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Old 17th January 2021, 16:01   #991
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Default Re: The Tata Gravitas (H7X) SUV. EDIT: Branded as the Safari!

Tata is looking for market response to launch the AWD variant, or so they say.

If the twiterrati, instagram comments, and this forum itself is any indicator of the market, then they have their answer.

I know most of these are keyboard warriors and not necessarily prospective customers, but the sheer response in the affirmative should be a strong indicator for TATA to plonk the hardware in their flagship.

Safari claiming LR pedigree without 4x4, is like MG claiming British heritage on a Baojun Wuling.

The market has changed from the times of the previous Safari Storme 4x4. The Storme and the Safari dicor were niche offerings targeted at a select group of discerning buyers. Everybody liked the Safari. But you really had to love it to bring one home. And the few who did (myself included) never regret it and would do it all over again.

The positioning of the Safari and then the Storme was also quite aspirational for their times, in the sense it offered oodles of character and elegance and not much else, compared to similar priced XUV 5OO, which looked like a car from the future and the laundry list of gizmos it offered. People chose what they wanted and voted with their wallets. The Safari's relatively lower sales, meant there were fewer on the roads and thus cementing its exclusivity and reinstating the enigmatic legend it was. Again, you really had to love the Safari to bring one home and live with it. The Tata badge and the baggage that brought with it, meant you had to really love it.

Tata today has built ( or rather building) a different perception amongst the Indian car buyer. The taxi image is wiped off, their 'design led brand renovation' is killing it and they have one winner in every segment they play in. Look at the Tiago, Altroz, Nexon, Harrier and now Safari. In all these pages of discussion not one of us have said - " Wow! a Tata for 20 lakhs?!"
Tata has finally earned their right to play with the big boys.

Today, the Safari'21 ticks most of the boxes that turned away the erstwhile non-buyer. It's fresh, looks great and loaded with kit and crowd pleasers have been ensured - Panoramic sunroof and the likes. But it has lesser boxes to tick for the erstwhile buyer who once chose Safari for its unique strengths. A rugged abuse friendly SUV, never afraid to get its hands dirty, which still managed to look 'white collar'.The Safari still claims to retain its characteristic space and ride in the latest avatar which we will know soon.

I dare say the purchasing power of the market today is also starkly improved, evident from the sales charts of over priced CSUVs flying off the shelves. The number of people that are willing to pay for 'lifestyle quotient' in a vehicle is remarkably improved from what it was a decade ago.

The market has a gap and is ripe for a 7 seater AWD. Many of us are unable to progress to this elusive category as the cheapest option starts from the premium D2 segment only which is well north of 30 lakhs.

Cars are known by their apex variants, regardless of how much of the sales come from that variant. The Safari AWD would be an instant differentiator and justify the name it bears and the pedigree it claims. It actually has the potential to become a great one car do all.

If TML is reading this and we know they are, I suggest they actually come up with something novel and open an ''expression of interest'' kind of booking for the top end 4x4 as an option and see the response for themselves.

Just waiting on the sidelines and checking if XUV 5OO AT AWD sells or not, won't cut it.

Omegarc D8 is oh so capable!. Land Rover pedigree!. We are tired of hearing what the architecture can be possibly used for. Now can we please have the hardware it deserves?

Okay we believe you Tata, that you did all that sleight of hand, veil of mystery Buzzard and Gravitas so that we would be distracted and not wait for this Safari. We promise we won't make you any more uncomfortable by asking that question again.Now can we have the 4x4?

Last edited by vigneshkumar31 : 17th January 2021 at 16:04.
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Old 17th January 2021, 16:19   #992
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Default Re: The Tata Gravitas (H7X) SUV. EDIT: Branded as the Safari!

