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Old 28th September 2018, 14:24   #691
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re: Tata H5X Concept @ Auto Expo 2018. Named Tata Harrier! EDIT: Launched @ Rs. 12.69 lakhs

Isnt the next generation Creta going to be bigger ? Tata might not be able to use only the dimension factor against Creta, so pricing will be crucial. Even Kia, if it brings something based on Creta might be a challenge.

Last edited by srishiva : 28th September 2018 at 14:25.
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Old 28th September 2018, 14:31   #692
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re: Tata H5X Concept @ Auto Expo 2018. Named Tata Harrier! EDIT: Launched @ Rs. 12.69 lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by payeng View Post
I see the Harrier Priced / Positioned closer to the XUV500.
Where would they position the H7X then?
I think at the end of the day they will just make a decision based on their production costs and take it further from there.
I am glad for a change they will build a proper car and then price it. As against cutting costs because they have to meet an extremely low price point.

It will sell for its value, which I hope they are able to meet our expectations.
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Old 28th September 2018, 14:59   #693
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re: Tata H5X Concept @ Auto Expo 2018. Named Tata Harrier! EDIT: Launched @ Rs. 12.69 lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by selfdrive View Post
Where would they position the H7X then?
From what I saw at the Auto Expo, the Harrier deserves to be positioned above the XUV500.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR View Post
From what we've seen till now - Harrier looks D segment material rather than C segment. It's one thing to expect it to be priced well for its segment, quite another to expect to be priced a full segment below.
Exactly

Last edited by payeng : 28th September 2018 at 15:03.
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Old 28th September 2018, 15:27   #694
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re: Tata H5X Concept @ Auto Expo 2018. Named Tata Harrier! EDIT: Launched @ Rs. 12.69 lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR View Post
Same goes for Endeavour, Fortuner etc. If Mercedes Benz and Audi were priced near Creta, they would have sold more too.

In fact, Mercedez Benz is priced quite close to Creta, if you take into consideration the tax brackets for each them (CKD/imported vs local made). But, we are veering off topic.

I am not sure if Creta price falls in C segment or whatever. What matters is, what is the number that Tata wants out of Harrier. My guess is pricing above or on par with Creta will not fetch more than 1000 a month. Let's wait and see. I have been wrong many times before.

Last edited by ampere : 28th September 2018 at 19:00. Reason: Compacted quoted post
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Old 28th September 2018, 15:45   #695
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re: Tata H5X Concept @ Auto Expo 2018. Named Tata Harrier! EDIT: Launched @ Rs. 12.69 lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashlil View Post
My guess is pricing above or on par with Creta will not fetch more than 1000 a month.
Flash Back 2007: 10 years back when Royal Enfield was about to launch their Classic 350, the "budget performance" motorcycle category was considered to be priced around 1 lakhs with the Pulsar 220 and Yamaha R15 as the leaders.

Fast Forward 2018: The Royal Enfield 350 platform sells around 50K units per month, priced around 1.4 Lakhs; the Pulsar 220 is still around 1 Lakhs selling around 7-8K per month and the Yamaha R15 somewhere around 1.25 Lakhs and sells around 4-5k per month.


Hope everybody knows the "Frog in the Well Story"

Last edited by payeng : 28th September 2018 at 15:47.
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Old 28th September 2018, 17:58   #696
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re: Tata H5X Concept @ Auto Expo 2018. Named Tata Harrier! EDIT: Launched @ Rs. 12.69 lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by CrAzY dRiVeR View Post
It's one thing to expect it to be priced well for its segment, quite another to expect to be priced a full segment below.
Couldn't agree more on this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashlil View Post
What matters is, what is the number that Tata wants out of Harrier.
If that was the only case, then why compare it with Creta, shouldn't they compare it with Duster or Ecosport? And I fail to understand why we want to compare a car which is expected to be launched in the D segment priced on par with a C segment? Just because they are the market leader?

