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Old 22nd October 2018, 14:06   #76
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Default Re: Why is Tata Motors deleting features from its new cars?

My thought is, if a feature in the product is receiving too many complaints, the manufacturer has the right to decide whether to retain the feature or discontinue. Reason being, he has to spend money to resolve the complaints. If the money spent in resolving the complaints(May be free of cost since it is under warranty) is more than money earnt, then, it does not make sense for him to retain the feature in future versions.

So, my assumption is, Tata ASC must have received too many complaints on some of the features that has been removed. Hence, they would have decided to remove some of these features that is causing more burden in resolving the issues.

If you see the list, most of them are electronic jazzy stuff. So, I think they are doing this right. But, in first place, they should have ensured to have better quality of the features rather than removing the features in the second and subsequent versions

By the time, I see this thread, it is already 5 pages. So, I am already too late and hence, not sure if someone has thought in my direction in earlier pages.

Last edited by gkveda : 22nd October 2018 at 14:08.
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Old 22nd October 2018, 15:27   #77
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Default Re: Why is Tata Motors deleting features from its new cars?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aviatoraval View Post
Increase price sensibly but do not omit features.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ashokabs View Post
I have no objection to a manufacturer removing features based on feedback or whatever.

Like the 2 posts I have quoted above, in a large demography like India there are bound to be opposing points of view with regard to features that manufacturers provide over a period of time in their cars. It is not just TATA who are guilty of removing features that were there in earlier iterations.

India is a very price sensitive market and manufacturers are cognizant of this. When a new car is launched I very much doubt that the price of the car will bring in profit for the company. The price and features are offered in such a manner so as to capture the attention of potential customers.

But, the manufacturer is making and selling cars to ultimately make money. They do what ajmat says below.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ajmat View Post
I guess Tata cream profits in two stages

Stage 1: Remove introductory prices
Stage 2: Remove introductory features!
If the manufacturer was to retain all the features AND still make money, what is he to do? The obvious answer is to increase prices. Then, we will have a similar outcry on unreasonable increase in prices and the car being labeled as over-priced.

If you do not like the list of features being provided at a particular price point (irrespective of whether it was provided earlier or not) then don't buy the vehicle.

I am sure the manufacturer is reading all the feedback that have been given in the pages before this. It is up to the manufacturer to decide whether to re-introduce the features or not. And how much of a sales loss they are willing to take if they choose not to re-introduce the features.

It is like being between the devil and the deep blue sea.

Quote:
Originally Posted by maverickxx2006 View Post
My concern was more towards if there are any features/parts that are removed which you would not know and impact structural safety. Not the cosmetic ones.

Since the features removed were obvious you came to know they are removed. How about some internal parts which are not so obvious?

The whole point is about trust. You would lose trust easily with such silly actions.
If we go down this rabbit-hole then there is no end in sight. What if the manufacturer provides all the bells and whistles but removes a critical member of the structure of the vehicle which is not easily visible? How would you know? Remember the missing cross member beam in the Ford Endeavour? Will you lose trust and never buy any vehicles from that manufacturer? If I remember correctly, Ford continues to sell their vehicles. And not too badly if I may add.
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Old 22nd October 2018, 15:52   #78
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Default Re: Why is Tata Motors deleting features from its new cars?

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Originally Posted by Sheel View Post
And may I know as to why is not right? We have [forum members] have almost always noticed missing features and almost always a thread is out in honor of them. So why should we single out Tata?

IIRC, there is a thread for Hyundai/Ford, there must be for others as well if something of this sort has happened.
It just feels like there won't be any conclusion. One will start with the omission of features and 'N' number of forum pages with the same back and forth, left and right discussions. If it is a desperate cry to get attention of the manufacturer, I think it's not the right way. We have always voiced our opinions, our suggestions and sometimes the manufactures seems to have responded and provided the features or the engine options etc.

With all due respect to the moderators and admins, how will anyone here feel if some random person starts to disrespect your job, your service, your company or your car. Being the bigger dog the manufacturers choose to ignore in most cases.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheel View Post
Who wants to be diplomatic, you/me have paid our hard earned money for that particular car in that variant for all those features. You book the car and what you get during delivery is a car which has been stripped of few features, how would that feel?

And you ask me not to be vocal about it, why?
One always have the option to cancel, check with the sales team if anything has changed. If the dealer low ball you that is another story. Being diplomatic makes a big difference.

I do not work for Tata or any manufacturer
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Old 22nd October 2018, 18:33   #79
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Default Re: Why is Tata Motors deleting features from its new cars?

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Originally Posted by blackasta View Post
Had to make an comment - but you must be kidding right?
Not literally but as an example of removing something which doesn't impact actual or primary function of a device.
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Old 22nd October 2018, 21:37   #80
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Default Re: Why is Tata Motors deleting features from its new cars?

Quite amusing to read. Its like a government servant who is on probation ("temporary" as per the Service Rules in the initial stages of his service during his or her first two years). Thereafter he or she becomes "permanent" (no quasi permanency as in the earlier days) and in some cases turns into an "Imbecile Babu."

