[BoneCollector]

Originally Posted by GTO

Would they offer the 1.0L in a higher variant? The 1.5L definitely makes more sense for India though!

Thanks to a Team-BHP Fan (who prefers to stay anonymous) for sending this information in. Heartfelt gratitude for sharing it with other enthusiasts via this Team-BHP page!

I have serious doubts about this. Why would Maruti plonk a 1.0L turbo petrol when they've withdrawn it from the Baleno? Moreover, if they say that it would be difficult to convert it to BS6 without incurring heavy costs, why take this step? Even Ford is not going ahead with the EcoBoost in BS6 avatar.

I still feel that Brezza will come with a 1.5L petrol engine. It has good chances of becoming a blockbuster again.

[distiller]

Yesterday evening on Mahipalpur-Dwarka stretch saw a Brezza which was partially camouflaged. Couldn't make it out if it was the Diesel or the one with Petrol. Although the exhaust canister looked quite similar to existing diesel. And it had no other equipment or instruments attached on outside.

[fiat_tarun]

The 1.0L Turbo even if offered will be an expensive optional engine and the 1.5L NA will be the mainstream offering. I think not having a diesel in the Brezza is definitely going to hurt Maruti.

Originally Posted by BoneCollector

... Even Ford is not going ahead with the EcoBoost in BS6 avatar.

....

The BS6 Ecosport will have the 1.2 TGDI from Mahindra, so although it won't be the Ecoboost, I think it will be a much better suited to India engine (better low end torque).

[arindambasu13]

Originally Posted by BoneCollector

I have serious doubts about this. Why would Maruti plonk a 1.0L turbo petrol when they've withdrawn it from the Baleno?

Originally Posted by fiat_tarun

The 1.0L Turbo even if offered will be an expensive optional engine

Most importantly, the whole point of the Baleno RS was a performance oriented variant of a featherweight car. The Brezza on the other hand weighs much more than the Baleno, and the all important power to weight ratio, if the said 1 liter turbo petrol was to be plonked into the Brezza, will be pretty ordinary.

Therefore, from the performance perspective at least, it makes little sense to offer the Brezza with the 1 liter turbo petrol engine. The 1.5 liter NA petrol will be more suitable though performance is bound to be fairly ordinary as well.

[romeomidhun]

As per my knowledge, in their BoosterJet Avatar, they are adding Turbo and Direct Injection which makes the engine costly. We don't need a DI in it, but just need a good Turbo with the fantastic K12, having a power output of around 110 - 120BHP.

This will give:

i. Good low-end torque compared to the 1L BoosterJet
ii. Better mileage compared to 1.5L NA engine
iii. Tax advantage compared to 1.5L engine
iV. More powerful than both the 1L and 1.5L engines
v. Better price compared to both the 1L and 1.5L engines

Tata did a remarkable job in adding a low-cost Turbo to their 1.2L engine (just 50K more for the Turbo!?). Why can't Maruti do it?

Having driven the K12 for almost 1L KMs (with an average mileage of 19.6KMPL), I don't have even a single complaint about it compared to the competition.

[Reinhard]

Originally Posted by nikipedia87

But I wonder why Maruti didn't consider the 1.4L engine earlier, considering there isn't a world of difference in power and torque numbers between the two engines. It was surely better than the 1.2L iVTEC on the WR-V. Maybe the demand for the diesel variant itself was so high that Maruti never really considered the petrol in the first place.

The Brezza was already selling in 10s of thousands a month. So MSIL didn't have an express need for it. Selling petrol + diesel would have probably caused higher volume demand & longer delivery delays & service queues! Probably the bean counters decided to cap the sales numbers at what they are, and keep milking the MJD1.3 till it is available. Maruti can start selling a petrol car any day & it will sell. So there was no risk in waiting.