Along with the numbers, they are also trying to get into building their brand image. We all had apprehensions about who will buy a 15L Tata when Hexa was announced. But look at the market right now, it is quite well received and people's perception of Tata as a is changing. From a manufacturers point of view, why would they price it lower than its position in the market?
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Old 28th September 2018, 18:12   #697
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re: Tata H5X Concept @ Auto Expo 2018. Named Tata Harrier! EDIT: Launched @ Rs. 12.69 lakhs

Lest we forget the Creta starts at roughly 11 big ones on the road for its base petrol with puny 1.4.
Now is this where Tata will price their 4.5 metre 2.0 litre diesel with a platform inherited from the venerable LRD, when we know this will be their "flagship" until the H7X hits the road. NOT A CHANCE.

If we really have to have to pit it against the creta (the reason is definitely beyond me), then the 1.6 diesel is what one needs to look at.
The cheapest 1.6 D goes at about 15.5 OTR delhi.

To me this sounds about right territory (16-17) for base harrier variant thereby coming at a premium over the creta and still undercutting compass by at-least a 2 big ones which it is being seen to be benchmarked against.

Wishful thinking aside I am sure even at this price point harrier will sell quite well for the great product (I hope) it will turn out to be.
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Old 28th September 2018, 18:46   #698
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re: Tata H5X Concept @ Auto Expo 2018. Named Tata Harrier! EDIT: Launched @ Rs. 12.69 lakhs

The Harrier will definitely come between January and March 2019, mostly January as per my source. Moreover, the price bracket will surely be in Creta's territory. The top-end might be nudging the XUV.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sandman_30 View Post
Lest we forget the Creta starts at roughly 11 big ones on the road for its base petrol with puny 1.4.
As far as I know, Creta has only 1 petrol engine, the 1.6L. It has 2 diesel engines displacing 1.4L and 1.6L.
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Old 28th September 2018, 18:48   #699
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re: Tata H5X Concept @ Auto Expo 2018. Named Tata Harrier! EDIT: Launched @ Rs. 12.69 lakhs

Oops I had meant to write diesel but the petrol head in me was working with a mind of its own. Thanks for pointing it out.
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Old 28th September 2018, 18:48   #700
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re: Tata H5X Concept @ Auto Expo 2018. Named Tata Harrier! EDIT: Launched @ Rs. 12.69 lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by ashlil View Post
What matters is, what is the number that Tata wants out of Harrier. My guess is pricing above or on par with Creta will not fetch more than 1000 a month. Let's wait and see. I have been wrong many times before.
Couldn't agree more. You echoed my thoughts almost verbatim.

Just to add to this (and in response to some other posts), Tata can very much design a car that competes with Mercedes (their subsidiary already does). But unfortunately there is a certain brand value associated with Tata that won't permit them to compete.

Take the S-cross 1.6 for example, excellent product but had the wrong badge associated with it.

Even the Creta's price has gotten where it is now gradually (Launch price of the pre-facelift model was nowhere close to today's price).

Tata would be wise to launch low and gradually scale up based on response.
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Old 28th September 2018, 21:16   #701
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ashlil View Post
Nope. You are not the only one. As the sales figures of Compass show, they made a mistake in pricing. If the Harrier is priced above the Creta, it would suffer too. I doubt Harrier would sell in numbers even if it is priced on par with Creta.

Bet you are not a Tata motors share holder!

What surprises me is that the comments are coming from bhpians! Like most people said, why stop at the Creta, why not ask Tata to price it at par with a Lodgy?

Compass was always going to be a low volume product and I think Jeep is prepared for that. First, its a product that is exported out of India and they do not depend up on the Indian market for keeping their factory running. Second, they have a wafer thin dealer network and hence their reach is limited. Skoda and VW have a much better network in India and how much do they sell?
So Compass selling about 1-2 k units a month is may be something that Jeep and FCA foresaw. I do not think they were unprepared for this considering their history of puntos and lineas.

Secondly, the only high volume products in India above 20 Lakhs are the Innova and the fortuner to some extent. In the 15-20 lakh segment Creta and XUV are the only examples. So may not everyone can do what these guys are doing and they would be even aware of it. I would think Tata is surely aware enough than most of us sitting in typing in our handheld devices!

