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Old 5th June 2019, 20:25   #1
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Rumour: Mahindra's 1.2L TGDI to replace Ford's 1.0L EcoBoost in 2020

Ford 1.0 EcoBoost to be replaced by Mahindra's 1.2 TGDI in 2020.

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EcoBoost’s low sales makes upgrading it to BS6 unviable; Mahindra’s new 1.2-litre, which will also power the XUV300, is a more cost-effective alternative for EcoSport.
Quote:
Though the motor will be equipped on the EcoSport initially, it will also power an all-new compact SUV (codenamed: BX744) that is due in 2021. The BX744 will be pitted head-on with the Vitara Brezza and Hyundai Venue, and is expected to have the same squarish and upright proportions.
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Last edited by volkman10 : 5th June 2019 at 20:27.
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Old 6th June 2019, 08:32   #2
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Re: Ford EcoSport S (1.0L EcoBoost) : Official Review

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Originally Posted by volkman10 View Post
Ford 1.0 EcoBoost to be replaced by Mahindra's 1.2 TGDI in 2020.

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The advertised specs for the Mahindra engine looks very good, 230 Nm of torque is no small number! Remains to be seen how the power plant turns out to be in real life driving conditions, but given the turbo-petrol on the XUV300, I am optimistic that this new TGDI engine will be a good performer.

Last edited by Eddy : 6th June 2019 at 16:40. Reason: typo
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Old 6th June 2019, 09:17   #3
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Would this affect the existing owners of Ecoboost engined cars wrt availability of spares??
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Old 6th June 2019, 11:29   #4
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Rumour: Mahindra's 1.2L TGDI to replace Ford's 1.0L EcoBoost in 2020

According to a media report, Ford is likely to discontinue the 1.0-litre EcoBoost engine in India after the BS-VI emission regulations kick-in from April 2020. Ford is expected to replace it with Mahindra's 1.2-litre turbocharged petrol engine (TGDI).

Rumour: Mahindra's 1.2L TGDI to replace Ford's 1.0L EcoBoost in 2020-2018fordecosports20.jpg

Ford's 1.0-litre EcoBoost engine is imported into India and accounts for a small portion of the total EcoSport sales. Upgrading it to meet the BS-VI norms could prove to be financially unfeasible. Besides, Mahindra's 1.2-litre, 3-cylinder, direct-injection, turbo petrol engine is reported to produce more power and more torque than the EcoBoost engine. It is said to put out 128 BHP and 230 Nm of torque, while the EcoBoost engine puts out 121 BHP and 150 Nm of torque.

In addition to the EcoSport, Mahindra's 1.2-litre TGDI unit could also power the upcoming compact SUV (codename: BX744). It is expected to compete with the likes of the Maruti Vitara Brezza and Hyundai Venue. The 1.2-litre and 1.5-litre Dragon series engines are expected to be upgraded to meet BS-VI norms.

Reports suggest that Mahindra might also offer the 1.2-litre TGDI engine on the XUV300 and it could be paired with a dual-clutch automatic transmission.

As part of the Mahindra-Ford partnership, both companies have agreed to share powertrains and co-develop future products.

Source: Autocar India
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Old 6th June 2019, 11:47   #5
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Re: Rumour: Mahindra's 1.2L TGDI to replace Ford's 1.0L EcoBoost in 2020

Actually, this uncertainty with engines, which is likely to persist till Jan-2020, could be the reason that's pushing down sales for every manufacturer. Basing my argument on my own position here. Don't want my new car's heart to be at its EOL. Maruti-Suzuki's plans are hazy. Hyundai and Mahindra have shown us one engine. Others haven't indicated any signs of what's to come either. Months of dilemma ahead.
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Old 6th June 2019, 12:37   #6
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Re: Rumour: Mahindra's 1.2L TGDI to replace Ford's 1.0L EcoBoost in 2020

Why almost every auto sector manufacturer is not clear about its strategy post implementation of Euro VI norms when India is not the first one to enforce them?

All of the Indian players are operating in western markets with a product range that complies with the prevailing Euro VI norms and / or USEPA standards. I am at a loss as to why there is so much of noise.

If all the issues are clubbed together (most of it will be common across globe)

- Stringent emission standards (Euro VI)
- Vehicle safety standards (India specific - quite late compared to other countries)
- Registration period for diesel motors reduced from 15 to 10 years (India specific NGT)
- Traction towards fuel cells / electric vehicles (across the globe)

Issues related to item 1 and 2 are already been addressed at global level / other markets.
Issues pertaining to reduced registration period should not concern manufacturers
Last issue is common across all markets and certainly (except M&M and Tata's) the solution is not going to come from India at all.

Is it too big or somehow these companies are scared of letting go their fat margins?

Cheers !

