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Old 7th September 2019, 14:01   #31
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Default Re: Harrier: 5 year / unlimited km extended warranty coming as Tata tries to revive sales

The famed Hyundai quality is a myth. My 2014 Verna's seat chassis(both front seats) are covered in rust, car had a coolant leak right from day 1, the dreaded steering column rattling issue is also present from the first day & there is a constant squeaking sound from the driver side c pillar & its some welding issue which I understand is present in mostly all cars. For both the steering and c pillar issue i didnt bother to follow it up with Hyundai as the service centre denies there is even any sound. The plastic, fit finish etc which has been glorified since years is good no doubt but its just that, good not anything out of the world. My 6 lakh Tiago has overall better quality interiors than the million rupee Verna. Those who say that the Harrier's interior quality dosent even match that of the Santro are either saying without seeing the car or just plain ignorant. How is a manufacturer able to get away with such grave issues and still sell thousands of cars?

Sorry to say but according to me Hyundai is the darling of Team Bhp. They make what i like to call 'make up wali cars'. They focus only on the interiors and gadgets and that's where the good things end. i have driven the santro, i20, verna, elite i20 and all of them had pathetic driving dynamics.

The niggles in the Harrier shouldn't have occurred in the first place and the manufacturer should be criticized but saying that its a write off is not done. Car sales in our country don't work like some of the members here think. If Harrier's sales have nosedived because of niggles and quality issues how come a new entrant like MG receive 28k bookings for a Chinese junk car which which has been involved in numerous breakdowns not niggles or teething problems but complete breakdown in the middle of the road.

The 'aam junta' is concerned with 'Sunroof, touchscreen, air purifier, car starting with remote' and not with ride, handling, safety or mechanicals and that's why brands like MS, Hyundai rule here and new ones like MG are received well
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Old 7th September 2019, 14:15   #32
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I don't think any manufacturer in the country does anything special with respect to quality. They're all pretty much the same. Honda and Toyota are global standards and we've seen issues with their vehicles. All manufacturers skimp when it comes to the Indian market and the only reason is that the laws are lax and we don't have choice. Maybe the issue is with the OEM suppliers who just aren't good enough or they're the ones who want to extract every Re.
Tata Safari has a cult following not because it's a good vehicle but because it is true to its purpose. The Gypsy is an absolute crap car but for the intended purpose (and price) its VFM. If Tata had marketed and sold the Harrier as a 4x4 Safari replacement, it'd have done well. I still think it's a good, well intentioned effort and I'd have bought it if there was an automatic available.

Last edited by Rudra Sen : 7th September 2019 at 15:33. Reason: typo edited
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Old 7th September 2019, 22:33   #33
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Default Re: Harrier: 5 year / unlimited km extended warranty coming as Tata tries to revive sales

Its a fine car, yeah could have been better, but its a fine car. Everyone has an opinion about tata cars and that just contributes to too much tata bashing. That Warranty is a welcome move though!
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Old 8th September 2019, 09:39   #34
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Default Re: Harrier: 5 year / unlimited km extended warranty coming as Tata tries to revive sales

Looking at Nexon's sterling quality, I am inclined towards Harrier. We might add the BS6 Diesel to our garage. There is a toss up between the Kona and Harrier, right now as family wants an automatic and Kona shined through in every department. Harrier's quality issues do not scare me as this is one exceptional product in that space, and the best designed car on road - today.

Wish it had interior air filtration system like Seltos. That's really needed these days.

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Those who say that the Harrier's interior quality dosent even match that of the Santro are either saying without seeing the car or just plain ignorant
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Old 8th September 2019, 14:16   #35
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Default Re: Harrier: 5 year / unlimited km extended warranty coming as Tata tries to revive sales

Even though Indian consumers have become more advanced and sophisticated, a car is still considered a symbol of status (in their respective economic classes) by most.
In India 90% sales is based on Perception of public and not research.
Everybody wants others to know they drive a good car and that they can afford one. Here brand perception matters most.
Why are people flocking to Kia and MG? Because with all their gizmos and clever marketing, they have positioned themselves as the Coolest Kid in the Block. (Whether they actually are is up for debate).
Hyundai has marketted Kia as a premium brand (but have priced it such that most upper middle class and middle class families can afford one even if they have to stretch the wallets). So it's a somewhat "affordable" "premium" product.
The MG is an outright bling fest for all the flashers out there and a tech fest for all the technoBros out there. And you know Indian aunties and uncles love flashing and bragging about there newest purchase. The Hector has enough bells and whistles for them to keep bragging about and show off for at least 2 years.

The unfortunately people who can afford a well specced Harrier don't want a TATA car when they can show off in other cars. And these well-to-do people like to be pampered and have their egos stroked when they arrive to Shell out the cash for their new machine. New companies like Kia and especially MG has spent a lot to make sure that their customers are treated well.

Unfortunately the govt. Office attitude of Tata showroom employees don't help here at all. Yeah, service might be cheap but you have to put up with their attitude too.
Neither have their marketing captured the imagination of the general non-enthusiast public bar a few.