I do not want to speculate on the prices of the Harrier again, but like I mentioned before I think Tata will target to be some where around the area of the Creta 1.6 Diesel with better equipment. Just for reference the lowest variant in the Creta 1.6 Diesel in Bangalore on road is about 16.5 Lakhs. Is fairly equipped but no big features like 6 airbags and all that. Just the basics plus some fancy media system.
So if Tata gets the Harrier somewhere around this territory it should be be ok. People are not that dumb to compare every car in this bracket to the Creta.
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Old 28th September 2018, 21:44   #702
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re: Tata H5X Concept @ Auto Expo 2018. Named Tata Harrier! EDIT: Launched @ Rs. 12.69 lakhs

Quote:
Originally Posted by srishiva View Post
Isnt the next generation Creta going to be bigger ? Tata might not be able to use only the dimension factor against Creta, so pricing will be crucial. Even Kia, if it brings something based on Creta might be a challenge.
Next generation Creta may get marginally bigger. But it appears like the H5X and H7X are comparable to the Tuscon and Santa Fe in terms of dimensions and specifications (if we have to compare with the Hyundais).
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Old 28th September 2018, 22:00   #703
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re: Tata H5X Concept @ Auto Expo 2018. Named Tata Harrier! EDIT: Launched @ Rs. 12.69 lakhs

Tata has gotten into confused territory with the Harrier. They want the Creta volumes, however since the Creta is smaller in size and an established player but Hyundai has a better brand value. The Compass is comparatively sized better engined and the brand has better value however does not have the volumes. The 5 seater SUV segment is super crowded and coming in with a large 5 seater is at best a big gamble which has worked neither for Hyundai nor Jeep.

They would have had a better chance launching the H7X as the flagship in the XUV/Innova territory which has volumes, they have better brand value(Hexa/Safari) and both in size and seating they compare with the rivals.

The Harrier 5 seater should have followed at a later date riding on the success of the flagship H7X. I know Tata have this information and by doing Harrier first have gotten into this dilemma. Unless they are planning to price the Harrier at around 15 lakhs what does a buyer pay for:-

- Brand value(Dont think Tata has enough)
- Bigger boot space
- More grunt(still less than the Compass and a tad higher than the Creta but wait the Creta is lighter too)
- Land Rover underpinnings(on a heavily modified platform)
- Features(Hyundai cars are upto the neck in features)

A higher price will surely kill it on launch as it wont be attractive enough to woo a Creta purchaser.

Quote:
Next generation Creta may get marginally bigger. But it appears like the H5X and H7X are comparable to the Tuscon and Santa Fe in terms of dimensions and specifications (if we have to compare with the Hyundais).
Both dont sell even Hexa numbers so not sure what market traction would Tata gain from comparing with them. They need volumes on both H5X and H7X for them to succeed. Hyundai at least has one SUV that sells volumes.

Last edited by suhaas307 : 29th September 2018 at 00:37. Reason: Saw the next post / typo
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Old 28th September 2018, 23:07   #704
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re: Tata H5X Concept @ Auto Expo 2018. Named Tata Harrier! EDIT: Launched @ Rs. 12.69 lakhs

This car looks very much like the Range Rover Evoque. UK List price is around 30,000 sterling for the cheapest model. Very highly regarded and very much sought after cars over there.

If it indeed has the same specs as the Evoque then pricing it on par with the Jeep Compass would be amazing value.
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Old 28th September 2018, 23:47   #705
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re: Tata H5X Concept @ Auto Expo 2018. Named Tata Harrier! EDIT: Launched @ Rs. 12.69 lakhs

Really hope the guys at Tata are not reading these posts! Sheesh!! So much of this, that, should be, must be, will be, high price, low price, brand value, 5 seater first, 7 seater first, sales volume, Creta, Jeep and the list goes on. We are all becoming a bunch of self-righteous marketing gurus who can do no wrong.

We have absolutely no clue as to what the specs are going to be, except for the engine and the LR underpinnings. Heck, we don't even know what the tire size is going to be. We don't know how each variant is going to be specced. Let's all take a chill pill and relax.

None of our guesses here are going to matter. Tata will launch their vehicle at the time they are ready and at the price they feel we customers would be willing to pay. There's a vast list of equipment that could feature between each model and the prices could even vary as much as the top variant costing almost twice as much as the base. We are clueless.
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