[wildsdi5530]

Originally Posted by gaddiwale

Right pricing of Thar is critical for its success (find more garage than heart). I believe Mahinda should target <10 lahks price for top end.

It's funny but sometimes right pricing for the seller may not be the right price for the buyer.

Mahindra may have designed the Thar as a work horse and planned to sell it at an affordable price. I'm sure the production cost of the new Thar must be around 4-5 lakhs. Add royalties, taxes, etc. and a <10 lakh Ex showroom for the top end is very doable. However then it will sell in huge numbers like the jeeps of yore, where in towns at least, every 2nd vehicle was a MM540/550. But their profit margins would be thin. And they actually have to run their production lines to make the required numbers.

However seeing the hype generated by us - internet people, they may decide to sell at an Ex showroom of >20 Lakhs. Make the same product a lifestyle vehicle which will never be used for work. So instead of a few thousands as profit per car, with all the hassles of manufacturing, they can have a profit of 10 Lakhs per car. Thus the number of cars to be sold can come down by a factor of 20. And the production lines will not be strained either.

Now you can guess what the company's stand is going to be.

[justwheels]

Originally Posted by wildsdi5530

It's funny but sometimes right pricing for the seller may not be the right price for the buyer.


However seeing the hype generated by us - internet people, they may decide to sell at an Ex showroom of >20 Lakhs. Make the same product a lifestyle vehicle which will never be used for work. So instead of a few thousands as profit per car, with all the hassles of manufacturing, they can have a profit of 10 Lakhs per car. Thus the number of cars to be sold can come down by a factor of 20. And the production lines will not be strained either.

Now you can guess what the company's stand is going to be.

While it is correct that with the right hype, you can manage to command a premium to a product but not beyond a point. Also, each assembly line makes profit with economies of scale. Running a very lean manufacturing number won't help as the whole car is never made by only M&M. There so many anciliaries involved and a car is a complex amalgamation of economies of scale of many units. So there will always be a critical threshold to profit.

It's easy to profit in CBU route but I don't think it is possible to do the same in manufacturing setup. However, if M&M decides to go hyper pricing route, I am sure we have seen many hyped cars failing terribly, and I am not sure if M&M cars can command that high price still.

Nonetheless, 2nd Oct is not very far, though it looks eons away for me waiting to book my first Jeep.

[CrAzY dRiVeR]

Originally Posted by gaddiwale

Right pricing of Thar is critical for its success (find more garage than heart). I believe Mahinda should target <10 lahks price for top end. This will translate to about 12 lakhs on road price.

Against hatchbacks like the Jazz?

Even compact FWD raised-hatchback SUVs are near the 12-13L ex showroom prices these days.

If TUV300 top end (diesel, AMT) can be offered below 10 lakhs ex-showroom, why not Thar (this may not be apple to apple comparison)?

TUV 3OO is sub-4m, <1.5L diesel. Thar has a 2.2 L. Costlier to build plus higher tax slab.
TUV 3OO has the problematic and cheap AMT, Thar has the Aisin 6 speed TC.
TUV 3OO doesnt have 4*4 hardware.

Certainly not an apple to apple comparison.

[navpreet318]

Originally Posted by tilt

Y..............

Incidentally, locking hubs (auto or manual) were never provided on the Thar until the 2015 refresh. Earlier models, Thar and before, had no locking hubs at all. It was only the hard-core offroaders who installed aftermarket manual hubs locks from Lambda etc.

Cheers

I've been reading your comments in the past few pages. Please read up on what locking hubs are. What are auto locking ones. What are manual locking ups. What are permanent locking flanges. What are electronic hubs. This will give you great clarity. I'll try to explain with the best of my abilities.

Thar was always with the Auto locking hubs from Day one. The same auto locking hubs were also seen on the Safari 4x4 2L, 3L and the 2.2L as well as the Scorpio 4x4 before the recent face lift. These were the black protruding things if you remember with 4WD written on it.

Now in between in around 2013 they used the fixed flanges in the Thar. Again within a few months they went back to the auto-locking hubs.

Now coming to the present day new Thar. This has electronic locking hubs which actuate on turning on the 4x4 system.
The same is found on all Storme 4x4 and Scorpio 4x4 since the facelift.

Since you're talking about power distribution, that depends on the differential. Not the hubs.