No matter how hard the enthusiasts(fanboys) on this forum try to justify safari as a 20 lakh rupee product, and say, well, safari is a xuv500 competitor now, the fact is that when the Mahindra launches its Scorpio at a price of 12 lakhs, and with 4x4 available as an option, people will inevitably say "20 lakhs for a safari? Itne mein toh 2 Scorpio aa jayein (I can get two Scorpio for that price)"

Tata is going to make the Scorpio look like tremendous VFM, and that's going to be its downfall.
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Old 17th January 2021, 16:54   #993
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Default Re: The Tata Gravitas (H7X) SUV. EDIT: Branded as the Safari!

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Originally Posted by turbo View Post
"20 lakhs for a safari? Itne mein toh 2 Scorpio aa jayein (I can get two Scorpio for that price)"
Only a customer who doesn't know anything about fit, finish, material quality and design will speak like that. And I believe Tata now wants to move to an aspirational territory where they don't even want such customers.

The new "Safari" will probably compete with the XUV 500. And I won't be worried about the AWD/4x4 part. I think Tata won't be either. While buying the Hexa I kept my thinking rational. How many times would I need AWD and where exactly would I take the car to need it? Have covered 9k+ kms and have used rough road mode for barely a km or two. So net, I saved a lac rupee and a half. And extra in case anything AWD related goes kaput post extended warranty.

How many people who buy such SUVs actually use it off the road? I wouldn't. Considering how expensive spares are. And how much time at least Tata takes to get them delivered. I would just get the Thar and do the mud plugging.

Ya the non 4x4 availability will hurt the Safari a bit. But that's only 5-10% of the total customers buying a Safari and XUV 500. I don't think Tata would care, considering they're cash strapped and weren't getting even the remaining 90% of those volumes till now.

Also I see people buying the MG Hector in loads even though it's being trolled as "chini maal" and "boat" and what not. Doubt the lack of AWD trolling will hurt the Safari that much.

Tata should rather focus on their after sales. Cause even if you're "Safari" had a world class 4x4, it wouldn't help you get out of the mess the customer support and after sales could get you in

Last edited by Aditya : 17th January 2021 at 19:59. Reason: Unnecessary word deleted
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Old 17th January 2021, 17:29   #994
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Default Re: The Tata Gravitas (H7X) SUV. EDIT: Branded as the Safari!

Quote:
Originally Posted by turbo View Post
Mahindra launches its Scorpio at a price of 12 lakhs, and with 4x4 available as an option, people will inevitably say "20 lakhs for a safari? Itne mein toh 2 Scorpio aa jayein (I can get two Scorpio for that price
Current scorpio retails for 12.50 to 17.40 lakh ex-showroom, I don't think facelift will retail for same price. Max difference between safari and scorpio may be less than a lakh.
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Old 17th January 2021, 18:49   #995
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Default Re: The Tata Gravitas (H7X) SUV. EDIT: Branded as the Safari!

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Originally Posted by Tojo_GotBhp View Post
The exhaust ends with silver finish reminds of Ford Endeavour to some extent.
Attachment 2109141
On a lighter note, the auto memers have been given a good item for content building by the gentleman. Have seen a few memes circulating over the web of the first image.

Here is one to lighten up the mood of all BHPians, anyone who has watched the series 'Mirzapur' can guess which scene is is being related too. Funny nevertheless, thanks to the angry uncle for becoming a meme material:

Name:  Safari.jpg
Views: 3049
Size:  91.0 KB

It reads "Zinda Pakadna hai 'Media' waalo ko (Catch those media guys alive)".
Image courtesy: Motorbeam
Meme Credits: gaadi_wala_memer @ Instagram
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Old 17th January 2021, 19:06   #996
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Default Re: The Tata Gravitas (H7X) SUV. EDIT: Branded as the Safari!

Quote:
Originally Posted by turbo View Post
No matter how hard the enthusiasts(fanboys) on this forum try to justify safari as a 20 lakh rupee product, and say, well, safari is a xuv500 competitor now, the fact is that when the Mahindra launches its Scorpio at a price of 12 lakhs, and with 4x4 available as an option, people will inevitably say "20 lakhs for a safari? Itne mein toh 2 Scorpio aa jayein (I can get two Scorpio for that price)"

Tata is going to make the Scorpio look like tremendous VFM, and that's going to be its downfall.
I don't think people will compare the Scorpio with Safari. I feel the XUV will be the reason of downfall for the Safari. Kind of similar to what happened with the first generation Safari.