A 1.4L engine would take away the sub4m tax benefits from the Brezza & the pricing difference between the diesel & petrol variants would have reduced. Probably making people go for the fuel efficient diesel anyway. Now that the diesel is going out - MSIL is throwing caution to the winds & ignoring the sub4m tax benefits in deciding to plonk in the 1.5L NA petrol.

And boy am I happy to see this! Its so much better to see a larger NA petrol engine in a car. Trying to make 1.2L turbo petrols to somehow meet the sub4m restrictions is plain stupid in my layman's eyes. Turbo engines aren't exactly cheap, so to cut costs, they make them 3 cylinder. Result is pathetic NVH, poor laggy low end, jumpy torque curve!

A nice smooth rev happy petrol engine that responds to a throttle input like imagined in mind in an analogue manner - is worthy of a higher price for higher tax slab IMO. I'm glad the Brezza is getting a "normal" engine!

Originally Posted by romeomidhun

This will give:
i. Good low-end torque compared to the 1L BoosterJet
ii. Better mileage compared to 1.5L NA engine
iii. Tax advantage compared to 1.5L engine
iV. More powerful than both the 1L and 1.5L engines
v. Better price compared to both the 1L and 1.5L engines
Tata did a remarkable job in adding a low-cost Turbo to their 1.2L engine (just 50K more for the Turbo!?). Why can't Maruti do it?

But Tata's is a 1.2L 3 cylinder engine with really poor NVH characteristics. Just adding a turbo in the K12 wouldn't solve the matter. Engines of today are engineered near the tolerance limits of materiel generally in order to keep weight and cost down. Compressed air for combustion would mean larger explosions. That would need the cylinders, heads, pistons & block would all have to be redesigned and strengthened. That would add cost as well. Perhaps sticking to a far linear, reliable & cheaper to make 1.5L NA was a better option based on their tests! Just my guess.

Originally Posted by romeomidhun

Having driven the K12 for almost 1L KMs (with an average mileage of 19.6KMPL), I don't have even a single complaint about it compared to the competition.

Indeed...Very few 1.2L engines ever rode on our roads that were better than the K12b. Probably none will in future too! A masterpiece!

[ank.nsit]

Going by Maruti's philosophy of maximum component sharing between its models (Steering wheel, power window switches, engines etc) it seems a logical conclusion that the Brezza will be powered by Ciaz's engine.

But I guess we will get to know for sure in Jan 2020 when the Brezza petrol is actually launched.

[Leoshashi]

While the 1.5 Petrol is now confirmed, I think the lower variants will also come with a 1.2 option for lower and shocking starting price( Starting from 5.99 Lac claims).

The car with 1.2 won't be too pathetic to drive as it will be a bit heavier than the erstwhile Ritz and it wasn't a bad car to drive at all. The only purpose of that variant will be to show lower starting price and may be better fuel efficiency claims.

Regards,
Shashi

[BoneCollector]

Originally Posted by BoneCollector

I doubt that it'll come with the K12M engine that powers the Ignis, Wagon R or the Baleno. If at all Brezza is launched with a 1.2L petrol engine, it'll be the dualjet variant as it has about 7 bhp (89bhp against 82bhp) more than the regular one, plus dualjet is BS6. If it was to be launched with a 1.2L engine, we would have already seen petrol Brezza in market. I feel it'll be launched with the new 1.5L engine.

Quoting my earlier post in context with what Leoshashi is saying.

Originally Posted by Leoshashi

While the 1.5 Petrol is now confirmed, I think the lower variants will also come with a 1.2 option for lower and shocking starting price( Starting from 5.99 Lac claims).

The car with 1.2 won't be too pathetic to drive as it will be a bit heavier than the erstwhile Ritz and it wasn't a bad car to drive at all. The only purpose of that variant will be to show lower starting price and may be better fuel efficiency claims.

Regards,
Shashi

Ritz petrol was a fantastic car and the 1.2 did a fantastic job on it, be it efficiency or moving it like a rocket. Brezza is a little bit heavier that Ritz but not too heavy. So it may be able to do it's job pretty well. If Brezza comes with a 1.2, it'll mainly be to cut down the entry level Venue but the 1.2 should be the dualjet variant.

[Reinhard]

Slightly OT (apologies) but I'm wondering - will Maruti actually make the Brezza a petrol only car? Why I imagine so -

1. Absolutely no doubt that the Brezza will sell pretty much 1:1 numbers like diesel. MSIL honchos already are confident of that. The sub4m segment's buyers sure are turning to petrol.
2. That will ensure that there is proper distinction between the Brezza & Vitara (assuming its slated to be launched) in power-trains.
3. The Vitara can actually be projected as a more premium offering with more powerful diesel option.
4. It will minimize cannibalization of a costlier Vitara by a cheaper Brezza in the same showroom. Its guaranteed to happen if both are available in diesel.

[Carma2017]

There is no Diesel vehicle planned for any model of Suzuki for FY 2020-21 as per engine parts suppliers. Even if Suzuki comes up with a Diesel it would be in early FY 2021-22.

[BoneCollector]

Brezza will definitely come with 1.5L Petrol. No 1L turbo.

Brezza

Speaking to Autocar India, CV Raman, senior executive director, Maruti Suzuki, spoke of the carmaker’s challenge of marketing small turbo-petrol engines in India. “What we understood from the customer is that he perceives a 1.0-litre engine as a 1.0-litre engine, and he perceives a 1.5-litre engine as a 1.5-litre engine, that is, as a bigger engine. He is not so clued onto whether it is a turbo-petrol or not. Of course, there are connoisseurs and there are enthusiasts out there, but there is a bigger audience which looks at the size of the engine as 1.0-litre, 1.2-litre or 1.5-litre. So, if a 1.0-litre turbocharged is also there, he will consider it to be a smaller engine and not having the necessary torque or the power to propel a bigger vehicle. So he will feel like that. So our analysis shows that he would much rather prefer a 1.5-litre compared to a 1.0-litre.”

[adimicra]

^^

Someone ask this gentleman to come out of the stone age. Please ask Mr. Raman to check the bookings of Kia Seltos 1.4 Turbo, Venue 1.0 turbo or even the Hector 1.4 Turbo.

This line of thought is precisely why Maruti will continue to struggle in higher segments. As the car buyers in India are maturing and moving towards higher segments, Maruti will be struggling big time if they don't change their thought process.

[audioholic]

Originally Posted by adimicra

Someone ask this gentleman to come out of the stone age. Please ask Mr. Raman to check the bookings of Kia Seltos 1.4 Turbo, Venue 1.0 turbo or even the Hector 1.4 Turbo.
This line of thought is precisely why Maruti will continue to struggle in higher segments.

Exactly. That man along with RC Bhargava are still in the stone age. They cant use the example of the Baleno RS and say that customers dont appreciate technology. They replaced a 1.2L four pot engine with a 1.0 three pot with meager increase in power and tried to portray it as a performance car. He should take the Polo petrol as the example, where the GT TSI is in a different league compared to the regular petrol engine. In addition to that, what actually matters is a test drive. My cousin drove the Venue turbo and was mightily impressed by the way the engine was performing. In contrast to Mr. Ramans words "Customer will feel its small" it was the opposite. When that happens, even if you tell the customer its a small engine, they will still be smitten by the test drive. They will still get the Brezza with a 1.5L petrol, give a 5 speed gearbox and tell the customers to be happy about it. For those who are looking at the automatic it will be a dream come true if they even add a fifth cog to their 4AT gearbox which is from the iron age In between all these, enthusiasts can stay on TBHP dreaming about a 1.4L boosterjet or DCT or 1.5L diesel or 1.6L MJD.

[Tom Sooraj]

Maruti Suzuki Vitara Brezza BS6 petrol manual spied.

Link