[BoneCollector]

Originally Posted by RavenAvi

Some technical details regarding the Safari, shared by a birdie:

- Panoramic sunroof in XT & XZ variants -

Was eagerly waiting for this scoop. Superb details RavenAvi. Considering how your predictions have been, I'll take this as the final list. It should not cost 5L over the same Harrier variant as it may lose market share. Please keep on with these scoops.

- Safety modules include:

I hope it gets 6 airbags, atleast in top 2 variants.

Originally Posted by erohit

Thanks a lot. So no panoramic roof in Safari ?

The first line of scoop is about panoramic sunroof.

[DicKy]

Thanks for the info scoopmaster

Originally Posted by RavenAvi

Some technical details regarding the Safari, shared by a birdie:

- Panoramic sunroof in XT & XZ variants

With the talks of the steeped roof, had briefly fantasied a two piece sunroof like the Carnival's

Disc brakes all around

Much welcome,hope the Harrier too gets it

Functional roof rails (75 kgs load capacity)

Great, fed up with the ornamental ones in most new vehicles.

Electronic Parking Brake with Auto Hold function on XT & XZ variants

Good that it is not standard across the range.

Rear suspension same as Harrier except changes for rear disc brakes

Ofcourse tuning would have been done. But..an independent rear suspension would have done wonders

- Safety modules include:
ABS ,EBD, CSC, off-road ABS, ETC, ESC, HHC, HDC, BDW, DWTB, ROM , EDTC, EBP, HBA,HFC

Got the same feeling as being wonderstruck seeing a late 2000s Merc safety specs.

Originally Posted by turbo_delight

Sir, what is this easy slide co-driver seat. How is this different than normal sliding co-driver seat.

Most likely to be the fat cat mode.
The left rear passenger could slide the front passenger seat forwards for greater leg room. Like the earlier Vento/Rapid(?), Superbs and Camrys.

Originally Posted by vigneshkumar31

Ive not driven the Harrier, so would like to ask present owners this -
How useful or effective are these "drive modes" achieved by ESP manipulation? Do you feel the 14 modes doing anything different perceivably? I mean how much can you squeeze out of a FWD vehicle with just electronic modulations?

Pretty much effective.
Atleast in the most common scenario where FWD vehicles struggle. Slushy/slippery uphill roads in hill stations and ghat areas.
Two days back my buddy who has a '19 Harrier used the wet mode and said it worked fine.
It was a steep embankment kind of muddy area. And due to rains it was slushy. When he tried to climb it the wheels just spinned and the vehicle moved backwards.
Engaged Wet mode and the vehicle climbed the embankment.
He said he could feel the traction control at work, with the brakes biting, groaning, shuddering and all. But the vehicle climbed the slope with ease.

[varunswnt]

Most of the features listed by RavenAvi can be seen in Auto expo videos of Gravitas. So nothing to speculate on what a co-driver seat slide means and like that. We can clearly see a lever on co-driver seat for sliding it from rear seats.

Interesting thing to note is ingress egress to 3rd row by recline and tumble forward of 2nd row seats is very tricky. It is best accessed through space between captain seats.

https://youtu.be/uARiNYrBZ1g

[turbo_delight]

Originally Posted by BoneCollector

It should not cost 5L over the same Harrier variant as it may lose market share.

If it's going to cost more than 5 lakhs version to version, then I am not coming back to this thread.

Next gen XUV500 will be priced competitively, or at least with an introductory price during the launch.

Tatas should not think that they can choose that much premium for Safari nameplate. I and most people were not interested till they changed the name. But the product is essentially the same. I am looking to buy this but will not spend 5 lakhs extra, no way.

Until December their forecast teams might have told that Gravitas might not get good numbers. So, they changed the name. So, they will be optimistic.

But, making it over and above 5 lakhs would be over optimism.

They should try to sell the product for its value. In longer term, the nameplate itself is not sufficient to get good sales numbers.

[07CR]

Originally Posted by DicKy

Thanks for the info scoopmaster

Most likely to be the fat cat mode.
The left rear passenger could slide the front passenger seat forwards for greater leg room. Like the earlier Vento/Rapid(?), Superbs and Camrys.

Slightly offtopic, but I guess the Safari gets the mechanical seat movement option like the vento/rapid. The one on Camry/Superb is electric.

[krishnakarthik1]

Fantastic features list! But the biggest issue is the price. It's getting into the Innova territory. If the price difference is 1 or 2 lakhs compared to the Innova its going to be a touch decision convincing oneself to pick this over that.

