[romeomidhun]

Originally Posted by NiInJa

Suddenly, the Tata Nexon or Ecosport looks like a much better option in petrol avatar. I was expecting the prices to be lower than the BS4 diesel models by a huge margin.

That would have been the case if they had used a <1.2L Petrol engine. Since they use a 1.5L engine, the excise duty is 42% instead of 29%, and that shoots up the price.

Is Maruti creating a vaccum below Brezza's price range for Jimny?

[Reinhard]

Originally Posted by jigar

Maruti has provided fog lamps only on th Zxi+ variant which is ridiculous in my opinion

Trust me, its a boon in disguise. Stock fog lamps generally are quite economy in grade and more cosmetic than utility.

Like majority Marutis - the Brezza is fun to work on. Plonk in a set of HID BiXenon projectors into those dummies and turn night into day with a flick of a button. With dual barrel LED projectors as headlamps & HID fog lights, the Brezza won't have a match in road illumination. Big USP in our dreadful conditions, especially in monsoons.

I think one more thing that the top trims will get over VXi is rear wash wipe. Trust me its a very important item & a significant gain over the lower trims. If Maruti has given it on VXi - kudos to them. I have not been able to view the videos yet I'm afraid.

Originally Posted by romeomidhun

That would have been the case if they had used a <1.2L Petrol engine. Since they use a 1.5L engine, the excise duty is 42% instead of 29%, and that shoots up the price.
This thing has confused me all along.

I'm always confused about how this works exactly. Do we still have excise on auto? Or its now GST? I think it is. In that case - the ex-showroom price shouldn't differ much should it? Or that's really stupid understanding on my side .

Originally Posted by romeomidhun

Is Maruti creating a vaccum below Brezza's price range for Jimny?

But I don't see the slightest chance that they can sell the Jimny cheaper than Brezza. With the Allgrip AWD and pretty good overall equipment quality (assuming they maintain it) - and most importantly it being a "niche vehicle" - the Jimny surely will be sold at a higher price with aspirational value added into the pricing I think. Perhaps they are moving the pedestal further up for the Jimny. Let's see what happens. Interesting times!

[jigar]

Originally Posted by Reinhard

I think one more thing that the top trims will get over VXi is rear wash wipe. Trust me its a very important item & a significant gain over the lower trims. If Maruti has given it on VXi - kudos to them. I have not been able to view the videos yet I'm afraid.

Maruti has not provided rear wash wipe in Vxi. It is provided in Zxi and Zxi+ variants.
Vxi is after all a mid variant and one can't expect everything to be provided here. But kudos to Maruti for giving keyless start/stop and ACC in the mid variant

Also this post marks my transition from Newbie to BHPian

[Leoshashi]

Originally Posted by Reinhard

Trust me, its a boon in disguise. Stock fog lamps generally are quite economy in grade and more cosmetic than utility.

It's true for normal lamps but the LED fogs(going by the experience in Ciaz/XL6) is quite potent. Obviously it's nowhere close to Projector HIDs, but its still something which many people will be satisfied with.

Regards,
Shashi

PS: Rear wash wipe is available from ZXi. VXi gets only defogger.

[Radiator]

The new LXi variant has almost all the features of the previous ZDi except the climate control, alloys,rear defogger and wiper. But, still overpriced.

[padmrajravi]

After Nexon pricing, this does not look all that over priced. Atleast Brezza has got a proper automatic, unlike the AMTs in Tata and Mahindra. Those guys have got an additional star in safety though.

That torque converter even though only a 4 speed unit is a smooth one. You will not realize up or down shifting. If you are not someone who goes beyond 80-90 kmph, this will be a good alternative compared to jerky AMTs. No clutch problems to worry about as well. I would rate it even better than the DCT in Venue for reliability. It is only after the 80 kmph that you will understand the difference between a 4 speed AT or 6 Speed AT. My Xcent's 4 speed AT behaves as good as my Hexa's 6 speed AT till 80 kmph.

[Reinhard]

Originally Posted by padmrajravi

No clutch problems to worry about as well. I would rate it even better than the DCT in Venue for reliability. It is only after the 80 kmph that you will understand the difference between a 4 speed AT or 6 Speed AT. My Xcent's 4 speed AT behaves as good as my Hexa's 6 speed AT till 80 kmph.

This is very true. +1.

