[Cruiser_D]

Originally Posted by balenoed_

For the official video of the Thar's off-road capabilities, not sure if we can already claim "capabilities" yet.

Yes, we need to wait and watch for the real life aspects. But all the depending factors appearing well on paper. Listed few changes in the characteristics IMHO that would influence the off road abilities.

Ground clearance got increased by ~20mm
Departure angle got slightly increased by ~1mm
Approach angle got slightly reduced by ~2mm
wheelbase increased by ~20mm

Even though there has been an increase in the wheel base, it has not at all impacted the departure angle. Having an independent suspension on the front is also likely to improve the overall capabilities, though there has been a slight decrease in the approach angle.

[showboat]

I did almost 90k kms in the 1st gen Thar so I'm waiting on pins and needles to get my hands on a new one. Petrol AT Hardtop all the way.

Things I hated/disliked on the 1st Gen:

• Steering offset by what feels like a foot after driving for 4 hrs on the highway.
• Crappy quality of materials
• Aftermarket Hardtop the only option
• Horrible sound stage no matter where you place speakers
• Bouncy leaf suspension (I get all the value of this for when I went offroading, but that was only for <10% of my usage)

So there's pretty much no complaints with an independent rear suspension, hardtop, AT Jeep with Android Auto.

Pricing will be key since it will be a 2nd or 3rd Vehicle for most of us. I think 15-17 for the top end AT is prob a realistic option (On-road). Here's hoping it drives pretty well on the highway as well as it does off the road and there's no major reliability issues.

[darkLightning]

Originally Posted by 84.monsoon

One thing I just cannot fathom is why Mahindra is giving such a low power and torque tune on the Diesel engine of the Thar .

Well Gurkha is coming to better it with 90 PS 2.6 Engine

Anyways for Thar or for that matter any Jeep (we can include Royal Enfields also here as they are also kinda similar in this way) Torque is higher priority than Power and Thar is not lacking in that department. no one is going to do a sprint on any of these.

[4x4addict]

Originally Posted by Cruiser_D

Even though there has been an increase in the wheel base, it has not at all impacted the departure angle.

There is no correlation between wheel base and departure angle. Larger wheelbase does affect the ramp over angle, which can be compensated to some extent by higher ground clearance.

Departure angle is affected only by the suspension type/design and the rear over hang.

[GTO]

Originally Posted by 4x4addict

@GTO, is the 4-Door confirmed or speculation at this point.

From what I hear, more or less confirmed.

Originally Posted by ramnaresh_2000

Look at the carpeting finishing at rear.

Good catch! And there will be plenty more rough edges for sure.

Originally Posted by ashish2135

My father liked the new Thar so much that he made up his mind to get one to satisfy my whim. Come December, my birthday month, and we will find our how this pans out!

It also saves him a ton of money as my endless list of desired cars included more expensive Germans and Czechs.

Just some friendly advice = be sure to test-drive it thoroughly before paying $$$. For Jeepers like us who drive old 4x4s and are used to Mahindras, the Thar is sent from heaven. That's why I have decided to buy it as my next car without even driving one. But assuming you haven't owned a Jeep or Gypsy before, you have to accept that a vehicle like the Thar isn't for everyone. It has MANY compromises. Quality will be incomparable to similarly-priced cars (e.g. City or Creta), the ride quality won't be perfect, I'm guessing its not much of a handler, cruising at 120 kmph will require constant steering corrections (going by the videos, I might be wrong), the 2 doors are limiting factors, ingress to the rear seats is impossible and many B2-segment hatchbacks will leave it for dead in performance & handling. Your family members will most likely prefer not to drive it.

Just like Harley-Davidsons, I expect to see a lot of 2 & 3 year old Thars on sale once the novelty value wears off for their initially-excited owners.

[4x4addict]

Originally Posted by GTO

From what I hear, more or less confirmed.

This makes total business sense for Mahindra. Given the platform is shared between the 2020 Thar 2DR/4DR and next gen Scorpio, Mahindra can expect reasonably good numbers.

[vkochar]

I am going to buy this vehicle - I have already decided however it amuses me to hear so many people here on this forum mention there wishful prices or what they strongly assume / estimate the EX Showroom / OTR price to be.

Some people here are quoting 15 Lacs and beyond for the AT.

Lets be clear on one thing - this is a nice 4x4 - they have nailed the looks and it looks butch and modern BUT at the end of the day it is a Mahindra and there are many modern day amenities still missing.

We will have some people ( many on this forum ) and enthusiasts and first time Thar owners and second timers of course who swear by the vehicle and of course the fan club.

But what after that ? Mahindra here from my perspective seems to be targeting a much much larger audience and wants to sell in 4 digits at the least in which case they will have to offer maximum value for money price tag. Think 9.xx and 10.xx and 11.xx etc.

Not 14.xx and 15.xx and 16.xx !

Forget also what it was priced at. Personally expect a smasher of a shocker low price and then see these selling.

They are also launching this at a time when the pandemic has affected every single pocket. All the more reason to be super sensible and business like.

[cool_dube]

Originally Posted by 4x4addict

This makes total business sense for Mahindra. Given the platform is shared between the 2020 Thar 2DR/4DR and next gen Scorpio, Mahindra can expect reasonably good numbers.

But would that not eat into the market share for the new Scorpio, to an extent?

[extreme_torque]

Originally Posted by 84.monsoon

One thing I just cannot fathom is why Mahindra is giving such a low power and torque tune on the Diesel engine of the Thar. The recently re-launched Marazzo uses a 1.5 litre BS6 diesel engine that puts out 123 bhp and 300 NM of torque! In comparison, the Thar’a 2.2 litre diesel mill (50% larger) only produces 130hp (5% more power) and the same 300NM of torque.

I am sure the 2.2 litre engine can easily be tuned to output around 170 hp and 350 NM at the least, not sure why Mahindra hesitates to do so. Even the smaller 2L petrol engine has more torque than the diesel.

One of the best 4X4 Toyota ever made was the 80 series Land Cruiser and it came with a 4.2 litre straight six diesel with 128 bhp and 285 nm of torque and that is in a car which weighed more than 2.2 tonnes. As it is always is, with proper 4X4's is it not the absolute power which matters, just enough is fine. They could have given it more power but a high strung engine with focus on power and torque would be peaky and therefore a disaster in hard core offroad situations. I hope they have tamed the engine to be powerful and smooth in the low end.

[achyutaghosh]

Originally Posted by vkochar

I am going to buy this vehicle - I have already decided however it amuses me to hear so many people here on this forum mention there wishful prices or what they strongly assume / estimate the EX Showroom / OTR price to be.

Some people here are quoting 15 Lacs and beyond for the AT.


But what after that ? Mahindra here from my perspective seems to be targeting a much much larger audience and wants to sell in 4 digits at the least in which case they will have to offer maximum value for money price tag. Think 9.xx and 10.xx and 11.xx etc.

Not 14.xx and 15.xx and 16.xx !

Forget also what it was priced at. Personally expect a smasher of a shocker low price and then see these selling.

They are also launching this at a time when the pandemic has affected every single pocket. All the more reason to be super sensible and business like.

Agree.

Mahindra wants to take Thar mainstream but let us look at last gen Thar prices- range from 7.XX to 10.XX odd?

Inflationary factors for new model-

- independent suspension
- new engines
- new transmission
- cabin comforts
- safety features

Deflationary factors-

- It is still a niche 2 door
- Current business environment
- Mahindra's brand value
- cannibalization from current Mahindra product portfolio
- selling to new set of more mainstream customers to start with
- teething problems with a new product

I would think the top end auto will not have an ex-showroom price beyond 13.XX lakhs. Once the 4 door is ready and the product is accepted, prices can go beyond 14.XX

[fine69]

Originally Posted by GTO

Thar isn't for everyone. It has MANY compromises. Quality will be incomparable to similarly-priced cars (e.g. City or Creta), the ride quality won't be perfect, I'm guessing its not much of a handler, cruising at 120 kmph will require constant steering corrections (going by the videos, I might be wrong), the 2 doors are limiting factors, ingress to the rear seats is impossible and many B2-segment hatchbacks will leave it for dead in performance & handling. Your family members will most likely prefer not to drive it.