[rshnvjy]

Originally Posted by DicKy

Wanted to reply, "yes sir, the Innova and Hexa both were BoF and RWD. Could enter the third row with ease.
In fact, the BoF Innova and Fortuner has the same transmission tunnel hump as the monocoque FWD Harrier does. So does the new Safari. "
Pity by the time I could type a reply, the comment was removed.

One important thing I would like to point out is that the new Safari/Gravitas/Harrier is based on a transverse engine mounted monocoque platform. If you look at their sister cars from the Land Rover stable, none of them are solely RWD or primarily RWD. They are all designed primarily as FWD because the engine and by extension, the gearbox has to be mounted transversely. AWD is then achieved by sending power from the gearbox via a transfer case to the rear wheels.

In the Innova, Hexa and Scorpio the engine is mounted longitudinally simply because that is what those platforms support. You can easily observe this under the hood. Moreover, they are ladder frame (or BoF) chassis which makes it easy for the prop shaft to pass through under the body. The Hexa and Innova don't have such tall transmission tunnels precisely due to this.

Therefore, we can assume what Mr. Bose meant was that on a monocoque (transverse engine) platform like that of the Harrier's/Safari's, it would be a much more difficult packaging exercise from an engineering and cost perspective to make it rear wheel drive when the platform itself was designed as transverse-engine and FWD-first.

And what is the big deal about having a monocoque chassis anyway? It is certainly not about offroad-ability because one does not need to look much further than the LR Defender to shoot that argument down. I have a Hexa and trust me, the disadvantages of the BoF construction (primarily the immense weight) far outweigh the advantages. If the Hexa was a few hundred kilograms lighter, we'd all be enjoying much better fuel efficiency than what it currently achieves.

Mahindra launching the new Scorpio as a ladder frame is entirely at their discretion and several factors may have played into it such as R&D costs (if they were to change the platform outright), tooling costs and so on. In no way does it mean that BoF is inherently better than monocoque for an SUV.

[CEF_Beasts]

Boot space in the Safari is a touch more than the current XUV500 with all rows up. Aircraft carry-on suitcases will require to fold one of the third row seats.

[BipB]

Mods,
Please note that there is a small typo in the news section on safari's feature list.
'8' inch alloy wheel (top end variant) instead of 18".

[Venku2015]

Originally Posted by DicKy

Ofcourse I wouldn't blame him.
He should defend his company and he rightly does. But what gets my nerve is his dissing of BoF, RWD just to defend the products and ridiculing the usage of AWD/4x4.

Example from his comment section in Insta (deleted)

Random guy 1 : "Should have made it RWD atleast"
Pratap Bose : " Would make packaging difficult"
Random guy 2. : "@mentioning guy 1 and you guys will complain of transmission tunnel"
Pratap Bose : "@mentioning guy 2 true (laugh)
Me : "as if FWD cars have flat rear floor"
Random guy x comment
Random guy x : comment
Random guy x : comment
Pratap Bose. : "@mentioning me Ever tried entering the 3rd row in a vehicle with transmission tunnel?

I was like ....Did he really say that?

Wanted to reply, "yes sir, the Innova and Hexa both were BoF and RWD. Could enter the third row with ease.
In fact, the BoF Innova and Fortuner has the same transmission tunnel hump as the monocoque FWD Harrier does. So does the new Safari. "
Pity by the time I could type a reply, the comment was removed.

Either he should reply diplomatically or reply logically, instead of trying to hide shortcomings with 'future, time proof, market study, do you use it, have you tried.., last century, modern thinking' etc



He talked generally about BoF, RWD, AWD. Not of segments.
Same in the case of my arguments.

If the segment has to be discussed, the arch rival of Safari, the Scorpio which is arguably the better seller is to come this year in a new generation. BoF, RWD. With possibly 4x4 option.
Another one, the Innova is in its second generation. And is still BoF and RWD. So will be it's next generation.
If it is to club together Creta, Seltos, Hector with Safari...I don't have any words.

Again, I respect TML's strategy, their two platform only approach, the Harrier, their decision to rename the Gravitas as the Safari. I can very well understand those decisions.
It is just the general attitude of Pratap Bose towards the people who asked for stuff that Tata couldn't provide now.
Or maybe seeing the BMW ad first thing in the morning may have rubbed me off wrong.




Really don't know how the suspension has been tuned. Maybe a more comfortable setup.
But of what I have felt in the Harrier. An independent rear suspension would have been perfect for the Gravitas. Especially since there is a third row.
The rear suspension setup stands out as a visible chink in the Harrier, how it would affect the Gravitas has to be seen.

