[suhaas307]

Originally Posted by suhaas307

But being a CBU, I expect the price to be quite absurd. In Bangalore, on the road, I wouldn't be surprised if it's mid-to-high 40s.

So I'm fairly close to the mark, with my prediction on the pricing. But then again, it was sort of expected when they announced that it would be a CBU.

I maintain my stance on the pricing, i.e. it's a touch too close to the BMW 330i for comfort and that the Bimmer may make the better buy.

However, I hadn't considered a few crucial points:

- I am an average driver, and an average driver would be able to exploit the vRS 245 to a far greater degree than a rear-wheel-drive car. Sure, there's more fun to be had in a rwd BMW, but the vRS will make going fast an easy affair as it just showers you with confidence.

- The vRS 245 I believe is equipped with the same 2.0 TSI mill from the Golf R - a car that makes 310 factory horses! A simple flash tune and minimal changes to hardware will send power figures closer to 300, giving the vRS immense tuning potential.

When you consider the above points, along with the fact that the car now comes with an updated gearbox, LSD, electronically adjustable dampers, etc. 45 lakh on the road is not a bad asking price at all.

In the hands of an average driver, the vRS would be a far more capable weapon than a rwd BMW. In fact, it makes the average drivers feel like heros, and the accomplished drivers would definitely be able to extract far more from the Skoda.

Oh, and also - this pricing will ensure that used vRS 230s would hold their value far better and for far longer. Bad news overall if you are an enthusiast on a tight budget.

[itwasntme]

Originally Posted by suhaas307

I maintain my stance on the pricing, i.e. it's a touch too close to the BMW 330i for comfort and that the Bimmer may make the better buy.

Good post. Couple of queries:

Anyone have any idea on the current discounts on the 330i? NCR buyers have quoted 4-5L off from the ex-showroom rate of 48.5L. Does this still hold good or was it for 2019 cars only? The 330i was BS-VI anyway so no question of getting BS-IV offers.

What is the approximate Service Inclusive (i.e. basic service rate) for the 330i? I looked up Skoda India's cost calculator for the RS230 and found it to be around ₹90K for 6 years / 90K km (routine service only, NOT including any periodic replacements like brake pads etc), which is very reasonable. Even brake pads for the RS230 are ~9K for front and 5K for rear.
Net net, will the 330i be a white elephant to maintain for the average Joe?

[veedub89]

I don't know whether the comparison between a 330i and the Octy vRS is fair.

To my mind the kind of person who would look at the Octy is so much different than the one who would consider the 330i. Dare I say it that the 330i guy is the softer enthusiast and the Octy guy the more hardcore one. I mean no offence to either of them. I am the softer one.

The Beemer will appeal to the guy who wants his fun but also holds brand value in high regard. He probably won't tweak with the car and will probably keep it stock.

The Octy guy just wants to have the max amount of fun for his money. Not saying that the buyer is price conscious though. The probability that the buyer will get his car modified for higher performance is quite high.

Another thing to consider is the maintenance of these two cars. The Octy should be cheaper in the long run.

I concede that this may be an unpopular opinion but to my mind the buyers for these two cars probably won't cross shop.

[Ash_vtec]

I think this is brilliant product for the price. For 45 lakhs it's the ultimate all in one. You can either let it be a sleeper and enjoy the extended warranty or exploit its mod potential safely. Win-win.

Great amount of tech on offer too. Now to convince the dealers to turn off the 80 kph buzzer and keep the warranty lol !

[d3mon]

Originally Posted by suhaas307

- I am an average driver, and an average driver would be able to exploit the vRS 245 to a far greater degree than a rear-wheel-drive car. Sure, there's more fun to be had in a rwd BMW, but the vRS will make going fast an easy affair as it just showers you with confidence.

- The vRS 245 I believe is equipped with the same 2.0 TSI mill from the Golf R - a car that makes 310 factory horses! A simple flash tune and minimal changes to hardware will send power figures closer to 300, giving the vRS immense tuning potential.

Hi Suhaas, Do you not have confidence in modern day ESPs? Unless you turn off the ESP (DSC in BMW-speak) completely, it'd be very hard to get in trouble, RWD or otherwise. And if you still manage to bin the car, I'm sure you'd have binned the FWD car as well!