Thar was launched with simple differentials or open differentials at launch.
In 2015 it was facelifted and given an Eaton MLD. A Mechanical Locking Differential. The principle it works on is that if there is a difference of 100 rpm between the left and right sides of the axle, it comes into play and locks up the differential. For further technical details please search the 4x4 Technical section.

The front differential remains open in both the Thar AX as well as LX.

This was the case with the older Thar as well. Front differential was always open. And people have been able to use it in extreme offroading using the same open differential.

The Thar LX has an additional feature which is based on sensors and software. It detects wheel-spin by comparing the rpm on both left and right sides of the axle. At a particular difference it brakes the wheel with higher rpm.

I suppose I have explained it as best as I could. Please search or open a new Thread in the Technical 4x4 section for further clarity.

Sorry fellas for the longish technical post here on the new Thar thread.

Now coming to the Thar. I'm just yearning for a Test Drive of both the Petrol and Diesel AT versions and to look at the colours in person.
This wait is confusing even further. The copper looks amazing. The Bluish one looks smashing. The Red is the choice of wifey(Who is always correct). and now even the grey colour is starting to look good! Phew!

[Slipstream11]

Paid a visit to Unnati Automobiles (M&M AS) in Viman Nagar, Pune to gather some intel on the availability of a TD vehicle. Following are the key takeaways :

1. They are not expecting TD vehicles before 1st Oct. It will mostly reach them on the 1st along with the rest of the fresh stock, not any earlier.
2. Pricing information still remains at large.
3. No marketing collaterals have reached them yet.
4. Top end variant (only) expected to be available for TD, unless the prospect gets pedantic to try other variants - which will take time to be made available.
5. Huge rush and a lot of inquiries have come in so far. However they are skeptical of how many will end up converting into actual sales.
6. Sheepishly accepted that they are taking unofficial bookings against a token amount of 25K INR.
7. Accessories are going to be available by the 1st of Oct at the showroom. Fitting will happen at their workshop some distance away in a SEZ.
8. They will allow a max TD of 30 kms and provide a smallish off road track. This can be worked upon if one can befriend the advisor.
9. Upon being asked about Jubilee Motors (another M&M distributor in the Pune Camp region) I was told that they are facing some internal financial issues (not sure if that's relevant or legit)

Nothing more than most of us already know.

However, the visit to the showroom and taking in the fragrance of the interiors of a new car (an XUV3OO was being prepared for delivery) made me feel good.

[84.monsoon]

Originally Posted by justwheels

Reading through the posts, a new conundrum has been introduced. Till now diesel vs petrol decision was more on FE, cost and is mStallion reliable. But with this whole DPF thing and diesel ban discussions, do we seriously need to consider all this while buying Thar.

I believe that with the introduction of BS6, the differentiation between Diesel and Petrol in terms of level of emissions is almost completely gone. Diesels are are almost as clean as Petrols and considering increased fuel efficiency may actually be less harmful tot he environment over its lifetime. So I expect any rational future laws or court judgements will have to give a differential treatment to BS6 Diesels as pre-BS6 Diesels. I can see the industry players like Mercedes challenging the 10-year rule in Delhi for BS6 cars, citing this data.

See my post related to this topic below:
https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/india...ml#post4872922 (A Close Look : Kia Sonet)

[ph03n!x]

Originally Posted by Slipstream11

1. They are not expecting TD vehicles before 1st Oct. It will mostly reach them on the 1st along with the rest of the fresh stock, not any earlier.
2. Pricing information still remains at large.
3. No marketing collaterals have reached them yet.
4. Top end variant (only) expected to be available for TD, unless the prospect gets pedantic to try other variants - which will take time to be made available.
5. Huge rush and a lot of inquiries have come in so far. However they are skeptical of how many will end up converting into actual sales.
6. Sheepishly accepted that they are taking unofficial bookings against a token amount of 25K INR.

All these points after consistent with what I heard from the Coimbatore dealership too - RTA approvals are pending, and can be obtained only after they "launch" the product apparently - this was given as the reason for #1.

[ph03n!x]

Mahindra is auctioning Thar #1 for a cause!


