[boniver]

Originally Posted by sainyamk95

Spotted these 2 - and 4 - door beauties racing on the Mumbai Pune expressway hours back. I'm confused. Are they Wranglers or Thars? They looked too good to be from Mahindra.

It's the 2018 Jeep Wrangler spotted on this thread (2018 Jeep Wrangler spotted in India).

(I personally find the Wrangler better looking than the current Thar)

It is much better looking than the Thar.

[TusharK]

Thanks to the Team-BHP fan (he prefers to remain anonymous) who sent this information in. Heartfelt gratitude for sharing it with other enthusiasts via this page!



The fourth-generation Jeep Wrangler may not get a diesel engine option at all. Instead, the SUV is likely to be offered with a 2.0-litre petrol engine. In the US, this 2.0-litre, 4-cylinder unit produces 270 BHP and 400 Nm of torque.

With a smaller capacity engine (under 3.0-litre) and a Freight on Board (FOB) price of less than US$ 40,000, the new Wrangler will qualify for the lower peak customs duty of 60%. Therefore, we can expect the price to come down. Imported cars that cost more than US$ 40,000 attract 100% customs duty.

Reports suggest that Jeep might re-badge the Rubicon variant as the Moab in India. Other variants like Overland and Sahara might also be on offer.

The new Jeep Wrangler is scheduled to be launched on August 9, 2019.

Link to Team-BHP News

[bigron]

At a time where even hatchbacks want to masquerade as SUV's, this is the original bad boy. Still much better off road then on it. A very very competent off roader it will mostly be bought for its timeless design and novelty here.
Over the years they have added features and improved creature comforts and the new cabin is particularly tasteful.
I am not to sure a 2 liter all petrol motor under a 2100 kg car will attract a lot of buyers in India. They should bring in a diesel if for nothing else just to attract some numbers.

[Turbanator]

Originally Posted by bigron

I am not to sure a 2 liter all petrol motor under a 2100 kg car will attract a lot of buyers in India. They should bring in a diesel if for nothing else just to attract some numbers.

It's actually a very good motor, you will hardly notice the difference when compared with the 6 cylinders as both now come with ZF gearbox which has made a lot of difference.

Regarding Diesel, I am not sure if anyone will be interested in given the uncertainties especially here in NCR.

Let's see how they price but in any case, this will be a niche vehicle.

[bigron]

I ve been told that it's a great motor and almost matches the old v6 in performance with far better mpg numbers.
I was taking in the context of India, and how big bulky all petrol SUV's are perceived here.

[shankar.balan]

This new Wrangler (JL) will end up being a pure niche vehicle at these prices. I think the new Mahindra Thar whose design seems to have clearly been 'inspired by' the Jeep Wrangler itself, judging by the spy pics, will get a strong fillip in sales as the comfortably affordable diesel powered 'Desi Wrangler'.
Maybe Jeep would indeed do well to re build their alliance with Mahindra so that if nothing else, they can leverage Mahindra's years of making Jeeps in order to actually make some utility Jeeps which, 'normal' people can get to buy.
In India, the Jeep brand has gone very far away from its humble 'utility' origins and landed in the 'stratosphere' thus putting it way way above the reach of simple blokes like us...

[4x4addict]

The Wrangler is made at Jeep's Toledo factory in the USA. One of the reason's given for the high cost of the current model is that the diesel engines are not made in USA and have to be imported into USA (with whatever, cost/freight/duty) and then installed in the Wrangler at the plant. Hence the diesel model has a higher cost due to this.

Now that they are planning the 2.0 Turbo Petrol, I think there will be some cost rationalization. With the difference between Petrol and Diesel having come down to under 10 Rs with the efficiency of modern Direct Injection/Turbo petrol engines mated to 8-Speed Automatics, It makes no sense to get the diesel.

The international reviews of the 2.0 Turbo Petrol with 8Speed ZF automatic is quite good.

Besides someone who can afford 70+ lakhs on the road, won't worry about another 20K per year in fuel costs.

[bigron]

Originally Posted by 4x4addict

Besides someone who can afford 70+ lakhs on the road, won't worry about another 20K per year in fuel costs.

That's actually not true. Even people who buy 70 lakh plus vehicles are swayed by the recurring petrol fuel bills if the vehicles average is dismissal. A look at the number of units of luxury cars sold with a diesel motor compared to petrol is an attestation to this.

The only exception to the rule is if its a purely lifestyle vehicle taken out for very short rides over the weekend/ random evening get togethers or if your daily commute to work is in single digit kms.
Anything longer and you start feeling the pinch.
A suv like this is competent enough to tour extensively in our country and an only petrol motor will act as a deterrent for any one thinking of touring in one.

A sports car or a spots sedan can get away with a petrol only motor but a big bulky SUV with a 2 lt petrol engine how ever efficient and brilliant it is will find it hard to pull in the niche crowd.

[4x4addict]

Originally Posted by bigron

That's actually not true. Even people who buy 70 lakh plus vehicles are swayed by the recurring petrol fuel bills if the vehicles average is dismissal. A look at the number of units of luxury cars sold with a diesel motor compared to petrol is an attestation to this.

I would agree with you when it comes to large luxury cars which comes with Large capacity Petrol engines which invariably V6 or V8. But with small capacity modern petrol engines, the FE is almost on par with their large diesel counterparts. With the Jeep the older 2.8 CRDe and the 2.0 Turbo Petrol will give similar mileage.

[bigron]

Agreed. On paper and in reality, this 2.0 lt engine has similar performance to the older V6 and is much much better in terms of mpg.
Unfortunately, in a country like ours, perception plays a very important role when shortlisting a 70/80 lakh car.
A lot of people thinking its a 2.0 liter engine will be put off simply because according to them a car that expensive cannot come with a 2 lt engine. After all 2 lt is what the Superb or the Passat bring to the table.
Anyhow, lets see how this one fares.