That Random guy 1 was me who had expressed my requirement about making it at-least a RWD since I know this new Safari will be heavy and will definitely suffer in slushy conditions and steep slopes etc where the Innova will just do fine.
I too wanted to post a reply but then Tata's social media team woke up and deleted the comment

I second your thought of Pratap Bose sir's inappropriate reply to my comment and he was just trying to cover the new Safari's shortcomings. Also, these top designers and MD's are now following Zac Hollis social media interaction trend I guess

[pseudo_coder]

Originally Posted by krishnakarthik1

Fantastic features list! But the biggest issue is the price. It's getting into the Innova territory. If the price difference is 1 or 2 lakhs compared to the Innova its going to be a touch decision convincing oneself to pick this over that.

For the top-end variants, I wouldn't pickup Innova over Safari even if they are priced the same.

Safari will have
- way more features (including safety features)
- more comfort due to cabin width and seats
- better road presence
- likely better rough road ability
- Bonus: free from taxi image

Of course, Innova will score more on
- Reliability
- Resale value

Which make a lot of sense for a commercial vehicle, but not for a fun family car.

[CEF_Beasts]

First Tata Safari rolls off the assembly line.

Gets the much awaited panoramic sunroof.

[Behemoth]

First Official Images of the Tata Safari are released by Tata Motors and the first Safari (also in Dark Blue colour) gets rolled out from the Tata Factory!

[abhishek46]

Here is the customary side-by-side comparo of the front fascia.

The differences are subtle.

[RavenAvi]

Originally Posted by turbo_delight

Sir, what is this easy slide co-driver seat. How is this different than normal sliding co-driver seat.

Originally Posted by DicKy

Most likely to be the fat cat mode.
The left rear passenger could slide the front passenger seat forwards for greater leg room. Like the earlier Vento/Rapid(?), Superbs and Camrys.

What DicKy said.

There is a lever present on the inside part of the front passenger seat (above the front armrest area), which will enable the 2nd row passenger to slide the front passenger seat forward to increase more legroom space for himself/herself from behind. Same as the Vento/Rapid.

Originally Posted by turbo_delight

Also, I remember the Gravitas video in YouTube where the 2nd row of seat was sliding but that was for captain seat configuration. Can you please confirm if bench type seats will be of sliding type to enable more space for 2nd row, in case we are not using the 3rd row.

For the 7 seater option, the second row is provided with a 60:40 split seat. A small lever is given on the top right side of the 40% split seat which when tugged upwards, will make the smaller seat recline, fold and tumble forward automatically for access to the 3rd row. No sliding mechanism here.

The 3rd row will have 50:50 split.

3rd row passengers get a netted pocket for storage, a cup/bottle holder, an USB charger port from XM onwards, a seat-belt parking clip & a HVAC regulator knob. In addition, the sub-woofer will be placed on the left side while the same slot on the right side houses the boot lamp.

A center armrest is also provided in the 60% part of the 2nd row seat.

All seats are upholstered in leather (XZ only).

Originally Posted by pk_del

- Are the seats powered
- Will they offer airbags for 3rd seat occupants too.
- Hope they offer alloy as a spare wheel too
- Any news on the comfort and ride
- From the captain seats tweeted - it looked thinner with very less bolstering, not like Hexa captain seats. Hope I am wrong.

- Only driver's seat is powered.
- Front, seat-side & curtain airbags are on offer. Not sure if they cover both 2nd and 3rd rows or the 2nd row only. (should be the former)

Will update on the rest.

Originally Posted by BoneCollector

It should not cost 5L over the same Harrier variant as it may lose market share.

No chance.

A strong rumour is around 1.2-1.3 lakhs over the equivalent Harrier variant (ex-showroom). There is a thin margin between the Harrier's pricing and the Innova's pricing, and this is where they are targeting to slot the Safari in - around the 15L to 21.5L mark.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Also confirmed :-

Front, seat-side and curtain airbags
Push-button start (PEPS)
Cruise Control
auto-dimming IRVM (Internal rear-view mirror)
9-inch Touchscreen HU
9-speaker JBL system with amplifier
e-Sims: Airtel = primary, BSNL = Fallback
Connected Tech via iRA, ConnectNext & What3Words
Telematics - Connected car (ECU below driver's seat) include:-
Valet Mode,
Find My Car,
Sharing Location and Live Tracker,
Driving analysis,
Car Health display,
Panic notification,
Other Alerts & Notifications,
Intrusion Alert,
Stolen vehicle tracking & remote immobilisation request (by calling customer care and sharing FIR details),
Remote car access commands,
Roadside Assistance,
Social media - Tribes,
Trip analysis and social sharing,
OTA (Over the Air) software updates,
and more.