ability.

From international reviews, the driveability of the 1.5 Honda turbopetrol seems pretty decent, but not sure if they would keep the same tuning for the Indian market, given the concerns regarding fuel quality.

[R2D2]

I just read this article and thought I'd share here:

http://indiatoday.intoday.in/auto/st.../1/910060.html

Engine is expected to be a 1.8L petrol with a yet-to-be-announced diesel making to the list of choices.

Priced between Rs 15-20L ex-showroom Delhi.

PS - I hope this isn't click bait since the article is pretty vague.

[RavenAvi]

The latest on the Civic, as per my sources:

- Petrol option will be limited to the 1.8L i-VTEC. The 1.5L turbo-charged petrol won't be coming to India anytime soon.

- Diesel will be the same 1.5L Earth Dreams i-DTEC with a bump in power/torque figures of around 12-15%.

- 4 variants to be on offer, with even the entry-level variant to be decently loaded in features (a la 2017 City & WR-V).

- Honda is gunning for increased localisation, up to 80-85 percent, in order to achieve really competitive pricing, which could be between Rs 16-21 lakhs.