Source

The Thar #1 will have

• Customised badging with owners initials on the vehicles exterior
• Leatherette Seats
• And ofcourse the No. 1 badging on the dashboard's VIN plate

[harmeet]

Originally Posted by ph03n!x

Mahindra is auctioning Thar #1 for a cause!
Attachment 2057036

Source

The Thar #1 will have

• Customised badging with owners initials on the vehicles exterior
• Leatherette Seats
• And ofcourse the No. 1 badging on the dashboard's VIN plate

"The Reserve Price on the vehicle throughout the Auction Window will be
INR 25,00,000 (Indian Rupees Twenty Five Lakhs Only)."

This seams to be more of a marketing gimmick. Let's see where is closes. I assume it might settle somewhere close to 45-50 lacs.

[ph03n!x]

Originally Posted by harmeet

"The Reserve Price on the vehicle throughout the Auction Window will be
INR 25,00,000 (Indian Rupees Twenty Five Lakhs Only)."

This seams to be more of a marketing gimmick. Let's see where is closes. I assume it might settle somewhere close to 45-50 lacs.

I wouldn't blame them either - with a car like Thar, #1 will become a prestigious possession. Won't be surprised if a top businessman or actor picks it.

The cause too is for the good - I hope M&M gets a fat cheque for this #1!

[darkLightning]

Originally Posted by balenoed_

need to watch out for that flying Thar too

Sorry for going off topic.
@Mods - please delete this post if it is not relevant.

However your post was so hilarious I couldn't help myself from creating this



On topic though, Good initiative by Mahindra, serves multiple purposes.

However I just cannot shake this off my mind -

Whoever is going to get the Thar #1 will most likely keep it as a trophy and may not put it to a lot of practical use. So what if "The Flying Thar" ends up as "Thar#1" in someone's garage ?

[tilt]

Originally Posted by Kosfactor

*SNIP*

Thar CRDe launched with Auto Locking hubs , in 2013 for a few months they released CRDe with fixed flange . From 2014 it is back to auto locking hubs.

Thank you, I was not aware of this. My only source of information on this are the official TBHP reviews of the 2010 and the 2015 Thar. This specific post (https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/india...ml#post3797433 (2015 Mahindra Thar Facelift : A Close Look)) is what gave me the impression that auto-locking hubs were introduced only in the 2015 facelift.

I realise now that my mistake was in not reading the 2010 review completely because it is mentioned in this post (https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/offic...ml#post2198337) that auto-locking hubs were indeed present in the 2010 model. I stand corrected.

Thank you once again.

Originally Posted by navpreet318

I've been reading your comments in the past few pages. Please read up on what locking hubs are. *SNIP*

Thank you, yes I have been reading and shall read more .

Originally Posted by navpreet318

*SNIP*

I suppose I have explained it as best as I could. Please search or open a new Thread in the Technical 4x4 section for further clarity.*SNIP*

Thank, you, I appreciate your making the time and effort to explain this in such detail - I have indeed increased my knowledge a little bit because of this.

This whole discussion began when "for_cars1" mentioned that the 2020 AX has the same hardware as the old Thar (The 2020 next-gen Mahindra Thar : Driving report on page 86) - and I asked him if he had confirmed info on this (The 2020 next-gen Mahindra Thar : Driving report on page 86) - and that question is yet to be answered. His claim gave me to understand that the AX came with auto-locking hubs too; but I found no mention of this on Mahindra's website.

Cheers

[amol4184]

Have they improved the interior trim on production vehicles? All the preview videos have pretty crude looking, unfinished upholstery around rear seats where the wheel arch bulges in and towards the windows. But these pics show much better finish.

[Slipstream11]

Originally Posted by amol4184

Have they improved the interior trim on production vehicles? All the preview videos have pretty crude looking, unfinished upholstery around rear seats where the wheel arch bulges in and towards the windows. But these pics show much better finish.

This is courtesy Adobe XD and photoshop

I am sure they will touch up those crude grips on the rear seats and the wiring for the brake light on the rear glass window which was pretty blatant on the launch vehicles. I doubt the wheel wells will improve though.

[originalamit]

While there is so much interest in the Thar, i just have a curious question - I tried to go through all the previous sales figures of Thar. Its sub 300 every month.. Given the previous sales are so low, what should be the number of Thar vehicles sold every month which will allow us to call this car a success?

Here is what i found for Feb2020https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/india...-analysis.html (February 2020 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis)


And this is the current one:
https://www.team-bhp.com/forum/india...-analysis.html (July 2020 : Indian Car Sales Figures & Analysis)