Those who buy a harrier buy it because they really gave some time to check it out and and saw it was a great effort by Tata and because it LOOKS DAMN AWESOME .
Nothing on road in that price bracket can beat the Harrier's road presence. Even the interiors are quite nice from what I've seen.
Tata releasing a 3/4th baked product with niggles and quality issues further pulled it down. As we know if there is one thing that travels faster than light, it bad news
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Old 8th September 2019, 15:00   #36
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Default Re: Harrier: 5 year / unlimited km extended warranty coming as Tata tries to revive sales

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Originally Posted by Sebring View Post
Looking at Nexon's sterling quality, I am inclined towards Harrier. We might add the BS6 Diesel to our garage. There is a toss up between the Kona and Harrier, right now as family wants an automatic and Kona shined through in every department.
Hey Sebring, are you really comparing the harrier with the kona or is it a typo? I mean those two cars are as different as chalk and cheese
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Old 8th September 2019, 16:19   #37
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Default Re: Harrier: 5 year / unlimited km extended warranty coming as Tata tries to revive sales

Hi, No - I'm not comparing the two. These are the two cars we are considering buying. One is electric, another is diesel. We have some time to go before we zero in on one.

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Hey Sebring, are you really comparing the harrier with the kona or is it a typo? I mean those two cars are as different as chalk and cheese
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Old 8th September 2019, 16:30   #38
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Default Re: Harrier: 5 year / unlimited km extended warranty coming as Tata tries to revive sales

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Originally Posted by Sebring View Post
Wish it had interior air filtration system like Seltos. That's really needed these days.
Just get a Honeywell/Philips/Ansio air purifier and keep it on the rear parcel tray. Ansio one even has HEPA filter, UV stage and fragrance dispenser. Available on Amazon.in, around 5k all of them. So pretty neat and cheap. I'm going to buy one for my Nexon and thats why I was waiting for the facelift to bring back ths rear 12v socket .

Here's one -
Link - Amazon.in Ansio car air purifier.
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Old 8th September 2019, 21:38   #39
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Default Re: Harrier: 5 year / unlimited km extended warranty coming as Tata tries to revive sales

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Just get a Honeywell/Philips/Ansio air purifier and keep it on the rear parcel tray. Ansio one even has HEPA filter, UV stage and fragrance dispenser. Available on Amazon.in, around 5k all of them. So pretty neat and cheap. I'm going to buy one for my Nexon and thats why I was waiting for the facelift to bring back ths rear 12v socket .
+1

I am sensitive to dust and pollution, so I have kept a Honeywell car air purifier in my Hexa. It has HEPA filtration and works like a charm. It is powered off the 12v outlet and I keep it under the front passenger seat. Have been using it for 2 years now, and even replaced the filter a few months back.
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Old 8th September 2019, 22:20   #40
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Default Re: Harrier: 5 year / unlimited km extended warranty coming as Tata tries to revive sales

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Originally Posted by trinity0114 View Post
How come a new entrant like MG receive 28k bookings for a Chinese junk car which which has been involved in numerous breakdowns not niggles or teething problems but complete breakdown in the middle of the road.
Every new car has its share of niggles. MG is doing well in India not just because of the bling. But because of the premium experience. The way they treat you at their showrooms is a lesson in how to treat clients.

The breakdowns haven't really been verified. I'm sure MG will iron out all the small niggles. Tata does need to up its game. They make fine cars. It's just the service game that needs to be upped.
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Old 9th September 2019, 08:59   #41
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Default Re: Harrier: 5 year / unlimited km extended warranty coming as Tata tries to revive sales

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Originally Posted by ZenMaster View Post
Why are people flocking to Kia and MG? Because with all their gizmos and clever marketing, they have positioned themselves as the Coolest Kid in the Block. (Whether they actually are is up for debate).
Hyundai has marketted Kia as a premium brand (but have priced it such that most upper middle class and middle class families can afford one even if they have to stretch the wallets). So it's a somewhat "affordable" "premium" product.
The MG is an outright bling fest for all the flashers out there and a tech fest for all the technoBros out there.
I think you have nailed most of it but there are few more factors at work that I might list:-

- Pricing - If they had stayed below 15 big ones ex showroom they might have gotten the Nexon level of success given all the other factors. It would have sat nicely in the lineup too a tad below the Hexa without the inevitable comparisons
- Variants - Hyundai has this pretty much nailed down with the Seltos having such mind boggling variety that gives a larger spread
- Pedigree - Instead of tom-toming the Land Rover pedigree if they had tried to use the Safari pedigree a bit more I feel it would have helped the cause in both setting expectations and utilizing the cult following. Nobody came out of a Harrier and felt Land Rover though many felt a baby Tata Safari.
Overconfidence - I think the initial rave reviews of the design and looking at the initial success of the Compass they thought there was a market there