I think the overall disappointment is not about it being a 4 AT. But for the asking price being so high for what is a fairly old unit, that didn't need any significant R&D for the Brezza either. Paying a premium for what is perceived to be old, is always frowned upon.

[Leoshashi]

Originally Posted by Reinhard

This is very true. +1.

I think the overall disappointment is not about it being a 4 AT. But for the asking price being so high for what is a fairly old unit, that didn't need any significant R&D for the Brezza either. Paying a premium for what is perceived to be old, is always frowned upon.

I was expecting this huge gap in pricing and now it makes sense why Maruti has opted not to give MT variants Smart Hybrid. The starting price would have been even higher. And overall mileage of AT without the SHVS was very poor. So they had to give in AT and skip on MT variants.

Originally Posted by Leoshashi

Expect the Auto to be priced at a huge premium over the Manual. I'm expecting price difference between the two to be over 1.5 lacs, atleast. In other cars, premium is around a lac or so. But Brezza AT will also have the Smart Hybrid hardware which is quite expensive.

The MRP of MGU unit is around Rs. 45k while the Li Battery unit costs upwards of Rs. 50k. I agree these are MRP and cost to Maruti will certainly be lower. Still they are expected to put an impact on the difference between MT and AT variants.

Regards,
Shashi

[Nithesh_M]

Originally Posted by Leoshashi

Hope this is not the same system/mechanism which had failed in Suzuki Celerio in UK when braked hard.

No it isn't. If I recall correctly this issue was due to the floor carpet getting wedged below the pedal. Suzuki fixed it with a recall I think but the damage was done to the Celerio name.

Anyway on topic, the front grille looks hideous to say the least. It looks like somebody took a paper punch and punched halfway through before changing their mind about it. So instead of a perfect cutout there's an indent there.

[pgsagar]

Originally Posted by padmrajravi

After Nexon pricing, this does not look all that over priced. Atleast Brezza has got a proper automatic, unlike the AMTs in Tata and Mahindra. Those guys have got an additional star in safety though.

That torque converter even though only a 4 speed unit is a smooth one. You will not realize up or down shifting. If you are not someone who goes beyond 80-90 kmph, this will be a good alternative compared to jerky AMTs. No clutch problems to worry about as well. I would rate it even better than the DCT in Venue for reliability. It is only after the 80 kmph that you will understand the difference between a 4 speed AT or 6 Speed AT. My Xcent's 4 speed AT behaves as good as my Hexa's 6 speed AT till 80 kmph.

I couldn't agree with you more. Like you, I prefer TC and CVT (in that order) over DCT/AMT. In addition to unreliability worries, there is some jerkiness in b-to-b crawl in DCT/DSGs. And, now we have some new-found heating issues in some cars. About AMTs, the lesser said the better. Now that Maruti is quitting AMT, I hope Tata / Mahindra will also follow suit and give us TC or CVTs. About 4-speed, I didn't find it bad at all in Ciaz and XL-6. Even Fortuner had 4-speed TC in 2013-14. When they have a 4-speed, they make the 4 th overdrive. In a 5-speed, 5th is OD. In case of more ratios, they are evenly spaced out and shift-ups are less felt. Coming to Brezza, vxi seems to have gotten most things covered. The only sore point seems to be the egg-crate like garishly chromed front grill. It would be better to black it out. Do you think Hybrid system would bump up FE by 25-30 per cent? If that happens, FE would be in the ballpark of erstwhile diesel Brezzas. That would be just fantastic.

[Vid6639]

Yes, the Brezza has been priced on expensive side but if you look at it in relation to the competition, Maruti has priced it quite well. It's quite shocking to be paying 11lakhs for a compact sub 4m SUV even if it is Automatic.

The ZXI AT and ZXI+ AT is what I am looking at as the demand for automatics is huge nowadays.

Compared to the Brezza, the Nexon and XUV300 are nowhere in the picture cause of the AMT which cannot hold a candle to a regular gearbox even if its 4 speed. To top it off the Nexon's price is just 15-20K lower than the Brezza's.

The real competition for the Brezza is the Ford Ecosport and Venue DCT. While the Venue has the better DCT transmission, it is available only in lower SX+ variant which even misses rear washer/wiper.

The Ecosport is better equipped with 6 airbags, sunroof and a 6 speed transmission with paddle shifters. However Ford has removed the SYNC3 system with Android auto and apple car play for Titanium+ and the Ford 1.5L engine is a 3 cylinder which cannot match the refinement of the Maruti K15 4 pot. The Ford is also 25K more than the Maruti.