Spot on!!

Youtubers who are reviewing the Thar and calling it an SUV is where everybody gets it wrong. Its a Jeep! Has all the shortcomings that a typical Jeep has (in spite of all the improvements). It most definitely has the advantages of an off-roader but should never be confused as a proper alternative to a car or SUV.

I see people considering this as a tourer as well, I'd suggest a pre-owned Fortuner to them instead of spending 17-18 lakh on a 2-seater.

Again, if one wants a Jeep then this is the best Jeep they could ever buy for the price but re-read what GTO wrote above, best advice!

[Pancham]

Originally Posted by vkochar

Forget also what it was priced at. Personally expect a smasher of a shocker low price and then see these selling.

They are also launching this at a time when the pandemic has affected every single pocket. All the more reason to be super sensible and business like.

I truly hope you are right but considering the bare bones current gen (now previous) Thar retailed for 12L OTR, I don't seen why they would price a better (overall and loaded) vehicle lower than that. The base variant (bare bones like the current one) which would be the AX variant should be around 12L OTR if not more. That itself pushes the whole range above 15L easily.

About first time owners: I think Mahindra is very clear about the target customers - people who were sitting on the fence looking for a livable Thar. People who want / always wanted a Jeep should only buy this car knowing fully the shortcomings GTO mentioned. Someone looking for a TROC or Creta should ideally take multiple test drives before going for the Thar.

So as a product it is a better 'Thar' and not really a great overall package (as a car). AND there is nothing wrong with that considering the fan following Thar has.

P.S: Thumbs up for me for the Thar.

[Kosfactor]

Originally Posted by fine69

Youtubers who are reviewing the Thar and calling it an SUV is where everybody gets it wrong. Its a Jeep! Has all the shortcomings that a typical Jeep has (in spite of all the improvements). It most definitely has the advantages of an off-roader but should never be confused as a proper alternative to a car or SUV.

You`ll be surprised as to how many car reviewers are completely clueless about what a Jeep is nor have owned \ driven \ traveled in it where only a Jeep would go or only a Jeep will be used.

On the flip side, if Mahindra had listened only to Jeepers - you`ll get solid axles, diff lock, huge tires and a ladder to climb inside.

I hope its expensive, 2 door only and impractical so that only those who understand it and still wants it - buys it.

[wildsdi5530]

Originally Posted by vkochar

Lets be clear on one thing - this is a nice 4x4 - they have nailed the looks and it looks butch and modern BUT at the end of the day it is a Mahindra and there are many modern day amenities still missing.

I think you're wrong. It may not have many amenities, but what about the complex electronics that handle the 4x4 system - Body roll mitigation, Active rollover protection, Advanced traction systems, AI controlling the terrain management system, Electronic front and rear locking differential, Active independent suspension, electronic front sway bar disconnect, Tyre direction display, etc.
All these definitely cost a lot of money to design and manufacture.

[GTO]

Originally Posted by vkochar

Some people here are quoting 15 Lacs and beyond for the AT.

Think 9.xx and 10.xx and 11.xx etc.

Agreed & disagreed.

The entry-level variant will have a killer price to reduce shock. However, the higher variants will be expensive. The old, jugaad Thar made from the existing parts bin was ~9.8 lakhs ex-showroom and 11 - 12 lakhs on the road in Bombay. The new Thar with so many improvements and the AT will easily cross 15 lakhs in Bombay.

Jeeps are also about F-A-T profit margins. See what positioning FCA deploys for the Wrangler in USA and compare it to same-price cars. Body-on-frame Jeeps are NOT value-for-money.

Of course, as a customer, I hope you are right and I am wrong. If you've gotten the price right, then ghee + sugar in your mouth .