On the point of tuning, FWD traction limits the 0-100 time to over 6 seconds, even if you get 400BHP out of the vRS. So tuning only makes sense for those folks who like to do deep triple digit speeds on the highways. Those who are g-force junkies will not be able to get more than 0.6g or so from a FWD platform, but the RWD Bimmer can offer up over 0.8g at launch, leaving the vRS for dead. Folks who are looking for a 5 second car to 100 will have to pick the RWD 330i and get a tune.

[Ashish0485]

The question is if I want to keep my car as stock and not void the warranty, does spending 45 lacs on a fwd makes sense or will it be more wise to spend another 5-6 lacs and buy a 330i?

Having driven both and owned one (vRS 230), here are few observations:
1) The drive: analogy - The vRS is a high end point and shoot camera, whereas, the 330i is a mid-range dslr. So, most of the times you will get comparable performance, but a champion driver (not referring to me) would be able to explore the potential of the rwd platform much better.
2) Acceleration (0-100 km): The 330i is almost a second faster but you don’t realize it in real world conditions especially because the push-back in the vRS is more pronounced. However, its launch is not as great as the bimmer.
3) Practicality: The vRS has lot more boot and rear passenger space than the 330i. Stiffness is comparable, though.
4) Seating: This one goes to the 330i, but the vRS is not far behind.
5) Looks: are subjective but I like the vRS more. The new 330i rear design is a let down.
6) Cabin quality: Goes to 330i
7) Badge value: Goes to 330i
8) Paint job: It’s a tie
9) Material used: 330i has an edge
10) Tech on offer: Almost a tie

Conclusion: If the ex-showroom price of the new vRS would have been around 5 lacs less i.e. 30-32 lacs, would have been a steal but at 36 lacs, my vote goes to the 330i, considering the discounts.

[suhaas307]

Originally Posted by d3mon

Hi Suhaas, Do you not have confidence in modern day ESPs? Unless you turn off the ESP (DSC in BMW-speak) completely, it'd be very hard to get in trouble, RWD or otherwise. And if you still manage to bin the car, I'm sure you'd have binned the FWD car as well!

On the point of tuning, FWD traction limits the 0-100 time to over 6 seconds, even if you get 400BHP out of the vRS. So tuning only makes sense for those folks who like to do deep triple digit speeds on the highways. Those who are g-force junkies will not be able to get more than 0.6g or so from a FWD platform, but the RWD Bimmer can offer up over 0.8g at launch, leaving the vRS for dead. Folks who are looking for a 5 second car to 100 will have to pick the RWD 330i and get a tune.

It's not the lack of confidence in BMW's ESP as much as it's the ease with which one can hustle the vRS or for that matter any VAG product with the 2.0 TSI. The chassis is very forgiving and even a novice driver can hit triple digits with ease, or take a corner fast without thinking about steering angle, throttle position, traction or understeer.

I know of certain individuals who have attempted to gun these rwd BMWs (one 530d and another 328i) while in the midst of executing a U-turn. In such scenarios, it's not uncommon to get the tail to step out even ever so slightly. Some of us can control the slide, but many inexperienced drivers can't and will panic!

Please note, I am not discrediting the BMW or suggesting that the Skoda is better than it. Because it just isn't. The BMW is a quality product that's superior in every conceivable way (other than maybe cabin room and boot space). All I'm saying is, in terms of character they are very different machines and both cater to individuals looking for very different things.

With respect to tunability, I reserve my opinion as I am unaware of G force figures achievable in FWD cars vis a vis RWD cars. Oh by the way, at the recent drag events, some tuning houses were able to achieve the impossible with various FWD cars such as the Polo GTI and the Laura TSI. I'm not sure if they managed sub 6 second times to 100, but they did create quite a stir.

[Dr.Naren]

Originally Posted by suhaas307

Oh by the way, at the recent drag events, some tuning houses were able to achieve the impossible with various FWD cars such as the Polo GTI and the Laura TSI. I'm not sure if they managed sub 6 second times to 100, but they did create quite a stir.

Polo GTI built by E tuners is the fastest FWD VAG in India. It does 0-100 in less than 4.5 seconds .