XUV will be providing the never heard of features in this segment, and that would be coupled with even better (atleast ON Paper as off now) engines, with 185 PS diesel and 190 PS petrol. Be it the interior and fit/finish/NVH departments, Mahindra has been atleast on Par/better than Tata. Currently the Harrier diesel auto top end retails at 24.56L OTR Pune. Safari would be atleast 1-1.5L more than Harrier at 26~L. Current top end XUV500 is available at 23L OTR Pune. If we assume a similar 1-1.5L increase in price for new XUV500, it will be priced at around 24.5L.

Resultant- XUV500 will undercut the Safari in pricing by about 1-1.5L

Last edited by 07CR : 17th January 2021 at 19:11.
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Old 17th January 2021, 19:07   #997
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Default Re: The Tata Gravitas (H7X) SUV. EDIT: Branded as the Safari!

People comparing the Safari to a XUV will never be Safari owners.

A Safari guy steps (not climbs) into an XUV, shuts the door, looks around, opens the door, steps out, and never steps into one again.

Cheers, Doc
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Old 17th January 2021, 19:36   #998
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Default Re: The Tata Gravitas (H7X) SUV. EDIT: Branded as the Safari!

I really dont think the Safari will be able to justify a 26 Lac price tag, without AWD. Especially when the Hector has a 7 seater that is for all practical purposes, a rival, that sells for much less with the same engine power and perhaps equal or better cabin features . Bereft of AWD, the Hector and Harrier are virtually at par as mild soft-roaders. Yes, the Harrier has various modes etc. but the average driver will EASILY get bogged down or stuck badly trying to overestimate the capabilities.
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Old 17th January 2021, 19:52   #999
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Default Re: The Tata Gravitas (H7X) SUV. EDIT: Branded as the Safari!

Quote:
Originally Posted by turbo View Post
No matter how hard the enthusiasts(fanboys) on this forum try to justify safari as a 20 lakh rupee product, and say, well, safari is a xuv500 competitor now, the fact is that when the Mahindra launches its Scorpio at a price of 12 lakhs, and with 4x4 available as an option, people will inevitably say "20 lakhs for a safari? Itne mein toh 2 Scorpio aa jayein (I can get two Scorpio for that price)"

Tata is going to make the Scorpio look like tremendous VFM, and that's going to be its downfall.
Current scorpio starts 12.5+
With side facing useless 3rd row and 138 bhp engine,
You want to compare scorpio with safari 2021?

New scorpio is going to be bigger, front facing 3rd row, probably with better engine option , cannot digest how can it start 12 +? Wait for Mahindra to disappoint many on pricing front as well.
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Old 17th January 2021, 20:17   #1000
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Default Re: The Tata Gravitas (H7X) SUV. EDIT: Branded as the Safari!

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Originally Posted by ebonho View Post
People comparing the Safari to a XUV will never be Safari owners.

A Safari guy steps (not climbs) into an XUV, shuts the door, looks around, opens the door, steps out, and never steps into one again.

Cheers, Doc


Can't be better put!

XUV is more car like, while the older Safaris were proper trucks.

That stepping into and getting out, I witnessed my dad do that with both the crysta and xuv500 before settling back on a new Safari, again.

While average enthusiast will argue that the crysta and xuv500 are better packages over the storme, a Safari owner will have a different opinion there. One needs to own one to understand that emotion.

Last edited by PrasannaDhana : 17th January 2021 at 20:19.
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Old 17th January 2021, 20:36   #1001
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Default Re: The Tata Gravitas (H7X) SUV. EDIT: Branded as the Safari!

Quote:
Originally Posted by PrasannaDhana View Post


Can't be better put!

XUV is more car like, while the older Safaris were proper trucks.

That stepping into and getting out, I witnessed my dad do that with both the crysta and xuv500 before settling back on a new Safari, again.

While average enthusiast will argue that the crysta and xuv500 are better packages over the storme, a Safari owner will have a different opinion there. One needs to own one to understand that emotion.
I did that step in step out speed dance before actually becoming a Safari owner myself.

It's a mindset thing.

Cheers, Doc
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Old 17th January 2021, 20:37   #1002
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Default Re: The Tata Gravitas (H7X) SUV. EDIT: Branded as the Safari!

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Originally Posted by turbo View Post
No Mahindra launches its Scorpio at a price of 12 lakhs, and with 4x4 available as an option, people will inevitably say "20 lakhs for a safari? Itne mein toh 2 Scorpio aa jayein (I can get two Scorpio for that price)"
Different market segments, different target group, different positioning, different pricing. I think Tata is consciously moving towards an aspirational positioning for all their products. Mahindra is doing well on their product portfolio, but their brand positioning is a bit confusing.

But whatever Tata and Mahindra do, we all know that the only car in the segment that will sell in hordes will be the 2-star safety rated 7-seater Creta. Who cares about being alive, as long as we have a 10-inch touchscreen.
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Old 17th January 2021, 21:17   #1003
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Default Re: The Tata Gravitas (H7X) SUV. EDIT: Branded as the Safari!

Quote:
Originally Posted by ebonho View Post
People comparing the Safari to a XUV will never be Safari owners.

A Safari guy steps (not climbs) into an XUV, shuts the door, looks around, opens the door, steps out, and never steps into one again.

Cheers, Doc
I don't own a Safari and have been only once in the driver seat when I was checking it out in the showroom four years ago. And dare I say, just 30 seconds in the driver seat were enough to make it my dream car. I and my friend were so impressed by it that we started saving whatever we had to buy it one day(We were in 12th standard back then )

Even today I aspire to buy a used Safari. There is one with my friend which he is selling, only if I had saved the money, I might have bought it
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Old 17th January 2021, 22:49   #1004
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Default Re: The Tata Gravitas (H7X) SUV. EDIT: Branded as the Safari!

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Originally Posted by andafunda View Post
But whatever Tata and Mahindra do, we all know that the only car in the segment that will sell in hordes will be the 2-star safety rated 7-seater Creta. Who cares about being alive, as long as we have a 10-inch touchscreen.
Neither the Harrier (or Safari) nor the Creta have been crash tested or have a safety rating yet. And the latter is still a better car in terms of reliability, features, cost of ownership etc. I don't care for Hyundai at all, but there are good reasons why their cars sell.
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Old 17th January 2021, 23:26   #1005
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Default Re: The Tata Gravitas (H7X) SUV. EDIT: Branded as the Safari!

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Originally Posted by turbo View Post
the fact is that when the Mahindra launches its Scorpio at a price of 12 lakhs, and with 4x4 available as an option
The current Scorpio, XUV500, 300, Bolero.... none of them has a 4x4 option despite being a supposedly 'hot selling' models - all discontinued! Why do people conveniently ignore this fact?

One should check out the M&M website's current product line up and PRICES before procrastinating what the future would look like. The 18 year old current Scorpio costs north of 12 lacs for the base 2WD model.

Tata had 4x4 variants in their SUV range previously. The Sierra, Safari all came with 4x4! First to introduce the Borg Warner transfer case, etc. Perhaps India's first modern SUV's with 4x4. While a niche few bought them (a few hundreds at best), these were ignored by 99% of the market. So, what is the point? Even the Hexa 4x4 variant makes a minute percentage of Hexa sales.


99% of India don't really use SUVs, they simply need to be seen driving/owning one! If the rest 1% is waiting for the all new Scorpio at 12 lacs with 4x4 option, all the best.

Last edited by Aditya : 18th January 2021 at 06:14. Reason: Rude bits deleted
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