Tata Motors had lost their market and they had no four wheeler in the Top 20 monthly sales charts for years together. Now some Tata cars are appearing in the Top 20. So they believe they have achieved "permanent" status like a government servant. And they believe they have started capturing the market. This is a misconception and the buyers can dump any brand for personal reasons. Our market rules are different and unpredictable. So if a small level of success has gone into their head, its better they retract and restore the trims.

Since JLR is making losses for Tata Motors, let us see if they are bold enough to remove trims from Jaguars and Landrovers sold in the Western markets ?

Last edited by anjan_c2007 : 22nd October 2018 at 21:39.
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Old 23rd October 2018, 15:55   #81
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Default Re: Why is Tata Motors deleting features from its new cars?

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Originally Posted by anjan_c2007 View Post
Quite amusing to read. Its like a government servant who is on probation ("temporary" as per the Service Rules in the initial stages of his service during his or her first two years). Thereafter he or she becomes "permanent" (no quasi permanency as in the earlier days) and in some cases turns into an "Imbecile Babu."
Hilarious comparison!

I always see the Nexon/Tiago/Tigor TD vehicles outside our office with their sales people. Always someone from our office would be test-driving them. They have managed to sell quite a few Nexons in our office! Next time I'll ask their sales person about the removed features. It'll be quite entertaining to hear their explanations!
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Old 23rd October 2018, 19:06   #82
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Default Re: Why is Tata Motors deleting features from its new cars?

This is what I had written in another thread, but very much relevant here (than there).

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Originally Posted by Jakku View Post
I don't know whether they will recover from the current slump for JLR which is driving down the overall situation for them, but I really hope so and pray for it. However, I am sure about one thing, without a change in the attitude of Tata Motors, this will not be possible.

I am an owner of Nexon and I have seen multiple cuts they are making on the car which was launched. They do it in the name of the feedback from customers and I am really skeptical if that is true. To give an example. I bought XZA+ variant, there is one cut which I really felt missing. The rear 12V socket. They changed from Bridgestone Turanza to Good Year Accelere tyres. Now there is another circular which says they are doing away with the current set of alloys; the "P" button in the front panel which will bring up the camera even when not in reverse gear; the illumination in the power window switches.

Come on Tata, this is pure cheating as the SA will bring a car which has all these as a demo/ test drive car and then when you get one, it will be different. When you complain, you will have a guy from Tata who claims he or she is some territory manager something similar and claim they did it due to customer's feedback. It is better to launch a new version/ "facelift" deleting these features and adding some stickers here and there.

I have been owning Nexon for the last 3 months, no one has called me for a feedback on any feature to know if it is useful or useless. I have 2 friends of mine whom I convinced to go for a Nexon (before my purchase), checked with them as well, none has received such a call. I have 2 colleagues who owns Hexa, I checked with them, none of them have received any such calls. So, I feel, all these "customer feedbacks" are bogus; some ideas generated by some crappy managers at product side (who feels by shaving eyebrows, one's weight can be reduced) been pushed to customer in the name of feedback.

Now, with all these hate, do I still recommend a Nexon to others? Yes, a big yes, it is purely because of the virtue of the car. Had this same car came with the Suzuki logo (absolutely no changes other than logo), it would have been selling in 20K+ becoming the most sold car in a month. The reason why Tata is still struggling with brand value is due to such acts of themselves. A trust once lost will be difficult to regain.

I am really angry and saddened with this attitude of TM.
(mod note:- I hope cross quoting a post is not against the forum rules, if it is, please delete this post; thanks in advance)
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Old 23rd October 2018, 21:00   #83
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Default Re: Why is Tata Motors deleting features from its new cars?

I had booked a Tata Hexa XE (June 2018 model) in Aug 2018 based on the confirmation from the SA that there is no feature deletion happened in the Tata Hexa vehicles that were manufactured on or before June 2018. While taking delivery, I noticed that the front tweeters were missing and the SA / dealership was clueless! I am following-up with the dealer since Aug 2018 till date and it has been a project on its own!

I am thoroughly enjoying my vehicle, however such feature deletions in an abrupt manner with unacceptable reasons, brings down the trust that is created over the last 18+ months. Since the launch of Tata Hexa, TM has attempted to redefine the perception of passenger car from Tata motors, in the right direction. They have to give a serious thinking on such feature deletions (could create new variants to achieve this) in the existing variants that would bring down the trust which is very difficult to rebuild!
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Old 24th October 2018, 08:13   #84
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Default Re: Why is Tata Motors deleting features from its new cars?

Thanks to Gautam Jain for sending this image in. Heartfelt gratitude for sharing it with other enthusiasts via this Team-BHP page!

Underside of the boot lid before:


And now
Why is Tata Motors deleting features from its new cars?-image2.jpeg
Image Source
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Old 24th October 2018, 09:21   #85
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Default Re: Why is Tata Motors deleting features from its new cars?

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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Thanks to Gautam Jain for sending this image in. Heartfelt gratitude for sharing it with other enthusiasts via this Team-BHP page!
That is cheap. Absolutely shameless.