[d3mon]

Originally Posted by suhaas307

With respect to tunability, I reserve my opinion as I am unaware of G force figures achievable in FWD cars vis a vis RWD cars. Oh by the way, at the recent drag events, some tuning houses were able to achieve the impossible with various FWD cars such as the Polo GTI and the Laura TSI. I'm not sure if they managed sub 6 second times to 100, but they did create quite a stir.

Max-G forces for FWD / RWD during acceleration can is a simple computation as shown in the videos below. The load transfer to rear wheels during acceleration helps RWD, while hurting FWD quite a bit.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjQIH_M5R3w

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dM5_rOKpnBw

While you will find any number of videos showing 5 sec 0-100 for BMWs or other RWD cars, finding one for Stage 2/3 FWD Octavia RSs/ Golf GTI or Polo GTIs is almost impossible. All you end up finding are 100-200 or 100-250 drags, which are impressive in their own right, but they just prove that those 0-100 timings are just embarrassing for any car putting down 300-400BHP. No tuner quote a 0-100 time for their packages on these platforms - because those improvements are almost non-existent. They see wheelspin almost all the way up to 80-100KMPH and are completely traction limited. There's a reason why the Golf R is AWD, and that's to put down 300 BHP on the ground effectively at launch.

And about the drag prepped GTIs & Octavias, most of them run super sticky race compound tyres that give them much better traction than street tyres. The fact that they were using drag slicks to duck under 6 sec mark would not surprise me either.

[arighna.dutta]

Originally Posted by suhaas307

I am an average driver, and an average driver would be able to exploit the vRS 245 to a far greater degree than a rear-wheel-drive car.

Interesting point, can you please elaborate the above a bit?

Oh, and also - this pricing will ensure that used vRS 230s would
hold their value far better and for far longer. Bad news overall if you are an enthusiast on a tight budget.

Another Toyota Innova kind of story.

[AMG Power]

Skoda Octavia vRS takes on BMW 330i:

In the following pretty accurate comparo between the 330i and the vRS, "the BMW 330i has been softened and for India it has been softened further which makes it loose. The body control is less, it moves around, there's a bit of floatiness, the steering precision isn't as good as it used to be. You feel the looseness in the chassis, the precision isn't there anymore and that is something the vRS has.

The BMW is better in fit and finish, luxury, quality of materials are certainly superior the way the entire car is put together is at a completely different level."

As he finishes - " the vRS delivers even more of that thrill of driving that you can't put into numbers or figures but is judged by the smile on your face.."

BMW have lost the plot after the E 90 in terms of handling, high speed stability, cornering, body control with their 3's. It doesn't inspire confidence at high speeds and is a big disappointment.

Remember this comparo is with vRS 230.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=GpUsJnb6V28

However, one issue which customers will face with the vRS 245 will be these low profile tyres. But then, this car is for enthusiasts. If you're buying it for an office commute, it could turn out to be a mistake.

[porsche_guy]

Zac Hollis confirms that the vRS 245 would be available for booking only through the official website


This seems to be a first of a kind arrangement. I feel it's only going to do good as no dealer can block a lot of cars thus preventing any monopoly that might be a result of it.

(Source: Twitter)

[SnS_12]

Originally Posted by AMG Power

Skoda Octavia vRS takes on BMW 330i:

In the following pretty accurate comparo between the 330i and the vRS, "the BMW 330i has been softened and for India it has been softened further which makes it loose. The body control is less, it moves around, there's a bit of floatiness, the steering precision isn't as good as it used to be. You feel the looseness in the chassis, the precision isn't there anymore and that is something the vRS has.

The BMW is better in fit and finish, luxury, quality of materials are certainly superior the way the entire car is put together is at a completely different level."

As he finishes - " the vRS delivers even more of that thrill of driving that you can't put into numbers or figures but is judged by the smile on your face.."

BMW have lost the plot after the E 90 in terms of handling, high speed stability, cornering, body control with their 3's. It doesn't inspire confidence at high speeds

This comparo is with the F30, which leaves a lot to be desired. But the issues with the F30 had have been ironed out in the G20 and it now has the same engine in a slightly higher state of tune.

Plus the RS230 was launched with a price south of 25 lacs ex showroom, but the 36 lac ex showroom price tag for the RS245 is the biggest negative.

[itwasntme]

It will be great if an existing RS230 owner can drive the G20 330 and revisit this video review. Any takers?

[AMG Power]

Short answer by someone who accurately reviews cars: