[tsk1979]

Originally Posted by sujaylahiri

Or something like a BMW 3 series diesel which will give you anywhere between 35-40 mpg average (city and highway) and tons of useful lower end torque as well.

Of course diesels rule. Thats why Europe is going diesel. I was just speaking about petrol cars. A diesel hybrid would be the win win solution

[sujaylahiri]

Originally Posted by tsk1979

Of course diesels rule. Thats why Europe is going diesel. I was just speaking about petrol cars. A diesel hybrid would be the win win solution

To further reinstate your point, I think the only people in America who buy hybrids (esp. SUV's) are celebrities and soccer moms. They wanna do something for the environment after buying that expensive fur coat.

I'm pretty sure as we are talking here, VW is working on their spanking new diesel hybrid technology in Deutschland.

[StarScream]

Originally Posted by sujaylahiri

Just get a Volkswagen 1.9 TDi. End of story. All hybrids are a joke. It's a scam.

Now that's a sweeping statement if there ever was one.

Originally Posted by sujaylahiri

To further reinstate your point, I think the only people in America who buy hybrids (esp. SUV's) are celebrities and soccer moms. They wanna do something for the environment after buying that expensive fur coat.

I'm pretty sure as we are talking here, VW is working on their spanking new diesel hybrid technology in Deutschland.

Now, Im not a soccer mom or a celebrity . But I would like to do whatever I can for the environment. The way I see it, currently a hybrid is the answer. In India, diesels pollute more - that is a fact. Our emission laws allow diesels engines to emit more than petrol engines. Hence I want a petrol car that has high fuel efficiency and low emissions. Give me a diesel car in India whose emission is the same as a petrol car and I will consider it. It just isn't the case right now.

[csentil]

I personally know quite a few ordinary people in the US who have hybrid cars, typically the Prius & the Honda models. And no they are not celebrities or soccer moms.

I've seen especially in California that there's a lot of awareness on this front.

Atleast someone's gone a few steps which is far better than doing nothing at all and pointing fingers at those who have decided to do their little bit.

Agreed that the Americans don't want to sign the Kyoto Protocol or set dates on emissions cuts but that doesn't mean everyone is like that.

In these days of emissions trading, carbon offsets & carbon credits, a lot of westerners have started following this to reduce their carbon footprint.

[StarScream]

Originally Posted by csentil

I personally know quite a few ordinary people in the US who have hybrid cars, typically the Prius & the Honda models. And no they are not celebrities or soccer moms.

I've seen especially in California that there's a lot of awareness on this front.

Atleast someone's gone a few steps which is far better than doing nothing at all and pointing fingers at those who have decided to do their little bit.

Agreed that the Americans don't want to sign the Kyoto Protocol or set dates on emissions cuts but that doesn't mean everyone is like that.

In these days of emissions trading, carbon offsets & carbon credits, a lot of westerners have started following this to reduce their carbon footprint.

well said Csentil. Eco-consciousness knows no borders. If one is educated and can afford green technology, then why not?

[Hyundai.Lover]

Originally Posted by StarScream

good stuff Hyundai.Lover. Or should that be Honda.Lover now?

Na, it will remain hyundai.lover and never ever wanted to have atleast Civic Hybrid.

[diabloo]

Hyundai.Lover is Honda.Spotter .
So Hybrid Civic is coming as expected .

Originally Posted by StarScream

good stuff Hyundai.Lover. Or should that be Honda.Lover now?

Originally Posted by Hyundai.Lover

Today spotted hybrid civic on expressway, noida.

[Hyundai.Lover]

Originally Posted by diabloo

Hyundai.Lover is Honda.Spotter .
So Hybrid Civic is coming as expected .

have ya seen one?

[sujaylahiri]

If you check out the performance and fuel economy figured for diesels and hybrids in this article, you'll see that they are astonishingly close to each other.
Diesel Vs. Hybrid - Popular Mechanics

With modern day diesels, emissions is not a problem, as they are all pretty clean. It's a different thing in the States though as they didn't have Ultra Low sulphur diesel (ULSD) available until last year and they have never encouraged diesel powertrains.