The Brezza may lose out some fancy features like sunroof as well as important safety kit like 6 airbags but look past these 2 and it's actually a very good package. You get a proper 1.5L 4 cylinder engine, LED headlights, Android Auto/ Apple carplay, smart hybrid system. The only real drawback is the 4 speed auto which can be overlooked if you are mainly into city driving.

For someone who will drive a lot on highway, the Ecosport and Venue will be little more fun to drive but for someone looking for a nice urban commuter with all the needed features, the Brezza is an easy pick.

Maruti has this covered even without the diesel engine IMO.

[SoumenD]

Originally Posted by RM Motorsports

I was very keen to buy an automatic CSUV since Diwali last year...

Luckily I got a fantastic deal for Baleno Alpha CVT ...

Seeing the Brezza Petrol prices, I thank my luck, I didn't wait till date and went for lucrative deal for the Baleno.

And you are not alone. Last year(April,2019) while looking for an AT in this segment, I test drove all available options but Nexon disappointed with the AMT, EcoSport was a guzzler & Brezza didn't have petrol AT. So I ended up with Jazz VX CVT with some great discounts. Checked out venue later & was glad I didn't wait(is cramped compared to Jazz & missed essential features like rear wash wipe in DCT). And now brezza petrol AT pricing has further solidified my decision to have not waited this long. IMO ZXi AT is the minimum variant I will prefer (rear wash wipe, electrically foldable ORVM, touchscreen etc factory fit) but 10L+ ex-showroom is not something I would be comfortable paying for a sub4m car in Bangalore (taxes being more for 10+ vehicles).

Having said that, I think this will still gain some traction in market for following reasons:

1. A Maruti afterall.
2. Smooth conventional and reliable AT box. This segment seriously lacks this. Only option is EcoSport which won't be as frugal and is available only in top trim.
3. A rare safe(relatively) Maruti.
4. Yet to drive it but am expecting the 4 cyl 1.5L to be smoother than the 3cyl competitors

[AYP]

After going through this video-

Originally Posted by Leoshashi

Another detailed walkaround video:

I realised that even though the VXI variant has steering mounted controls, they are only for the volume adjustment, mute and scrolling purpose and not for Bluetooth telephony which is a bummer. I wonder why manufacturers resort to such cheap cost cutting. Bluetooth telephony is a crucial safety feature and not just a convenience IMO, especially for someone who takes a lot of call.

You may watch the video from 3:30 to 4:45 to get the context.

[guptad42]

Originally Posted by Reinhard

Let's not forget that the Brezza gets a proper 4 cylinder smooth engine. Nexon's 1.2 RT can only dream of matching its NVH levels. 4 cylinder engines are considerably costlier to build. Even without a turbo. Then - there is a torque converter transmission, thats again costlier than an AMT. And the SHVS that the Brezza gets. While I feel the system is useless - it still has a significant cost of the MGU and LiIon battery pack. Nexon doesn't have it either.

So I think Maruti is betting on this not being a clear apple-vs-apple comparison & is convinced that they can make sufficient number of customers believe that the price difference is justified and worthy.

Smoothness is not only about number of cylinders. For example, the Venue 1.0 is smoother and more silent even with a 3cylinder turbocharged config.

The fake hybrid SHVS is of no use to general public, and if Suzuki needs it on a 1.5L engine to compete with 1.0 and 1.2 turbos, it's their own problem!

The Vxi is 8.35L, and that itself looks overpriced a little. The ancient 4speed torque convertor Maruti uses is a very cheap part. If a proper 6 speed TC like in Ecosport is sold at a premium of just 90K, the Suzuki 4speed should not be more than 65-75K over the manual. They could have priced it at 9-9.1L for Vxi AT.

It's overpriced by about 70K. In a weak market, that is a large difference. After some initial demand, the Brezza automatics are going to have a very difficult time. Suzuki will lose marketshare in the segment. If they react fast enough, there will be sharp discounts soon. If they don't, the model risks getting classified in the public mind as not successful, and that itself pulls away sales.

[damodar]

Originally Posted by NiInJa

Suddenly, the Tata Nexon or Ecosport looks like a much better option in petrol avatar.

Nexon XM is RS 65000 cheaper than Brezza VXI but still offers ESP, traction control, hill hold control, hydraulic brake assist, electronic brake prefill and roll over mitigation.