Last edited by i74js : 6th June 2019 at 12:40.
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Old 6th June 2019, 12:38   #7
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Re: Rumour: Mahindra's 1.2L TGDI to replace Ford's 1.0L EcoBoost in 2020

I think this is a good thing. I was never really impressed with the 1L Ecoboost (with my limited experience) giving our crowded cities and bumper to bumper traffic. Below the turbo zone it really struggles, although the new 6 speed transmission helped solve this to an extent.

Mahindra's 1.2L GDI should perform much better and will be fun to drive in a Ford. Additionally, the 1L Ecoboost is imported while the Mahindra engine will be locally produced and hence should be cheaper to buy and own as well.

Last edited by fiat_tarun : 6th June 2019 at 12:40.
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Old 6th June 2019, 16:03   #8
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Re: Rumour: Mahindra's 1.2L TGDI to replace Ford's 1.0L EcoBoost in 2020

Is BSVI more stringent than Euro6?

I'm puzzled to read that a currently Euro6 compliant engine needs significant investment to upgrade to BSVI? What is this new standard?

Not being sarcastic but I really like to know.
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Old 6th June 2019, 16:16   #9
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Re: Rumour: Mahindra's 1.2L TGDI to replace Ford's 1.0L EcoBoost in 2020

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Originally Posted by kiku007 View Post
Is BSVI more stringent than Euro6?

I'm puzzled to read that a currently Euro6 compliant engine needs significant investment to upgrade to BSVI? What is this new standard?

Not being sarcastic but I really like to know.
This is a good point and it crossed my mind too. While BS6 is not more stringent than Euro 6, it is almost on par. Euro 6 has 3 stages (6B - 6D) and BS6 is equivalent to Euro 6B IIRC.

Ford already has a Euro 6 1L Ecoboost which they can continue to import, but I think they don't have a business case to localise this engine and be more competitive. This is where this 'JV' with Mahindra makes sense and helps both parties.

Last edited by fiat_tarun : 6th June 2019 at 16:20.
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Old 6th June 2019, 16:43   #10
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Re: Rumour: Mahindra's 1.2L TGDI to replace Ford's 1.0L EcoBoost in 2020

I am keen to know the refinement levels of the 1.2L TGDI with respect to the 1.0 Ecoboost, especially since the latter is a winner of (many an) engine of the year awards.

Slightly but are the small capacity direct-injection turbo petrols designed to work best with only with an AT?
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Old 7th June 2019, 01:40   #11
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Re: Rumour: Mahindra's 1.2L TGDI to replace Ford's 1.0L EcoBoost in 2020

Quote:
Originally Posted by TusharK View Post
It is said to put out 128 BHP and 230 Nm of torque, while the EcoBoost engine puts out 121 BHP and 150 Nm of torque.
IIRC, doesn't the EcoBoost produce 123 BHP and 170 Nm of torque? So while there's only a minor difference in power output, the torque is more than a significant upgrade. Hope it drives well too!
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Old 7th June 2019, 01:57   #12
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Re: Rumour: Mahindra's 1.2L TGDI to replace Ford's 1.0L EcoBoost in 2020

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Originally Posted by fiat_tarun View Post
This is a good point and it crossed my mind too. While BS6 is not more stringent than Euro 6, it is almost on par. Euro 6 has 3 stages (6B - 6D) and BS6 is equivalent to Euro 6B IIRC.

Ford already has a Euro 6 1L Ecoboost which they can continue to import, but I think they don't have a business case to localise this engine and be more competitive. This is where this 'JV' with Mahindra makes sense and helps both parties.
Yeah, so it's a matter of Ford not wanting to spend time and effort on a non-seller engine and not much to do with BSVI compliance.

I'm not a fan of the 1L Ecoboost but the last thing I expect that to be blamed for is not meeting Indian emission norms.

Last edited by kiku007 : 7th June 2019 at 01:59.
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Old 7th June 2019, 12:20   #13
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Re: Rumour: Mahindra's 1.2L TGDI to replace Ford's 1.0L EcoBoost in 2020

To simplify, no one is buying the EcoBoost anyway and Mahindra-Ford want to show more benefits of their partnership to board members.

I've never liked the EcoBoost and would any which day pick the 1.5L naturally-aspirated Dragon engine over it. Good riddance, IMHO. Also, based on what we're seeing of Mahindra's new engines, this might just be good news.

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Originally Posted by Prakritij View Post
Would this affect the existing owners of Ecoboost engined cars wrt availability of spares??
Not anymore than it already is. End of the day, this is a fully imported engine. I wouldn't worry too much though. Engines are changed & upgraded frequently by so many manufacturers (e.g. VW too).

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Originally Posted by i74js View Post
Why almost every auto sector manufacturer is not clear about its strategy post implementation of Euro VI norms when India is not the first one to enforce them?
Great post - thanks .
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