I think a smart move in a country like India will be to introduce highly efficient and clean diesels instead of the more expensive hybrid option. And of course introduce ULSD in India.

[iraghava]

Originally Posted by StarScream

But I would like to do whatever I can for the environment. The way I see it, currently a hybrid is the answer.

Actually no, if you do your research a bit more closely you'll realise that there are a lot of normal Petrol & Diesel cars which beat hybrids in these areas. Common points people forget to consider when talking about these hybrids due to all the hype around them are:

1. Ok they use electricity but remember that the electricity is being produced in a power plant spewing a lot more pollutants & damamging the environment much more than your puny car will.

2. Also, what about the cost & disposability of the batteries used in the cars?? This is an issue that hasn't been solved yet.

[StarScream]

Originally Posted by sujaylahiri

If you check out the performance and fuel economy figured for diesels and hybrids in this article, you'll see that they are astonishingly close to each other.
Diesel Vs. Hybrid - Popular Mechanics

With modern day diesels, emissions is not a problem, as they are all pretty clean. It's a different thing in the States though as they didn't have Ultra Low sulphur diesel (ULSD) available until last year and they have never encouraged diesel powertrains.

I think a smart move in a country like India will be to introduce highly efficient and clean diesels instead of the more expensive hybrid option. And of course introduce ULSD in India.

I don't dispute that. Like I said, if I get a clean diesel with high FE in India and low emissions (or at least the same as an equivalent petrol) I will consider it. I just don't see it happening soon. Therefore I see hybrids as the only option meeting the criteria for a car the size of a Civic.

Originally Posted by iraghava

Actually no, if you do your research a bit more closely you'll realise that there are a lot of normal Petrol & Diesel cars which beat hybrids in these areas.

Really? Which areas? Which cars? Remember I'm talking about the choices in the Indian market. Sure I can great FE from an Alto but I want the same FE from a car the size of a Civic or larger.

Originally Posted by iraghava

Common points people forget to consider when talking about these hybrids due to all the hype around them are:

1. Ok they use electricity but remember that the electricity is being produced in a power plant spewing a lot more pollutants & damamging the environment much more than your puny car will.

2. Also, what about the cost & disposability of the batteries used in the cars?? This is an issue that hasn't been solved yet.

Hmm. I think you need to do your research iraghava. You're confusing an electric car that needs to be plugged in with a hybrid. A hybrid (however puny!) stores energy from the car's motion and breaking in a battery that powers the electric motor. It does not have to be plugged in.
Now, does the disposal of the battery pollute? I don't know. For that matter will the fuel cells of fuel cell cars pollute when they are disposed off? I don't know but let's start with some part of the life cycle of a car and minimize the impact on the environment. That is my logic, however faulty if may seem to you.
We are shifting to CFL bulbs wholesale but their disposal is a real hazard, much more than regular bulbs - so what should one do? Not use them?

[vasudeva]

The more fuel/energy consumed, the more global warming. Hybrids have grown in sales only because they deliver more FE, which results in less money spent at the pump, and less CO2 emissions. You can say that the `carbon footprint' is more important, but the IEA has proved that `hybrid cars' have a lesser `carbon footrpint' than comparable non-hybrid cars. Spot the number of hybrids and non-hybrids in the US EPA'a list of most FE cars for 2008

Toyota Prius 48/45
Honda Civic Hybrid 40/45
Nissan Altima Hybrid 35/33
Ford Escape Hybrid FWD 34/30
MazdaTribute Hybrid FWD
Mercury Mariner Hybrid FWD
Toyota Camry Hybrid 33/34
Toyota Yaris (manual) 29/36
Toyota Yaris (automatic) 29/35
Ford Escape Hybrid 4WD 29/27
Mercury Mariner Hybrid 4WD
Mazda Tribute Hybrid 4WD
Toyota Corolla (manual) 28/37
Honda Fit (manual) 28/34

[StarScream]

good point Vasudeva. thanks for the info.

[ShaKo]

Any guesses on the likely prices of the Civic Hybrid and Prius ?