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Old 12th December 2018, 15:49   #61
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Default Re: Supreme Court bans 15-year old petrol & 10-year old diesel vehicles in Delhi-NCR

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Originally Posted by drmohitg View Post
I am facing it with my Altis. Toyota label, extremely well maintained and a car with decent following - all these factors mean nothing.
I think Corollas will be not be on authorities mind to stop and check for 10 years old diesels.

Just remove D-4D monogram (probably change the radiator grill too) and enjoy the car for few more years.
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Old 13th December 2018, 14:32   #62
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Default Re: Supreme Court bans 15-year old petrol & 10-year old diesel vehicles in Delhi-NCR

I get stopped in my old 2004 Esteem quite a bit. I was talking to the traffic cop the other day and he said the maximum number of cars they're catching are old Innovas that are still running on the road past their 10-year life.
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Old 13th December 2018, 18:00   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mayankk View Post
Find your cars marked for extinction here.

http://cpcb.nic.in/delhi-nct-old-vehicles-list/

I'm surprised there has been no challenge to this yet.
This link redirects here:-

http://www.delhi.gov.in/wps/wcm/conn...iesel+vehicles

Not gone through, though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mukeshgoel View Post
I think Corollas will be not be on authorities mind to stop and check for 10 years old diesels.

Just remove D-4D monogram (probably change the radiator grill too) and enjoy the car for few more years.
If authorities rely on that list, would this advise help? The ethical and right way of implementing the decision would be to send notices to the registered owners, not flagging down the vehicles. Stopping vehicles on roads would simply be granting licence to harass.

It seems the case was filed by Sri MC Mehta, a serial PILler. There is an interesting history here. A few decades back, this gentleman filed another PIL seeking closure of a fertiliser factory. (Shriram Fertilisers). The court rejected an application for interim stay of functioni g of the plant. The might this application was rejected, poisonous gas leaked, and 6 or 7 people died. This was some time after the Bhopal tragedy. Anyway, apparently in a knee jerk reaction, the court rendered some directions, which, IMHO, did not change the law a bit, but are considered as landmark decisions.

That decision also marks the beginning of unapologetic and un-camouflaged judicial legislation in India.

In 1996, one of my friends took a bike on a train for a week long trip to what is now NCR. Said that was cheaper. The RTA for NCR has to choose between allowing 4 to 5 k new buses, and allowing public to simply replace the old cars. This will only help car dealers and manufacturers.

And that is what most serial pillers do.

Last edited by tsk1979 : 26th March 2019 at 12:27. Reason: line spacing spelling
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Old 13th December 2018, 19:54   #64
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Default Re: Supreme Court bans 15-year old petrol & 10-year old diesel vehicles in Delhi-NCR

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Originally Posted by mukeshgoel View Post
I think Corollas will be not be on authorities mind to stop and check for 10 years old diesels.

Just remove D-4D monogram (probably change the radiator grill too) and enjoy the car for few more years.
We do not want to advocate or even suggest breaking the law or using 'clever' side slips to get around them.
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Old 28th January 2019, 20:31   #65
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Default Re: Supreme Court bans 15-year old petrol & 10-year old diesel vehicles in Delhi-NCR

Does anyone know what the effect of banning 10/15 year old cars has been on the second-hand car market/resale value of cars in NCR? I am assuming prices would drop quite a bit, cause a 5 year old diesel car will have only 5 years left, so people may not be willing to pay much for it. Or am I wrong? [Of course, cars can be sold in other markets, but how many people are going to do that?]
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Old 28th January 2019, 22:09   #66
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Even if it's not plummeting, the next buyer/greasy dealer will remind you it's scrap and try to play it to his advantage. Tried to evaluate my 6 year old car and the first statement was its got only 4 years left.
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Old 13th February 2019, 15:59   #67
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Default Re: Supreme Court bans 15-year old petrol & 10-year old diesel vehicles in Delhi-NCR

Delhi police explains diesel/petrol NGT rule

Source: Bunny Punia



PS: Read comments at your own risk.
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Old 13th February 2019, 16:18   #68
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Default Re: Supreme Court bans 15-year old petrol & 10-year old diesel vehicles in Delhi-NCR

By Delhi he means Delhi, or does that include ncr?
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Old 13th February 2019, 16:36   #69
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Default Re: Supreme Court bans 15-year old petrol & 10-year old diesel vehicles in Delhi-NCR

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Originally Posted by mayankk View Post
By Delhi he means Delhi, or does that include ncr?
He is from Delhi Police. So, he can talk about Delhi only. Other NCR cities are out of his jurisdiction.
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Old 19th February 2019, 14:49   #70
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Default Re: Supreme Court bans 15-year old petrol & 10-year old diesel vehicles in Delhi-NCR