[suneel]

Originally Posted by bigron

Agreed. On paper and in reality, this 2.0 lt engine has similar performance to the older V6 and is much much better in terms of mpg.
Unfortunately, in a country like ours, perception plays a very important role when shortlisting a 70/80 lakh car.
A lot of people thinking its a 2.0 liter engine will be put off simply because according to them a car that expensive cannot come with a 2 lt engine. After all 2 lt is what the Superb or the Passat bring to the table.
Anyhow, lets see how this one fares.

It isn't just a 2.0 Liter petrol engine. It's a hybrid engine and a significant portion of the torque and power are coming from the battery of the hybrid motor. If people don't understand that important distinction and still perceive it to be equivalent to an economy car with a regular 2.0 liter 4 cylinder engine, then that's their loss. This thing is putting our stronger numbers than a lot of old V6s and inline 6s (my old E280 has a 3.0 L V6 that puts out 190 bhp and my old E46 330ci had a 3.0 L inline 6 that put out 220 bhp).

I also can't fathom how anyone that can afford a 70+ lakh can would then have issues with being able to afford gas for it whether the mpg is 18 (3.6 pentastar) vs 21 (2.0 turbo).

[bigron]

@suneel - Like I mentioned in my previous post. Lets see how this shapes up.
But from what I understand of the Indian luxury SUV market, this is not going to sell.

Maybe you cannot fathom but a 70/80 lakh car buyer is definitely affected by fuel economy if his regular ride gives him lower single figure fuel economy. A 1.5, 2 cr buyer is not but a 70/80 lakh buyer definitely is.

[Turbanator]

Originally Posted by 4x4addict

The Wrangler is made at Jeep's Toledo factory in the USA. One of the reason's given for the high cost of the current model is that the diesel engines are not made in USA and have to e imported into USA (with whatever, cost/freight/duty) and then installed in the Wrangler at the plant. Hence the diesel model has a higher cost due to this.

Even the Petrol 4 Cylinders come from Italy So I think, it's more to do with having only limited and manageable options given the low numbers they plan to sell.

[/quote]

Originally Posted by suneel

It isn't just a 2.0 Liter petrol engine. It's a hybrid engine and a significant portion of the torque and power are coming from the battery of the hybrid motor.

It's mild hybrid and that can have any definition, even our local Marutis have such nomenclature. I am not sure if that Half second of Extra Torque is actually going to help an off-roader.

[quote]With the turbo four—closely related to the engine in the Alfa Romeo Giulia and Stelvio—the Wrangler is even quicker. Despite being slightly down on power compared with the six, it hits 60 in 6.5 seconds. It seems relevant to mention that the four is built in Termoli, Italy, and that Italians hate losing races

t’s not the sole source of propulsion—a turbocharged 2.0-liter four-cylinder does most of the work—but a 22-hp motor does double duty as a starter for the stop-start system and contributes up to 71 pound-feet of torque for up to a half-second when pulling away from a stop.
.

source for both above Quotes - https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...linder-hybrid/

Originally Posted by bigron

But from what I understand of the Indian luxury SUV market, this is not going to sell.

It's definitely not going to sell but not because of Petrol or Diesel

It will be more like a weekend vehicle for someone who already has other cars. They are not planning to compete with Endeavour/ Fortuner or any German sedan customers. So why bother with Diesel which is no longer preferred in at least one of the major market - Delhi NCR.

[suneel]

Originally Posted by bigron

Maybe you cannot fathom but a 70/80 lakh car buyer is definitely affected by fuel economy if his regular ride gives him lower single figure fuel economy. A 1.5, 2 cr buyer is not but a 70/80 lakh buyer definitely is.

Well then call me crazy, because I am one of those buyers that wouldn't complain about 18 mpg after buying a 70+ lakh car.

Originally Posted by Turbanator

With the turbo four—closely related to the engine in the Alfa Romeo Giulia and Stelvio—the Wrangler is even quicker. Despite being slightly down on power compared with the six, it hits 60 in 6.5 seconds. It seems relevant to mention that the four is built in Termoli, Italy, and that Italians hate losing races

That's interesting that the battery only contributes a small fraction of the raw end hp and torque numbers. I guess I just assumed it was more from what reviewers described the experience as. But I think describing the difference just as a half a second off the line doesn't paint an accurate picture of how it must feel to actually drive the hybrid.

"From behind the foldable windshield, the bigger difference between the two engines is the 2.0-liter’s off-idle responsiveness. With the electric motor filling in for the moment it takes the twin-scroll turbocharger to wake up, the hybrid system’s torque delivery makes the Wrangler seem as if it has a 5.9-liter AMC V-8 under the hood. Peak twist, 295 pound-feet, arrives at 3000 rpm. That’s 35 more pound-feet 1800 rpm earlier than the V-6 manages."

Another quote from the same article https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...linder-hybrid/

[Turbanator]

Originally Posted by suneel

Well then call me crazy, because I am one of those buyers that wouldn't complain about 18 mpg after buying a 70+ lakh car.
Another quote from the same article

No, you are right. There is a difference if you have to buy something when you are convinced and the scenario where you are simply comparing with other options in which case you consider a lot of things. I think Germans have set Diesel benchmark very high. There is practically nil difference between Petrol/ Diesel or on the contrary, the kick from Diesel, especially from BMW, is even better than Petrol.

I read that V8 quote as well but am not sure if its a paid Auto talk or actual so will reserve my views till we get something here. I hope you must be in touch with Fiat guys privately, do update us when are they delivering your Jeep

Any confirmation on 2 Doors or will they launch only unlimited