My advice to Tata :-

- The Harrier needs a lot of effort with a sustained marketing campaign and aggressive customer service like Hexa to recover but might not still sell to its potential now
- The H7X is the best opportunity you have now.
- Price it well below 20 big ones ex showroom.
- Ensure you use the Safari & Hexa pedigree as a base. Your customer still remembers the first proper 7 seater on indian roads.
- Ensure you go overboard with the warranty.
- Ensure you provide an auto(Hexa is the benchmark) & a 4WD(no Safari without one). 360 degree cameras would help too.
- Above all make you entire organization fear a customer complaint especially the morons in sales
- Use the Safari badge with pride and junk all the Buzzard & Cassini & any other names being floated. It just does not resonate
- Have a coherent and consistent marketing plan playing on the strengths of the brand(See Bajaj and RE for inspiration, if they can do it the Tata behemoth can do it better)

As for Hyundai they have successfully made the ordinary bottom of their line Creta badge into 7 seater category and used the Kia badge to bring in the same package with some more icing to fill in the space the Creta will vacate in its next avatar. 100 points for their marketing in elevating their brand presence consistently after all they have successfully sold two consecutive brands with a hatches on stilts approach masquerading as SUVs becoming chart toppers

Lastly there are many Tata Safari fanboys myself included who badly want you to succeed and that is the market you should aim for. Once you capture that space word of mouth publicity itself with fetch you a big boost
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Old 9th September 2019, 11:05   #42
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Default Re: Harrier: 5 year / unlimited km extended warranty coming as Tata tries to revive sales

I sincerely feel its the brand name and perception that kills TATA when it comes to high end cars. I was casually browsing and looking at the TATA Storme. A couple of colleagues asked me why was I looking at such an expensive TATA car and that I would be better off with a car from another brand. Harrier is not perfect but it is a competent SUV. I am pretty sure that it would easily sell 2k a month if the same product was launched by Hyundai. Things may be changing for TATA at the lower end of the funnel but when it comes to spending 10-12L+, people are still wary of going for anything from the TATA stable.
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Old 9th September 2019, 11:50   #43
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Default Re: Harrier: 5 year / unlimited km extended warranty coming as Tata tries to revive sales

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Tata Motors is in general just a colossal mess. Their dealer experience is by far the worst I have ever experienced. They have a Hexa available at their dealer yard which I asked them to bring to the showroom so that I can inspect it before paying the booking amount. For the last one week, the sales executive for the Hexa is sick and there is no replacement. Hence, no one knows that I am waiting for the car. The showroom manager doesn't answer the phone and finally yesterday I got an SMS saying that the car will be available for inspection at 5:30PM. When I reached the showroom, no one knew anything about the car!
Hello brother. Have you managed to get the TD yet? If not and I can help you out.
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Old 9th September 2019, 12:13   #44
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Default Re: Harrier: 5 year / unlimited km extended warranty coming as Tata tries to revive sales

Being an ardent follower of Tata, it's extremely disappointing to see how they handled Harrier.

Their products went down in sales chart only because of after sales issues (niggles, service station concerns, reliability etc.). They didnt go down because of looks, pricing or safety (no or 15 years back)!

The only thing they had to do, was to improve reliability and service experience. Most other things met the expectation. Both these comes from customers longer term experience, not from showroom/sales experience.

When everyone had started believing that Tata changed- with Tiago, Nexon, Hexa.. they got Harrier!
I am unable to digest what made them rush so hard. The issues observed weren't so tough to notice. And in this social media era, cant believe that the leadership didnt sense public response.

It would have been perfectly fine to hold deliveries, once after initial feedback (assuming that they didnt know this at the first place), citing some genuine reasons. Loosing some bookings is much better than loosing the market altogether.

I recall they took a while to launch hexa, even after their first media presence and preview. I feel it helped- regardless of the sales numbers, happy hexa owners only helped transform Tata Brand image.

If one keep repeating mistakes, it is not a mistake- it is a CHOICE!

Last edited by murajith : 9th September 2019 at 12:15.
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Old 9th September 2019, 12:30   #45
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Default Re: Harrier: 5 year / unlimited km extended warranty coming as Tata tries to revive sales

Leave aside niggles and imperfections as a customer I would very much want to see

- All disc brake setup (this segment desires it even if the stopping power of present setup is enough. Harrier looks odd-one-out in this segment)

- An option of AWD (if they have used JLR chassis, they had all the possibilities to offer an AWD for this SUV)

- Option of TC (If they can source engine from FIAT, they could have sourced the TC too, there would have been takers for a 2 litre diesel with a proven old school TC)

What Kia and MG has done might have been a surprise for Tata's (let me assume that) but rest of the things as I have highlighted were known to them at the drawing board. They were aware of the segment in which the product will play and they were fairly aware of the ask & expectation of the market.

They have witnessed success of Safari; Safari was not a chart buster, but it had created a brand association for several buyers. They can have it again with Harrier.

Last edited by i74js : 9th September 2019 at 12:59.
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