Anyone knows if the MORTH has actually approached the SC to seek relief for 10 year old+ diesel vehicles that meet the relevant PUC specification? Any related links to the same will be very appreciated.


https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...w/66715418.cms
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Old 19th February 2019, 23:56   #71
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Default Re: Supreme Court bans 15-year old petrol & 10-year old diesel vehicles in Delhi-NCR

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Originally Posted by joybhowmik View Post
Anyone knows if the MORTH has actually approached the SC to seek relief for 10 year old+ diesel vehicles that meet the relevant PUC specification? Any related links to the same will be very appreciated.


https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/...w/66715418.cms
Hope this is true. Isn't that we all have been saying from day one to not paint all vehicles greater than 15 years with the same brush and act logically? I had to part away from my pristine 15 year old Zen and the grief of letting it go is much bigger than welcoming a new swift in exchange. I hope better sense prevails with this proposal and people who spend energy in upkeep of their car don't have to undergo the agony of feeling robbed.
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Old 25th March 2019, 10:43   #72
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Default Re: Supreme Court bans 15-year old petrol & 10-year old diesel vehicles in Delhi-NCR

With a heavy heart, I have to share that our Milemuncher (New Delhi Innova V , Diesel, Mfg and Registration 10/2009) will bid us a tearful farewell today - leaving only memories behind.
I tried my level best to keep the car :
a) Followed up with the TOI to check if their journalists had any news - no dice. The government cannot make a representation, probably due to the policy freeze in the run-up to the elections.
b) Investigated transferring the car to Kolkata - however no B.S. 3 may be transferred there. Odr201775329.pdf
c) Solicited help from Cars24 and Bluejack. Both low-balled me to a ridiculous price point. Never suffered such ignominy before.
d) Asked Toyota - they lo-balled me, and the deal went south.
d) Placed a free ad on OLX. Plenty of interest from dealers, absolutely zero private buyers. Should I mention that all the offers were an insult to the car, and to my blood, sweat and tears spent on the vehicle.
e) Spread the word amongst the grapevine of the friendly A.S.S. and the local taxi-stands. Moderate interest, but again the dealer community showed up at my door-step.
f) Finally, frustrated at the lack of progress , I placed an ad in two vernacular dailies in Rajasthan. Plenty of interest, and I closed the deal with one gentleman. Why Rajasthan - and why not Punjab, U.P. or anywhere else close to Delhi? Simply because I have this perception (bordering on racism), that the average gent from Rajasthan might actually be more law abiding than people from Punjab and/or U.P.


What now? We need a replacement for Milemuncher. Something that will carry out the legacy we've gotten used to - a no frills machine, that simply performs, with minimal intervention. And it HAS to be a small car, our needs have changed. I for one cannot afford to throw away the replacement car after 15 years, and I certainly cannot afford to change my residence address because of it. We need a vehicle that will last our lifetime - not a vehicle which will pander to the wishes of a generally unhealthy population , crying wolf because they were brought to their knees by the slightest breeze in winter.
  • I tried out the Platinum Etios , with an eye out for the Platinum Etios Limited Edition, but what put me off - is that Toyota with all its commiseration for the planet, is still vending B.S. IV.
  • I checked out Mahindra Electric's E2O and eVerito - both failed to impress, despite my low(ered) expectations after reading the relevant official car review.
  • Reachouts to my Officer friend in Maruti Suzuki, resulted in a fair bit of hemming and hawing when it came to reassurances for B.S. VI or EVs
  • In the aftermath of two key hearings at the Hon'ble SC of India in Q4, '18 (on the subject of vehicle pollution) -there was a lot of noise in the media, about how Honda, Toyota, Maruti and others, were gearing up for April 2020 (ref EVs ,PHEV and B.S. VI) . But , for some strange reason, their channels (online and in-store) continue to recourse total ignorance of the shape of things to come. Inventory is top of their minds - obviously. And they don't care two hoots about the environment!
  • Add to that total apathy from all major political parties NONE of their election manifestos or speeches devote 2 lines to the topic of taking care of older cars - demonstrating yet again that people (like us BHPIans) who take care of their vehicles are an insignificant minority.

As my better half quipped, Stop taking care of R3 (Raging Red Rover (R3) - My Mahindra Scorpio S10 4x4). Make sure it's just about road-worthy by the time it's extended warranty is up. And then dispose it. That's exactly what 99% of Delhi's Junta does. And they don't have to suffer the ignominy of what you are going through with Milemuncher.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GTO View Post
Guys, I have criticized this move earlier, but after continually reading about the pathetic pollution levels of our metro cities, I am becoming increasingly inclined to take older cars out of them. ...

Considering how the pollution levels have gotten drastic in Delhi, I am changing my vote and supporting the ban on old cars.
I guess I have one question to ask GTO - Sir you obviously are a car lover, and I have tremendous respect for you; I noted that your vote has changed - ostensibly because older cars are more polluting than newer ones.
I for one ,have decided NOT to purchase a replacement.
If you were in my shoes - would you purchase a new car today? Why?

Last edited by tsk1979 : 26th March 2019 at 12:28. Reason: Added comment. format
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Old 25th March 2019, 20:23   #73
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Default Re: Supreme Court bans 15-year old petrol & 10-year old diesel vehicles in Delhi-NCR

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Originally Posted by joybhowmik View Post
With a heavy heart, I have to share that our Milemuncher (New Delhi Innova V , Diesel, Mfg and Registration 10/2009) will bid us a tearful farewell today - leaving only memories behind. Why?
Excellent post. Completely reflects the emotions of a car lover who has taken care of his ride. The arm twisting by the NGT to sell it, the low balling by buyers and platforms like Cars24 just keep adding to the insult. I have faced the same with my Innova which I sold to a buyer in Kerala and not the Altis which can only run till 2011 legally. And in the end I have decided to just keep driving it and see how things pan out.

What hurts more is that apart from this draconian step, there is no policy change or any step taken to curb down on pollution. Infact as the media is getting more and more active about this topic, I am amused to see that the air quality is foul in almost all cities in India and not just in Delhi as it was made out to be.

So which car did you shortlist then to replace the trusted Innova?
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Old 25th March 2019, 20:33   #74
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Default Re: Supreme Court bans 15-year old petrol & 10-year old diesel vehicles in Delhi-NCR

Unfortunately there are no scrappage benefits in our country unlike UK, where people got good deals on exchange of old polluting vehicles.

Bureaucracy & Judiciary only look at one side of coin not the other. Just because NGT has passed order no steps are taken to compensate aggrieved car owners due to the Draconian order.
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Old 25th March 2019, 21:18   #75
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Default Re: Supreme Court bans 15-year old petrol & 10-year old diesel vehicles in Delhi-NCR

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Originally Posted by drmohitg View Post

So which car did you shortlist then to replace the trusted Innova?
I am pained to hear of the loss of your beloved Innova too Sir! I wish you continue with your Altis till 2021.
I for one, had once thought of brazening it out - just like you! However, recent discussions amongst like minded friends - nudged me into a corner. I came to know that Insurance co.s won't be allowed to provide cover for an NCR number plate, and local fuel bunks won't be allowed to give the relevant (BS 3) PUC certificate, once the 10 years are up. Milemuncher was bought in 2009 for my better half. Sense prevailed, because the last thing we both need, is for some random cop giving her a bad time during her commute.

In terms of a replacement car, we had been thinking of a 4 seater preferably from the Toyota stable, and preferably brand new. We had looked at the Etios sedan - but that purchase wont happen because at the end of the day , it has an ICE - and therefore (for us) does not have an open ended shelf life if it has a DL registration.

For us , this NGT order of scrappage after 15 years is clearly a blatant infringement of our Fundamental Right to Equality. It's nothing short of discrimination -and is based upon where we choose to live - it has absolutely nothing to do with the actual compliance to pollution specs. To think, the order has the blessing of the Hon'ble SC of India - hitherto the champion of the Preamble to Our Constitution, leaves us extremely disappointed with what we believed to be the One and Only functioning Pillar of Democracy. Further, when the Delhi Government collected road tax 10 years ago, they had entered into a contract with us, that does not expire for another 5.
So even the State Government is liable for Breach of Contract.

We are confused about the government's policy too. The government had promised a comprehensive and revamped MV act, no draft has been made available to the general public for comment. We don't know what shape or form it will take. We also don't know , what if anything , the government plans to do , to make Green personal transportation within the common man's reach. Specifically:
  1. Will PHEVs be exempt from the 15 year rule in DL - they have an ICE - no?
  2. Will there be support infrastructure and a regulated marketplace for batteries installed in EVs/PHEVs/FCVs ?
  3. Will the government enact and enforce laws and create Institutions to ensure safety of and OTC delivery/installation of certified OEM batteries through all OMC outlets?
  4. For cars bought and registered till April 2020 - what guarantee does the State and Central Governments, and the Judiciary of India give - that they will not further constrain the law abiding citizen of India, everytime smoke laden winds blow in from U.P. and the Punjab?
  5. The MORTH made a lot of noise, about providing consumer subsidies. But will they ensure price parity of Green Cars and Fossil Fuel cars to the citizen?

Unless, I get convincing answers to the above , I am afraid my money stays in the bank. And SIAM, the Government and all the other Pillars of Democracy can bid a small Source of Revenue - good bye! I encourage others to bite the bullet - and call the bluff that is being foisted on us. Remember, if there's one truth - it's this - MONEY TALKS.

Last edited by tsk1979 : 26th March 2019 at 12:28. Reason: formatting
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