Its not about few missing parts here and there (which are obvious to us), God knows where all these cost cutting measures have gone under the hood which may not be clear to our eyes.

Trust is lost and Tata is surely going the wrong way.

I had my sights on Nexon. I'm very skeptical now. Tata has lost one customer.

Last edited by GTO : 24th October 2018 at 10:42. Reason: Removing image from quoted post
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Old 24th October 2018, 09:37   #86
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Even I had my sights on the Nexon, which is fabulous as a product. However this approach from Tata really put me off and pushed me towards the Ecosport.

Now I know Ford is no saint in this matter either, since even they have been altering features on the Ecosport, but point is that there is a variant on the lineup which has all the features possible, which is not the case for Nexon.

When Tata launched Zest, all the power window controls for all four doors were illuminated. With Tiago, Tigor it came down to only the driver console which was illuminated (understandable for the segment) . With the Nexon it was again only driver side illumination and I was willing to adjust. But even that has been removed. So was the rear foglamp and the charging point.

These small touches really amp up the feel good factor in a car's cabin. This is what Tata needs to keep in mind.
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Old 24th October 2018, 09:50   #87
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Default Re: Why is Tata Motors deleting features from its new cars?

Here is another maker informing customers of the withdrawal of features (or interior configs, as he calls them). How different is this from what TATA is doing?

Why is Tata Motors deleting features from its new cars?-img_20181024_093652.jpg
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Old 24th October 2018, 10:13   #88
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Default Re: Why is Tata Motors deleting features from its new cars?

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Originally Posted by BeantownThinker View Post
.... How different is this from what TATA is doing?
Are there more details to this story?

If Tesla is withdrawing cabin customisation options (if that's what Musk means by 'interior configs'), then it's nothing like what Tata are doing.

Asking a customer to choose from available interior options is one thing - most luxury car manufacturers don't offer anywhere near the customisation options in India that are available to other customers globally - but customers finding out the features they saw and liked (and probably influenced their buying decision) are not present in the car delivered to them at all is an entirely different ball of wax.
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Old 24th October 2018, 10:22   #89
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Default Re: Why is Tata Motors deleting features from its new cars?

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Originally Posted by BeantownThinker View Post
Here is another maker informing customers of the withdrawal of features (or interior configs, as he calls them). How different is this from what TATA is doing?
Entirely Different.

1) He is informing it upfront.
2) He is stating the truth that Tesla is indeed facing production constraints and would really need simplification.
3) Have you gone through their interior config process. It is really vast and customers can really play with lots of features. Feel sad that it's being taken out.
4) He is not stopping this based on Customer Feedback
5) TATA still brings out a test car with all thee features and once you get your own car, it will take weeks to find out what and all are missing. Great to see such a thread which informs truth to customers.

I am in no way defending what he is doing. Just trying to point out how drastically different it is from what TATA is doing.

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Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Thanks to Gautam Jain for sending this image in. Heartfelt gratitude for sharing it with other enthusiasts
I would really love to sit down with the Customer who gave this feedback and would like to know why he made such a great suggestion to TATA.
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Old 24th October 2018, 11:02   #90
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Default Re: Why is Tata Motors deleting features from its new cars?

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Originally Posted by Chetan_Rao View Post
If Tesla is withdrawing cabin customisation options (if that's what Musk means by 'interior configs'), then it's nothing like what Tata are doing.
How? The feature that was provided was that 'x' number of interior configs are available. Now the number of configs available is a number that is less than 'x'. How is this not a deletion or reduction in the features?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RaghuVis View Post
Entirely Different.

1) He is informing it upfront.
2) He is stating the truth that Tesla is indeed facing production constraints and would really need simplification.
4) He is not stopping this based on Customer Feedback
5) TATA still brings out a test car with all thee features and once you get your own car, it will take weeks to find out what and all are missing. Great to see such a thread which informs truth to customers.
So, is our problem that we were not informed of the deletion of the features? Not only are we looking at deletion of features in the same model, but we are ruing the absence of features in other models as well. See the quote below


@akhil994 nothing personal. Your post just happened to be the nearest post to illustrate my point beautifully.
Quote:
Originally Posted by akhil994 View Post
When Tata launched Zest, all the power window controls for all four doors were illuminated.

With Tiago, Tigor it came down to only the driver console which was illuminated (understandable for the segment).

With the Nexon it was again only driver side illumination and I was willing to adjust. But even that has been removed. So was the rear foglamp and the charging point.
Look, folks, I am not defending what the manufacturers are doing, whether it be deletion of features or providing different states of engine tune across markets or outright deletion of structural members. I am just trying to look at it from a different point of view and trying to decide what is acceptable and what is not.

Will I decide not to buy a vehicle because some of the buttons are not back-lit? It is too insignificant to think about.

Will I decide not to buy a vehicle because it provides 'just' 120bhp against the 170bhp it provides internationally? Significant difference, but will decide based on the test-drive.

Will I decide not to buy a vehicle because a structural member is missing? Hell yes.
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